11 week old feeds all the time and doesnt nap at all - need a routine?

[Liska]

Am b feeding my dd on demand, and she still feeds about every 2 hours during the day. I could cope with that, but I'm having a hellish time getting her to nap at all in between times. She gets tired, and I watch her like a hawk for cues that she is getting sleepy, and then try and rock her to sleep, but she fights sleep really hard, and all the rocking/singing things that used to send her off just don't anymore.

After I have walked her round the room for what seems like an age her I want to sleep cry turns into an hungry cry, so I feed her. Sometimes this sends her to sleep, and I am getting to the point where I am not sure if she is actually hungry or is just using the feed as a way to get to sleep.

In the evenings she cluster feeds (actually she just feeds constantly for three hours or so) and then goes down for about 4 - 5 hours. After that feed though, she is up and down for the rest of the night, and the more tired I get the more likely I am to feed her rather than judge whether she is actually hungry or just can't settle herself back to sleep (at night she always falls asleep while feeding).

In the day I am in the habit of putting her in her pram if she naps - that way if she does start to wake, I can push her backwards and forwards to keep her asleep for a bit. That only works if she falls asleep feeding, or being walked around (not likely these days). If I put her in the pram when she is only sleepy she just screams (unless we go out for a walk, when it will take her at least 20 minutes to drift off).

Part of the problem is definitely that she tries to fend off sleep - she seems to not want to miss anything! But the frequent feeding and the constant walking her around are exhausting me, which is a shame cos when she is doing neither and is playing/chatting she is a happy little star

I had hoped to start trying to get a routine together around 12 weeks, and had been told Baby Whisperer is good, but how can I try when she feeds so frequently and naps so little? Or is this normal?

Sorry for long post - am tired and emotional...

I'm no expert on this (mine slept lots but wouldn't eat at that age!) but I didn't want you to slip down the list without an answer...

it sounds like you are doing very well in difficult but by no means unusual circimstances. is there someone who could walk her round in the pushchair to get her to sleep while you have a break/sleep?

I tried they baby whisperer by the way and it worked well when she was very tiny. I switched to GF at about 5 months which sorted out most of her feeding and sleeping problmes then but I wouldn't/couldn't have gone so structured right from the start.

I hope you get better advice soon. good luck and congratulations on your dd xx

entropy - thanks for taking pity on me (I'm sure my lengthy post put people off!) dh being v. helpful tonight avoiding anything too structured like gf. will keep riding it out...

Hi Liska. This has certainly brought back memories! I had the EXACT situation with my DS (who is now 2) He fed at least every 2 hrs for at least 50 minutes each time and refused to nap in his cot (which for me was the worst bit). I ended up always walking him after a feed - often for more than hour, great for me but it got exhausting. I turned to the Baby W and become a convert. It really worked for us.

I took it very slowly at first, and ignored the cluster and dream feed, just cause he wasn't into that so I didn't see the point starting something else new. Night time I lived by the rule (and still do!) that you do whatever it takes for you to get sleep in the night. He was in bed with us for the first 9 or 10 weeks and then I'd let him fall asleep feeding and pop him into his moses basket -this took a few good weeks to master and he;d last about 4 or 5 hours.

I would suggest that you take it slowly - I used to feed him, poke him gently awake (he always fell asleep) and then read stories or play for a short time. He'd start crying a bit when he was tired and then I'd take him into a dark room, swaddle him tightly and rock him gently with some quiet singing. I know you're not supposed to rock them but it worked for us in terms of starting the process. This took a week or two for him to get it....but so worth all the hard work. He slept less than he did in his pram when we were walking but he napped more regularly this way and was certainly better rested.

Just take it one step at at time and then you'll be able to extend the periods up to the 2 hour mark. Be prepared to stay home based for a few weeks to get it worked out - I decided that that was the only way and you do miss out on the spontaneous activites but it does pay off. I'm still pretty like that now (DS still naps in his cot every day) but he is still sleeping for up to 2 hrs every day and I totally put this down to the BW approach. Yes, you have to be a bit more structured and I did sometimes feel that I was tied into something when the other mums were out and about, but saying that he sleeps brilliantly (apart from illnesses, teeth and at the moment seagulls!!) and so in the big scheme I would far rather know I was going to get a good night's sleep!

You will get there - check out their website too, I found that really helpful. Sorry, this has gone on and one!! Hope you manage - good luck.

