8y temper and swearing

[barnetbarnet]

Hello
My 8y boy has just had a massive hissy fit at the local footy club he goes to go. It was cold and wet today but instead of getting on with it, it was a massive temper. This temper resulted in him calling me names and swearing front of the other parents and kids, plus hitting and kicking me.

I have two questions -
1- What is the correct 'immediate' punishment for such behaviour? I anticipated this behaviour, as its happened before, so had warned him of the treats he'd get if hes good or the treats he'll lose if naughty.

2- what would you really think of the single parent (me) dealing with it? Only one parent friend backed me up - the others just watched and stared.

3- what do you think of the child?

1. Removal. Just go home. When everyone is calm, talk through what happened and why and how you can work together to avoid it happening again. Reiterate what treats he is losing and why.

1. I wouldn't really think anything other than, 'we've all been there'. I would not get involved though.

1. If he looks 8, I would probably think he had some SN or other difficulties. If he looks younger I would consider it 'normal' bad behaviour (apart from the swearing).

It's fine for other people not to get involved. There's no need.

Yes immediately go home. No telly Or screens when home. Don't give the poor behaviour any attention or airspace. Just tell him you are disappointed and expect an apology later when he's had time to calm down.

From another angle, why did he have the tantrum and what can you set in place to make a tantrum less likely

When he is calm and had time to reflect, talk things through calmly. Ask him how he thinks you felt when he was hurting you. Ask him what he can plan to do next time to avoid a tantrum. Ask him what would be the best thing to do next time there is a trigger.

You both need to reflect on what you could do differently next time.

You could always punish him to behave but that doesn't deal with the real issue.

What started it -

The footy coach said - go and get a drink so DS got his drink from bag and then wouldn't zip up his bag - it had his clean dry coat in it; it was cold and rainy so would get wet.

I thought -
A) I could zip it up
B) let him zip it up or have a wet coat

I choose B.

He then attacked his brother who was trying to help do up the zip. Then the temper / hissy got started.

My point is - swearing and hitting in public is horrendous and only the. inner circle know what's going on.

When they were younger its was dealt with by time out / naughty step etc at home.

Now he's 8, am I supposed to be sitting him down for 8minutes on his own on the grass until he calms down?

I tried that^. Then I said 'calm down, come to me when you're ready to say sorry' but this stage can potentially last for hours. When I (or anyone else) return to him, we're met with a barrage of verbal abuse. Mean time, his team want him back on the field and they are met with a load of abuse too.

So I should just take him home? But that is not so simple as his younger brother was also playing in another team/game.

Thanks anyway.

Barnet nothing much helpful to add but you could be describing interactions between my ds1 (11) or dt1 (9) and any similar problem altho ds1 is just a total drama queen and will strop loudly about a zip like problem without swearing, but calls down again in an instant whereas dt1 is prone to swearing and losing it big time though and either of them will thump another brother - but not me - who wanders into view irrespective of the other brothers innocence /attempt to help.

I just remind its unacceptable, an over reaction and try and remove the aggressor.

Unmumsnetty hugs.

If your younger child was playing you could pull the 8 year old out of his game (explaining to the coaches), and sit him away on his own and ignore him until younger one is finished. Tell other kids to stay away from him. Then once home you can deal with him.
If he was swearing at other kids their parents might complain to the coaches, but tbh the coaches might have noticed anyway. There is the possibility he could lose his place with that kind of behaviour, you need to warn him of that.

Agree to taking him straight home but staying calm as you do so.
I would see other parents 'backing me up' as interference and would not expect them to get involved. It's your problem not theirs.
Emotions run high at football matches and all that testosterone gets the better of some boys. When you talk to him tell him you understand he gets irritated but that's no excuse for swearing or having a tantrum.

Thanks for the replies but I suppose the question I'm trying to answer is -

If he's jut swearing at me (anywhere - shopping / school / party) what immediate consequence can I deliver?

What would you do if your children started it? Be honest!

Shouting 'do not swear at me you naughty boy!' is frowned upon, and smacking is a no-no.

Ignoring his swearing and removing him to a
quieter place to calm down seems to be the way forward but, you can't always remove them, for a variety of reasons.

So my point being - if parent is subject to embarrassing loud foul language and physical contact by child (hitting / kicking and biting) should I just ignore it and move him away quietly when I can?

Therefore if you see a naughty child having a temper, abusing the parent and the parent is ignoring it - by not obviously punishing he child, is that ok? The number of foul faced parents scared me the other day - looking in disgust at the temper, thinking "I wouldn't let my child speak to me like that!"

Do you see my point?

Any teachers on here - can you advise what you do in class?

Thanks.

