help! my ds 6 keeps beating me up

[olliebird]

this bad behaviour is not going to go away, sometimes its just at tap, at other times its a full on assault (part of a temper tantrum because I haven't done what he wants). I have the buises to prove it. He attacked my dh at the weekend because he was told off and after 10 treats of a smack he gave him a smack on the hand and at this my ds stopped lashing out. It seemed to work but is this because he doesn't get hit so he was just surprised? Is it ok to smack a boy of 6 to stop him beating you up? Is it adviseable? Any other good ideas?

I have tried pinning him on the floor but his starts chocking saying he will be sick. Ive tried locking him out of kitchen but he starts bashing the door down - seems to get him even more worked up. Threats of removal of toys don't seem to work because he doesn't take it in (he's in such a state he can't seem to hear).

Currently trying to preempt with lots of hugging and praise.

has he always been allowed to attack you?

I think you might well need a professional assesment

I certainly wouldn't pin down a child without being told how

have you ever taught him breathing techniques? try a yoga class .. he is obviously losing it and needs to find a way to regain control .. I think 6 might be rather late .. but try to teach him deep breaths in and deep breaths out

maybe i'm exagerating. we're talking about pukmmeling with fists, kicking, threatening to bite, whilst in a 'state' (temper flaring). What many boys of this age do, as other mums complain to me of similar stuff. In the past I had ways of stopping him, but now he's bigger and stronger and more of a force to be reconed with.

olliebird,
my dd in the last week started doing similar things to me. i haven't thought in my life this would happen to me, she would do like that.
it is very upsetting isn't it?

yes, but I think its very normal/common. I remember my near teenage sister breaking my mums rib. It seems kids like to push as far as they can and almost want to get into a physical fight. Somtimes when they do hit you (not hard) you can humour them out of their anger with a play fight, but this is maybe not so good if you feel they have gone too far and have hurt you.

I don't think it's normal. You need to understand why he is so angry. He is expressing himself thro' violence. Have you any ideas why he explodes like this?

she is 6 yrs old and strong.
i cant put her in naughty corner anything, i cant grab and carry her there.
i take away her toy but then she is left with not much.
i got hurt last night from my back and it really scared me.
i know why she is angry but i dont agree that she gets her way all the time.
it is really tough job.
i started reading again the book 'how to talk so kids will listen...'
good luck to us.

If there is any circumstance where smacking a child could be condoned, I would say this is it.

"Stop hitting mummy or she will hit back". Obviously not full force. I think it might help him understand how it feels to be hit.

It is not a bad lesson to learn that people you attack might feel like hitting back, anyway.

To restrain(according to HV who helped my mum with my brothers and which I have used on my ds same prob right up to age 11/12)
Take his hands and cross his arms in front of him while pulling him onto your lap facing away from you.Tell him that you love him very much but it is time to calm down.Hold him until he stops fighting to get away then say if you stop hitting(etc)then mummy will let you go.When you've let go tell him that he hurt you and show him the brusies.Repeat that you love him but that hitting is not a nice thing to do and that if he feels like hitting things he must go to his room and hit his pillow.
It takes some of the pressure off of you and you won't get hurt so much.If he screams etc. then scream back louder it shocks them into listening.If he cries this is a good sign.It means that he doesn't really know what he has done.
It does get better and if used repeatedly then they start doing the pillow thing without you having to tell them.Also try omega 3&6 stuff and see your doc and get help.
Good luck.Hope things improve.

Not read the rest of the thread, but it seems to me that you need to make your understand your displeasure and underlining how much you disapprove of trying to get one;s way by violent.

For this reason, I would very heavily caution against hitting him back, as it would give all the wrong signals. I do not knwo what you normally do to punish him- naughty corner? Naughty stair? time out in room for x minutes? Withdrawal of privileges?

It seems to me that timeout in his room for x number of minutes, letting him out only if he apologises explicitly for what he did wrong (ie- I am sorry for hitting you Mummy) would be the best reaction, and withdrawing things if he refuses to apologise (ie accept what he has done wrong) is by far the best raction. He is not too young to understand any of this.