Thank you so much! Really appreciate the time and detail you took. Will go out and buy BW tomorrow and see how it goes. And being home based will be worth it if we can get things on a more even keel.

bf advice is crap in BW though
Buy a good sling my life changed when I bought a Coorie my 3 wk old non napping ds suddenly became a good sleeper

haha! just ordered a karri me today. maybe that will sort it. (I had tried a babybjorn, but she hates it cos she cant see out). fingers crossed.

sounds like my little one too. although now at 15 weeks is better at feeding (although had constant ups and downs. i too recommend the BW and just always think feed, wake time, sleep time so if has fed and been awake for awhile he must be sleepy and i know he will fight it and fight it but i try anything and it usually works - rocking, lying in bed with him, out in the pram - anything but i must make him nap or he is impossible to feed - it makes him so cranky. the other great advice i was given by my HV was to swaddle and a dummy - didnt like it at first i felt like i was putting him in a straightjacket and gagging him but it made him calm and relaxed him - came to realise he liked it and it really helped. the feeding side for me settled so maybe it will for you to
good luck

I used to swaddle when she was new, and it definitely helped her sleep, but she kicks so much now (and is really long!). My HV said I shouldnt swaddle once there was a chance of her kicking the blanket off. That said, I only swaddle her in a sheet, as my bedroom is so warm. Maybe I should just buy a bigger sheet

i know what you mean about the kicks - i now use sleeping bag thing which he likes (used to use one and put his arms inside it instead of swaddling) i definately recommend good long walks everyday - even when weather is rubbish - this seems to help with naps. mine now likes to lie with me in bed with my hand on his belly and rubbing his head instead of rocking etc especially when really crying it seems to calm him. also we give a bottle feed at 11pm and this helps him sleep till 5am most nights and i have resorted to formula when i know he has had a nap and is still grumbling but wont bf at all and he is getting in a rage. dont know if helpful at all

Yeah, I always make sure we get out for a good walk every day - as much for me as for her, it helps to keep me sane. I've been putting off getting the grobag thing because its been so hot that she normally goes down in just a vest anyway, but its a good suggestion.

Someone bought me one of those grobag egg things - its a room thermometer that changes colour according to the temperature range. Its permanently on red for dangerously hot, so I've got a bit paranoid about my pfb overheating....

Hello Liska, your post struck a chord.
Just to let you know my dd (now 7 months) was very similar, and I was in a big old panic about routine etc, but in fact there was a bit of a breakthrough at the twelve week mark and she would finally start to nap in the daytime.
My advice to you is to take it gradually and I hope you will notice an improvement; prams/walks/slings all worked too, to some extent.
Like you my dd seemed to resist sleep (as if there was some big party going on that she didn't want to miss, the silly thing )
Now - miracle of miracles - the little blighter sleeps through the night - hoorah! And naps in the day - mostly.
I am chronically disorganised and can categorically state that none of this is down to me.

Its funny - I can remember hating bedtime as a small child because I always thought I must be missing out on something. Perhaps its karma

Really appreciate the encouragement, guys. I feel as if I should sort out a routine to make both our lives easier, and I am worried about her not napping, but I too am disorganised and a bit slapdash, so am hoping to reach a compromise. Thats why BW appeals - I could perhaps adapt the ideas without having to stick to the clock??

am also disorganised which is why BW appealed to me but dd found us a routine which by 16wks was so similar to gf it was uncanny! I don't stick to gf routine very closely at all. but it is still touch wood working for us.

at 11wks she woke at 7, bf til 8. play til 9. sleep 9 til 11 (sorry, she was good at that bit) then repeat same 4h cycle til evening when cluster feeding started and then the colicky screaming... BUT 4h breast feeding, although what she was "demanding" wasn't doing the trick and she lost oodles of weight...

forgot about miricle that was swadling. she would thrash about with what HV said was colic until i perfected the superswaddle! took her til she was about 16wks to be able to break out as I recall, Also as others have said the sling was a godsend. still is and she is nearly 11months old, can't stay awake for more than 10 mins in it!!! its a ring sling btw but I think its the motion of your walk that does it not the specific sling.

My goodness this is bringing back memories and its less than a year ago! write down how you are feeling. you think you will never forget but hormones intervine and it all becomes a blur.

Hi Liska. I have a DD who is now 7 months. For the first few months of her life, she was very colicky and unsettled and didn't seem to sleep much at all. She could go for up to 10 hours without sleeping - I don't think the HVs used to believe me when I told them until my mum witnessed it as well.

I don't have much advice to give, but I did want to let you know that they do - eventually - sort themselves out with napping and sleeping better at night. DD has been sleeping through the night since she was roughly 3-4 months old (with the occasional bad night thrown in just to remind us how shite the first few weeks with a new baby can be!). Daytime naps took longer to sort out, but she generally now goes down for about 2 hours in the day, and has done since she was about 5 months. It will get easier, just look after yourself, and get through this difficult period.

TBH, the support makes all the difference - I really appreciate it. Its nice to know that it will improve with age and I just have to get through it.

And guess what? This morning she fed at 6. Then dh took her at 7 as usual, but as he isnt working he didnt bring her back at 8 as expected. I woke up at 10!!! And she was fine. Because I wasnt there (with my breasts) she hadnt asked to be fed at all. And she had napped because he had rocked her in her pushchair while not making eye contact (working on his computer actually). She actually didnt ask for food till 10.30, so thats a four and a half hour gap.

So I think some very long walks are in order. At least I'll drop the last of the baby weight that way (hopefully).