Disruptive 4year Old-ASD?

[MrsCasserole]

Hello,
I'm new to mumsnet and need some advice/help!

I don't know where to start really, my son turned 4 in June and started school this September and already my husband and I have been called into school to meet with his teacher and Senco. He is struggling at school and has began to be disruptive. I have had several phone calls regarding his behaviour. For example all the children were in the cloakroom pushing and shoving to get their shoes and coats on, when my DS couldn't handle it and hit another pupil around the head with his shoe.

The teacher (and myself) thinks he cant handle the large number of children there, if he's not sure on how to handle the situation he will push and shove and knock over towers. He cant seem to handle the 'freeplay' so they have tried to put a bit more structure in his day.

When I look at symptoms for Autism he just doesn't tick all the boxes, so I don't know if he is just naughty or theres something there.

Going back a few years he has always been disruptive, the childminder had serious issues with him where he would have meltdowns, kick, scratch and lash out so the childminder used to restrain him.

Then at pre school he was excluded for bad behaviour, he tried to run off so they had to carry him back to pre school where he proceeded to again lash out.

He hates being centre of attention and gets embarrassed easily so when he does have these meltdowns it gets 10 x worse if others are looking at him/telling him off.

At home he doesn't have a lot of meltdowns, he can play really lovely with his sister, he has a great imagination and he is obsessed with his cars. He can be a little devil sometimes and will have a tantrum, and throws things when he gets frustrated.

I guess I'm just looking for advice from anyone will children who has ASD. If my son shows any traits of ASD. Im worried that he will be thrown out of school if he carries on. He has good days and bad days. School have said they are going to observe him and put the necessary support in place for him and that children don't usually get diagnosed with anything until they are 7. Think were in for a rocky road with his schooling.

Thanks for reading, any advice welcome! :-)

This sounds a bit like my own DS when he started school, he was diagnosed with Asperger's a year later. The school got support for him and made adaptations - including simple ones like giving him a coat peg at the end of the row so he was less crowded, and me bringing in a beanbag for him to sit on at carpet time so he could wriggle into it without disturbing the others, and the teacher putting two toys in his basket and telling him to choose one when the other children had free choice of toys because DS's solution to the overwhelming problem of free choice was to look at what someone else was playing with and snatch it!

He did need close supervision especially at playtime for a very long time and an eye kept in class. But he did well in school and is having a whale of a time at university. My DS did not "tick all the boxes" either but when he was assessed in depth we found a whole load of boxes that I had no idea about, especially to do with communication. He was one of those little-professor types with a very advanced vocabulary and a lot of fun one-to-one with an adult but he could not do all the subtle things that he needed to get on with other children, such as notice when it was his turn to speak, or recognising how and when to ask to join in a game.

Try not worry about the school. They sound pretty supportive and most schools would much rather have a child with an autism-spectrum diagnosis and the support that brings, plus the understanding of how to deal with it, than a challenging child that no-one knows how to manage! My DS did very well in school despite ups and down in his behaviour, with the help that was provided as a result.

Also, while your DS might be young for a diagnosis that doesn't necessarily mean he wont get one. It varies from place to place but you don't always need to wait for the school. My DS's school told me to go to the GP and ask for a referral via the NHS, while they made a referral to the educational pscychologist and see which came up soonest! Some areas only support one or the other but there's no harm going to your GP and asking.

Thank you for your reply Kleinzeit, I guess we just have to wait and see how his behaviour goes.

That's interesting to hear that your DS didn't tick all of the boxes either, he does sound very similar to my DS. Especially the supervision at playtime, that's a time when he cant really cope. I used to think he had some sort of anger problems as he lashes out all the time.

My DS now has to have his coat in a box that's away from the cloakroom, I just worry hes going to have a hard time at school. He has 1 or 2 friends, and I am noticing hes not taking part in a lot of activities, in case he has a meltdown. I just don't want him feeling on his own but I think he quite likes playing by himself and he doesn't seem bothered at all that he hasn't taken part. For example he came home saying the class was playing with the parachute but he didn't want to join in so the teacher let him play on the bikes instead-which he thought was great!

I did take him to the GP when he was excluded from Pre-School but the Paediatrician declined to see him :-( I guess I have to trust the schools judgement and time will tell!

Thank you

People are to quick to label a child, kids will be kids

I'm worried about my son too. He is 3 1/2 and started the school nursery at the beginning of September and since starting I have been pulled aside every day nearly to discuss his random agressiveness towards the other children. They have asked me to get him referred by a gp for his behaviour (the gp didn't want to as he said he was too young but sent the referral anyway)

He is very clever, perhaps was a little late in talking and potty training but still within normal time. He loves puzzles and cars and stories. He's not a massive fan of sudden noises and does put his hands over his ears or lash out at noisy children or when people are crying.

The teacher says he is quite disruptive and pulls displays down off the walls, I've been asked to reduce him to a half day and he is not allowed to stay for lunch anymore as this seems to be the worst time of the day. the teacher said he she takes him off by himself and when it's quiet he's very helpful but still very flighty and doesn't concentrate long.

The main worry is he's hurting the other children, the teacher says she doesn't think his apology is genuine when he is made to say sorry and it doesn't stop him from doing it again.

On top of this he's been unwell since starting I think he caught a cold his first day there - we've been in a&e with a suspected dose of viral asthma and last week he was covered in hives for 2 days. I've kept him off this week hoping he'll shake the illness and behave a bit better.
I'm not sleeping worrying about it all the time, dreadfully behind at work and making stupid mistakes I just can't seem to focus on anything else I just want him to settle in a bit better 😢

Mine had a few things in nursery and reception but things really went wrong when he went into year one. He struggles in crowds and large groups of children. He got autism diagnosis last March age 6. What have school said about their thoughts on asd?

Scaredparent- if he's got asd he's got asd, it's not a label. If he hasn't he wont get a diagnosis, it's not just a case of asking and getting a label

I am in this same position. My son had problems in nursery and these have ramped up in reception. What have your school suggested MrsCasserole?

I am currently having weekly meetings with the school. A play therapist is going to be helping my son improve his social skills and how to play with the other children. They have referred for a behavioural assessment and are also bringing in support from an autism service they link with. Basically they are throwing everything they can at him.

I know all schools have different approaches and different services at their disposal. But I would always push a school on these as often provision is woeful. And if you wait it out you can find yourself years down the line in an even worse position.

I think it depends what you mean by not ticking all the boxes. Autism is an Umbrella term and all presentations are different. Research triad of impairment as this will give you a guide. You say he has a good imagination- if this focuses on one area like his obsession or is copied from somewhere else this would still 'count' as difficulties with imagination.

It's great you have school supporting you as they will see different things to what you do and can make referrals to specialist services if more assessment is needed.