Also, his dad has to underline to him how wrong it is to hit. It cannot be OKK for one person, but not for another, as any child seeing that violence works where other things do not will almost invariably gravitate to violence to get things done. It seems to me that shocking him by suddenly withdrawing attention from him might be just as effective as any kind of smacking response. As would ostentatiously putting a toy of his into a black plastic binbag and putting out for the bin men.

The tantrums, I'll wager, are his first line of getting what he wants, followed by anger, followed by hitting. He has to start to use more words and less action to negotiate his way. By refusing ot be sucked into his tantrum, you will be helping him. He is not 2, he is 6. He needs to learn to be more social; oral negotiation is the civilised way of obtaining this.

Next issue is why your husband asked him to get off him and was ignored 10 times, which led to that situation you described. Maybe he is feeling a little neglected emotionally by your husband ans was seeking attention? Perhaps he needs some organised father-son activities to defuse some of that very real need for physical horsing around, and male bonding experiences? Does your local judo club have a parent and child session? That could be an excellent opportunity for them both to do something fun together. You may need to organise it for them! (I peak from experience...)

Good luck.

Sorry for multiple typos...

I have the same issues only worse and today at the local shopping centre ti happened just becasue I said 'come on ds, we are goingt o a different shop' and ti was a health food shop we were leaving nothing exciting. But my ds is the same height as me and this is happeneing on a weekly bais more an dmore did nto use to happen maybe only 3 times a year but he was little.
People say to go to gp but will they just try and find a syndome for him to be labelled by or do you actually get anger management for kids? sorry to highjack your thread , my ds is 8

sorry for happened to you Jennylee.
because of that i dread going out with her then we have a miserable life.
i have read some useful ideas on this thread and sorry for hijacking.
and also i read on some other thread that some schools have anger management help.
i hope everything will be better for us.
xxx

I certainly don't think it's adviseable to hit him. This time he was shocked, and stopped, but that won't be the case next time and then before you know it you are simply engaged in a physical fight with your six year old.

Pinning him down I simply wouldn't do. As his parent you need to role model that we calm down and sort things out with words, not physical force.

I think a child who is this angry (at 6, I'm not talking about toddlers who do get angry like this!) needs some help with it.

Can you look at the way you talk to him. when you say he was 'told off' before the last flare up; what for? How was he told off? I wonder if there's a chance that there are signs you're missing that show he is getting angry.

What often makes kids angry is a feeling of lack of control, or unfairness. Is there any way you can include him more, get him involved in decisions more, ask his opinion more?

I think what you're doing with the hugging and praise is great and far more likely to work than smacking. What's the general atmosphere like at home?

My ds (9)also tends to 'hit out' at us, although he has got a bit better lately - hopefully maturity is making a difference. I generally try to give him as much love and hugs as I can and I know that he is really sorry when he calms down. I think you just have to ride it out.

olliebird ~ sorry you are going through this. However I have to say this is not normal/common behaviour at all.
I would absolutely not accept this behaviour and probably talk to your hv, gp or whoever else to get help.

I think it happens more than people are willing to admit.

turquoisenights thanks for your post, the school told me that the gp will refer him quicker, am just worried about getting him labelled as violent as at all other time he is lovely and cuddly and funny and sweet. But will probabyl do the gp thing as can't imagine this in an older child would become a real bad problem if it does not stop.
We can't let him out to play unsupervised as he flares up if slighted or hit and it ends up the same.

At school, it is a new school he only goes an hour and a half as i was home edding still am and they are worried about break times queuing in mornings etc at new school as these are flash points if anyoen messes with him or he thinks they have, he got bullied at school previously and that has a lot to do with it.

I agree its probably not normal and but I imagine its not that unusual.

singingmum - very helpful advise I will try it. Just worry about giving attention after a tantrum. I have tried non-coperation (ie i won't do anything you ask me for five mins after a tantrum) and this does seem to work sometimes.

duchesse - thanks for very interesting comments, yes dad does need to do more with ds. I can't send him to his room because this turns into a fight as he doesn't go, or put a toy out because we would end up having a fight on the doorstep as I try to do this. I have ended up locking myself in a room to escape him!

