8yo boy - is this behaviour NORMAL..??

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So DS has just turned 8yo, and he's becoming IMPOSSIBLE.

He's confrontational, grumpy, stroppy, argumentative, he contradicts EVERYTHING I SAY. Me: Oh look, the sun is out. Him: No it's not. ALL DAY, ABOUT EVERYTHING. It's almost impossible to actually carry on a conversation with him, as it's exhausting.

He cannot say he's sorry, he won't take responsibility for ANYTHING, accept that he's wrong, or caused an accident or anything like that, he claims he can't do things for himself - or simply WON'T do anything for himself, and freaks out when we lay down rules about what he's expected to do (make his bed, pour his own milk on his cereal - small stuff).

He's rude, he talks back, says things like "I'm not talking to you," if I intervene in an argument with his younger brother. He still has major meltdowns over stuff, mainly when we make him do something he doesn't want to do.

I suspect he just needs to get back to school - it's not normal to spend SO MUCH TIME WITH YOUR PARENTS! But he's always been on the grumpy, contrary side, and it's just getting worse.

Maybe I've ruined him, and I'm just a rubbish parent...? Maybe he's just a bit of an a*hole??? Or maybe this is just normal growing up stuff?

I feel so depressed about it. Noone else, at school, or Beavers or anywhere, has ever said he's rude etc, so I think it's just at home. And I know this is normal. But why is he so foul all the time??

He's probably just becoming a normal preteen a'hole but I think he does need to be taught responsibility. He sounds like his personality is quite oppositional so I think the best would just be to set consequences... eg if he won't tidy his room you clear everything that isn't in a safe place away and ACTUALLY DO IT. The low level argumentative stuff I'd deal with humorously eg arguing the sun is up just jokingly reply 'oh my mistake that massive yellow thing in the sky must be pikachu then' You can make a joke out of most things and humour/playfulness is one of the things that is frequently used in therapeautic/positive parenting. I'd just try and stay calm with him and give him clear and logical consequences to unacceptable behaviour but try and avoid being too confrontational and authoritative about it. My LO is only a toddler so we're not quite here yet so I hope some people with kids your age reply too xx

My stroppy pre-teen has now grown into a perfectly reasonable adult, but I'd say Jannt86's response is spot on. Humour and not-raising-to-it for general low-level grumpiness and contrariness, and then real consequences for actual rudeness or disobedience.

Ds went through a phase between 9 and 13 or so where it was basically like walking around with your own personal little rain cloud. The world was a miserable place, everything we said was wrong or ill-informed, I was a harridan oppressing his poor dad (who I don't think ever noticed he was being oppressed, but there you go), there was no point in trying hard with anything whether school work or hobbies, or in trying to do good and make the world a better place (you're not Nelson Mandela!).

Part of it was genuine unhappiness (some pretty difficult stuff was going on in the family and a potential threat to his own health) but a lot of it, I suspect, was just preteen hormones. And the sense of frustration and helplessness which goes with wanting independence but either not being allowed or not being old enough to actually handle it.

The family still remembers with a certain amount of satisfaction the day we took him to the beach but he was so grumpy he refused to explore with the rest of us but just sat straight down in the water- on a sea anemone!

The upside is, you really enjoy the pleasanter people they grow into. Ds was definitely someone who was simply better suited to adult life. He now has a pretty boring life, I would say, working in a tiring and badly paid job and having to keep his social life to a minimum to protect his family- but he takes it all with good humour and is always cheerful and polite. Who'd have thought it?!

I came on here to see if anyone is going through what I am! I have an 8 year old that his behaviour and meltdowns are out of control. He has monumental meltdowns and can be violent and aggressive. He can be tearful and grumpy whereas normally he is good natured, sociable, fun and caring.

I am not a bad parent despite my son yelling “your a f*** awful parent”. I am sure you are not either. Awful parents don’t tend to beat themselves up and look for answers and wonder what we can do to help.

Please read about a thing that kids go through at around age 8 called adrenarche. It’s basically the start of puberty and although there may not be any noticeable physical changes it’s the growth and development their hormones and brains are going through. I felt better than I have in months reading about this. It fits! It makes sense! It is normal! I have had moments thinking this is not normal. And yes his behaviour wasn’t but it looks like there’s all these changes going on and sometimes it’s like a red mist goes over him. It may not be what is the matter with my son or with yours but please take from this I know what your going through. I know the mental exhaustion from dealing with it and I know the frustration of why can’t he just try and behave, or why can’t he just listen or why is he pressing all my buttons to really wind me up! No one can like him!!! Good luck!

www.parents.com/kids/development/adrenarche-and-puberty-everything-you-need-to-know/

Children can be a battle, all day every day. It is very easy to give in during a meltdown, tantrum or not pick them up on little things because they don't really matter and you could do without another argument.

However if you don't win all of these small battles the child learns that they can behave this way and you will let it go, or give in and let them have what they want. Worse still, that if you stand up to them or tell them off they become louder or even more naughty as it is a battle of wills and they know you will give in.

When we foster children they almost always come to us with all of the traits you have mentioned. It is very difficult initially as they don't even hold eye contact, believe or respect anything you are telling them.

However with a good amount of praise for everything they do right and consistent removal of their favourite things electronics/treats/toys when they are naughty as well as an explanation why you are doing it, they will start to follow the rules. It is very important to explain why, so they understand and can apply that rule in the future to similar situations, so you aren't having constant battles.

We all have days when we cant be bothered with a petty argument with a child and I understand why any parent thinks I will just give them what they want so they are quiet. They can be frustrating, infuriating and non stop 16 hours a day every day.

However the reality is if you are consistent in the removal of their favourite things when they are naughty, all the time every time. They are far more interested in getting them back rather than being naughty and every day you stick to your guns, there will be less resistance from them.

It is hard initially but eventually they stop pushing back, they accept the rules and it results in a far more loving, respectful relationship for both of you.

I'd add to what Tacca said that removal of favourite objects is not the only possible way of dealing effectively with bad behaviour. I don't think we ever did that unless there was a logical connection to the misbehaviour. My parents didn't do it either and again their discipline was very effective. It's one possible way.

What does matter is that they don't get the impression that you're scared of their tantrums and will give in for that reason. They must never feel that they can intimidate you.

That does not, however, mean that every battle must be fought. A good many battles can be avoided altogether. Sometimes they can be reasoned with (as long as you stay calm and won't give in). Sometimes just a firm No or a stern look is more impressive than a set punishment. A lot of the time it is possible to exercise a little ingenuity and work out a way in which you can both save your rule and let them save face. Teaching them how to reach a win-win is a great life lesson.

My ds has long since reached the age where I can't make him obey me any more. He is bigger and stronger than me and I can't take anything from him because he probably paid for it. But he will almost always do as I want anyway because (and he's said this repeatedly) he trusts me to be reasonable. He has gone to a lot of trouble during the pandemic- and made a good few sacrifices- because he knows I'm someone who doesn't overreact and that I also understand his side of things.