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Discipline for a 4 year old - worried we're not doing it right!

36 replies

user1479678841 · 20/11/2016 22:06

Ok,

First time poster and father here. I am looking for some advice or consolation, or even someone to tell me I'm right/wrong.

The story.
Our 4 year old, like many, will lose it. Ignoring all of the build up where we try distraction, caring and so on, it gets to the point where we have to go for a chat. This involves sitting and restraining our son.

What we do.
I sit with him facing me, legs either side and with my arms around his back. I lock my arms and this prevents him running away. He doesn't like it and he loses it even more. He pushes against my arms, but I never actually force him "in", so he can just sit if he wants. (He never does)

Why we do it
He will go ballistic, which he was heading towards anyway. He then gets worked up and will then get past his emotional and physical uncontrollable behaviour. he quietens down and we can talk to him. It always ends with lots of hugs and love and everyone happy.

Why I am worried
This was used early on age 2 -3 and I hoped to end it now. Also it;s a physical restraint and we really want to be in a post physical discipline world. Even writing this out makes me feel like we are doing something awful,

So. does anyone else do something similar..? Anyone think this os really ok, or really not ok? Looking for help.

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Obsidian77 · 20/11/2016 23:57

Also, think about how you deal with anger and frustration and the coping mechanisms you model to him.

user1479678841 · 21/11/2016 00:01

Thanks Obsidian,

We're actually a very calm couple and have never had an argument in front of him. Indeed, and this may sound unusual and I'm not exaggerating but we haven't had a row in about 5 years. The only two times have been over fajitas. (seriously) We re just not that shouty. We not soft though, Wife has tough job and I am a chef. So we deal in stressful situations all the time.

Maybe somebody in the family needs to be the emotionally shouty one...

OP posts:
corythatwas · 21/11/2016 00:06

That's funny, OP: dh and I are the same, very laidback and hardly ever feel the need to argue. More likely to stop halfway through the opening lines and start laughing together. As for ds, he is growing up into one of those strong silent types who hate displays of emotion. But then dd sees to the drama...

user1479678841 · 21/11/2016 00:08

Yes its hard to maintain the indignation when your other half finds you hilarious.

Also, lets face it life is funny, Apart from fajitas.

fajitas are serious business

OP posts:
Obsidian77 · 21/11/2016 00:14

op Scotland in winter...definitely see your point about the outside time being a non-starter.
cory thanks for your posts, they are really insightful. Yes mine have both given the bedroom doors a good walloping, pulled things off shelves and out of cupboards, ripped up paper etc.
I figured that if they were kicking or hitting the door they would work the anger out pretty fast. Both their bedroom doors did get some dents in but never broken like your DB did...that must have been scary for everyone. Like I say, I'm not sure if I handled the situation well but it was about removing them to the calmest, safest place available then going in to hug them and talk to them once the storm had broken. I persevered with this because I could see that it worked for us and that more and more often we could avoid the full-on meltdowns by taking them out of the situation.
They're a little older now and very very rarely have tantrums although DC1 is intense and prone to anxiety.

Obsidian77 · 21/11/2016 00:16

Two times over fajitas? Who knew they were so contentious? Grin

user1479678841 · 21/11/2016 00:18

I was being serious about the outside! We 're pretty hardy so he'll be fine I am sure,

The change is setting idea sounds promising!

OP posts:
Trifleorbust · 21/11/2016 06:27

If this technique isn't making him feel calmer and more reassured, the only benefit is keeping him safe whilst he has his tantrum. How bad are these incidents? I am surprised that a 4 year old can't be placed safely in his room or in another room to calm down without being physically restrained. Sounds like the main effect is to wind him up even more.

MaximumVolume · 21/11/2016 09:51

user147 we have similar issues with our 4yo (who is in reception, but very young in the year). He's actually loads better than a year ago, I suspect partly down to his own development and partly down to his baby brother now being a mini person who gives something back in the relationship rather than a drain of Mummy's time (he's 21 months now).

Our terrible episodes are less frequent now; every so often, not more than every 6 weeks-2 months. When they happen, they rumble on for a couple of days. This weekend is a good example: DH and I went out on Friday evening and left the boys with a babysitter (who they know).