Trouble seems to be that when a child is in a real 'state' they are not able to listen. So if you were to say I'm going to throw all your toys away, this wouldn't be a deterrent because they don't seem to have heard. I do literally throw him out of the kitchen and then hold the door - however this seems to make him even more livid, so starting to question things that raise the anger levels. Putting a toy in attic will work but not when he's in such a state he doesn't hear me.

On a more positive note, I have been doing lots of reading with him and he hasn't lost it this week, so maybe more attention will help. Also been trying to go on and on about his good behaviour.

I have also been told to vocalise his anger for him - so i say 'I know you are really angry that I won't get your toy for you but...' and I repeat it a few times. This does seem to help.

hg - Normally temper starts with him saying 'mum pick that up' and I say no, ie I don't comply with his requests. Perhaps I need to be less direct and less confrontational, so give all the reasons why I can't do what he wants and then say I would prefer not to. Perhaps he feels he has lost face.

think i need to get a bit more organised with my treats and punishments, pocketmoney etc.

its very interesting to hear from others going through the same.

ollie, I think you're right, maybe with him it is to do with losing face and being made to feel 'small'; maybe you could choose your words really carefully so as to make him feel more equal?

Also, it reads like he may be a boy (like many others IME) who really respond to fairness and justice and being DEAD clear where they stand. So yes, try being totally routine and firm with the treats and the pocket money so that he feels sure of the nice stuff; that it will happen at such and such a time.

And I know it's only one example, but do you always say no to getting or picking up toys for him? I sometimes get ds toys from upstairs when he's capable of doing it himself. I do it because it's a nice thing to do and I want ds to know that in families we do nice things for each other; it's not all "you want it, you get it"! I think he accepts more happily that when I say no it's for good reason or it's just his turn! Ignore me if I'm on the wrong track here.

Best of luck, it sounds like you are sorting things anyway!

HG
thanks thats helpful. I do run around for him quite a bit, but you ahve made me think that perhaps its not clear to him why sometimes I won't - sometimes its because I'm fed up being treated like a servant and say no because i've picked something up for the nth time but mostly because I'm in the middle of doing something and its not convenient. So perhaps I need to explain a bit more.

I suppose there's still a bit of 'if mum loves me she will fulfill my every need' and when you don't comply they feel unloved which confuses them, which leads to anger (like in 2year old).

ollie, glad it was helpful. I think that sounds like you've hit on something; it's that thing of boys needing to know where they stand. So yes, I think explaining why you're not doing something that you sometimes do at other times can't hurt...best of luck!

you sound like a great mum,

I must say i disagree with the "more equal" stance. i am he parent, this relationship is unequal. i often say to my children " i neve did sayt his was a democracy. this is a matriarchy. its me or social services."

i am not very "new mum" about discipline tactics, but i recognise that we all must use different techniques according to our lifestyle and children.

therefore that being said i do shout, i do withhold stuff - like everything from playstations to tv, to going out with friends. i do make threats. i do dish chores as punishments i have in the past smacked - although this isn't necessary anymore ( or acceptable it seems today)

trick is not to give in. which sounds like your weakness.

the last time my daughter spoke to me with utter contempt i threw a glass of cold water over her. i didn't shout i simply said " how dare you.

my kids know - its me who works, me who buys stuff, everything has a value, its not free, life is hard and i should be respected for the lifestyle i have afforded them.

they have been told - its my way or social services dear - although maybe not at 6 YO maybe around 10. at 6 yo its do as i say or stay in your room.

i am no ones friend i am a parent. my job is to raise human beings who will function in society. not kick off when the vending machine doesn't work.

actually custardo I do agree with you that it's an unequal relationship. The child needs to know that it is, in order to feel secure - they need to know that you're in charge, basically.

My point is I suppose better worded as choosing words carefully so as to make the child feel RESPECTED rather than equal. Not to misuse the power of being a parent by making them feel belittled.

Ollie I have had this problem too, ds is only 2 though, and I have used time out. I guess he is doing this from pure frustration, Can you try and get him to talk about his feelings or get him to use other ways to express his feelings.

My Ds is much better now, it's taken a couple of months, I personally wouldn't hit back as it's the same thing but strong management and consistency are needed.