You told him to zip his bag. You should have let him reap the natural consequences of not zipping his bag up. Having wet clothes. Then point out nicely when he's putting his wet clothes on 'oh what a shame your clothes got wet. You must feel cold'

Also talk to the coach. Request that he's sends your son off for the rest of the match/club if he is rude to his classmates

How do you speak to him?

Is he constantly defiant? Is there any chance he has SEN?

What's his behaviour like at school?

www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/oppositional-defiant-disorder/basics/symptoms/con-20024559

It doesn't matter what the parents think. Or what their expression is on their faces

You need to deal with it effectively for your sons sake - wether that's by whisking him away quietly or sitting him on a chair for 8 minutes.

Prewarn him and then remind him just before the match that if he's violent or swears, you are both going home straight away. He won't be able to play. Then carry your threat through.

In that scenario, I'd have just got the hell out of there with him. Unfortunate for the sibling playing but I would have got them both out of the public and home. At which point I would have sat Eight year old on naughty step. After eight mins, ask if he understands why on naughty step. Then straight to bed.

I understand your problem about just taking him home because in this case that effectively means punishing his brother. Could you have left his brother and asked another parent to drop him off when finished. If not I would have sat your older son in the car away from all the action.

in this situation I would immediately withdraw, be crystal clear that this is not acceptable behaviour, make him write a letter of apology and remove electronic games for a while (making clear the connection between bad behaviour and their removal)

I would also have a discussion with him afterwards about manners and general behaviour and thinking about others

Who,frowns at shouting at a naughty child? I'd take firmly by hand away from game, activity, party wherever. It would be a firm, authoritative grip and if he fought I'd either drag so fast he had to trot alongside or pick up and carry through screaming ab dabs.
Once somewhere different, the car, the changing room, the foyer of the party venue, I would happily bellow at them. I would make sure they got a very, very clear message. I would do this once. On second occasion they would lose football, the next party, the activity for a week with a reminder as to why. If other child goes to football, I'd take naughty child to watch and get bored.

Thanks for the replies. They're good but, without being rude I can answer each suggestion of why I did / didnt do that but want more feedback to pre arm me for the next encounter!

Another point, I am told often that I need to punish "immediately" - not take them home and punish later that afternoon, a few hours later ( as I had other things to do).

We walked so car wasn't available.
No one able or offered to look after youngest

We waited nearly an hour for him to remove his football boots and put his trainers on, all the time swearing at me each time I asked him to take his boots off/trainers on - "f*ck off idiot" is the current phrase, in front of family members of the team. :-(

So, should I have grabbed him by the arm and dragged him 'screaming and swearing' back home? How would you feel as a passer-by seeing that?? You'd intervene surely?

As it was, he eventually swapped his boots / trainers and we walked, we walked until he said sorry and started being nice. It was a very very long walk.

From asking him to do the zip of his bag up to coming home in a calm and compliant took manner took 4hours. :-( How sad is that.

He's done it before so I anticipated this sort of behaviour so plan for it by outlining my expectations / boundaries and the treats (sofa tv popcorn )for respecting them and the consequences if he fails to meet them (long walk until you say sorry and comply).

Or am I just a crap parent as I've always been told.

I don't think I'd take him to football any more. It all sounds too stressy.

How would I feel if I saw a mother holding a child firmly who was screaming, swearing and lashing out. I think I'd cheer that the little toad was getting decent parenting and not being allowed to get away with blue murder. You perhaps need to stop worrying what others are thinking - most aren't that interested.

He wouldn't be going to football anymore

Stop the football. He has to earn the right to go to clubs/hobbies by working on his foul language and temper issues. I would have made him walk in his football boots if he refused to change to his trainers.

I wouldn't bellow at him. What does that really achieve long term? I would just give an instruction in a positive way without nagging and wait it out quietly/calmly. Give him space/time. Don't rush. Remind him of something nice that's happening next (fushfingers for tea or seeing a favourite aunt or decorating biscuits). Chat about other things.

I would lift/move him as long as it was using 'appropriate force' and nothing more. He would need to move with me and not be fighting or creating a huge scene. I would also consider using restraint in an emergency situation but it would have to be appropriate. There is a lot to be said for not reacting in the heat of the moment and instead waiting for him to be calmer and more rational. As long as you are behaving neutrally and unemotionally. Then helping him to reflect on his behaviour. Help him decide what to do when feeling cross next time.

Did you follow my link on Oppositional defiance disorder?

Where has he learnt this behaviour? How did he get into this pattern? Why do you think he does it? Do you think he might have underlaying behavioural issues? What's he like outside of this issue? With food? Socialising?

What's he like at school?

Is he rude to other parents or your family?

Can you reward good behaviour immediately. So say 'after you've put your shoes on, you can choose which colour fruit pastille you'd like?'