DS1 knew this was happening and deliberately kept himself awake so that he could see her. She tried to get him off to sleep but he was too excited (and I think, perhaps a little anxious - tell tale sign was that his asthma flared up a bit, which it often does when he's anxious).

He ended up going to sleep about 2 hours late for bedtime, then woke up when we got home - usually he's a very heavy sleeper. He then woke up again during the night and DH had to go in and settle him.

Got up at 6.30 as usual and by 8am he was completely in bits. DH had said he could have a treat at breakfast time (one of those mini-packs of cereal) if he went to bed really well for the us/babysitter on the previous evening, and he was furious that he wasn't going to be allowed it.

Complete rage, as described by OP and we had to restrain him because he gets into such a state that he wants to cause destruction and isn't careful of himself.

If we move ourselves away/ ignore it infuriates him more and he will come towards us and hit to get our attention. If we take him upstairs he will try to run down again and be in such a state he'd probably slip and fall.

So, we gently restrain. I usually lay a hand on him very lightly - no pressure and if he starts to make a move to hit, kick or run away, then I prevent it. All the time I try to remain calm and repeat that we love him and that he needs to calm down. Can he let us help him? Usually after a while there's enough of a gap in the crying for this message to get through and he will simply melt into my arms and we'll suddenly be cuddling. He's then very apologetic.

We got through the rest of Saturday and then Sunday we pushed him too far in going out to see our town's Christmas light switch on at 5.30 and he wanted every piece of tat/hideous sweet that he could see and cried all the way home because he couldn't have it. We didn't quite get into full-on tantrum, thankfully. Once we were home, we had a chat about it, he calmed down and snuggled into me watching The Gruffalo.

This is a child who is considered to be kind, polite and well-behaved by all outside the house. I attended the triple P parenting course because I couldn't cope with his behaviour in the house last year and everyone who came into contact with him who knew about it asked "why? He's so good!".

One thing I did pick up from the Triple P is that in some ways it's quite positive that he's picked up that there are ways we must behave and that he can stick to that - mostly. It makes sense because he does cry a lot less than other 4 year olds we know and seems more robust day-to-day.

Essentially, though, he's dealing with his emotions in a mature way only outwardly until he comes into his safe space and then every now and again he needs to let off steam with the people he trusts to love him no matter what.

I guess as time goes on he will understand and process things more and the tantrums will disappear (they're already massively reduced in frequency).

Trigger points for us are definitely tiredness and hunger - tiredness certainly builds up in a child - over term, over an exciting period like a Christmas or holiday. We struggle as DS1 cannot nap or he will lose even more sleep at nightime as a result of his daytime sleep. 20 minutes asleep in the day means he will take an extra hour to get to sleep in the evening.

Whether restraint is the right thing to do, I don't know. Triple P certainly didn't answer that, although I was honest about using the technique. I really don't know what the alternative is. We try to keep away from going in to tantrum mode as much as possible; which is where conventional behaviour techniques come into play, but once you're there unless you have a padded room you can shut them in* I feel gentle restraint is the safest way.

*joking! (sort of Wink)

corythatwas · 23/11/2016 13:13

That sounds exactly like my parents, Maximum; lots of hard work to avoid the triggers, but once they were there nothing to be done except to ride out the storm. And tbh there were days where you could see with db that it wasn't going to work because he was already at a pitch of tension where he would have to find an excuse to let it out; it was hurting him too much. But a lot of the time, distraction, and perhaps just the feeling that his family were on his side and wanted to help him, did a lot for him. Doesn't mean he grew up into a spoiled brat at all: my parents always had rather high standards of politeness; more that my DM at least got very good at telling normal bad behaviour from the signs of the approaching storm. I would say he is an exceptionally caring and considerate adult- perhaps because of what he learnt from his own parents.

I have tried to do as well for dd. Also, because she has physical health issues, she has accessed mental health techniques that weren't availably to db, and that has done a lot to keep her anxiety under control.

MaximumVolume · 23/11/2016 14:57

Thanks Cory so good to know that we're not making hideous mistakes and that this behaviour isn't an indication of life-long behaviour issues.

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