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How relevant is IQ to performance?

12 replies

DrDooRatheraLot · 27/04/2015 17:13

Hi
My 7yr old DS's teacher referred him to the school psychologist for "intelligence testing" just to see whether he needed any extra stimulation since he seems to find current school work very easy and reads extremely well. The teacher says he is ahead of his peers in most areas in the classroom. He is very happy and well-adjusted.
Since both my husband and I were similar to him at school and consider ourselves of above average intelligence- we are both vets (sorry, I'm not meaning to sound arrogant here)- we were not particularly surprised that he is a good student.
Today the psychologist gave me his test results and it seems they have done a series of different age-appropriate tests to determine IQ and his is 103 which is completely average.
I certainly did not expect him to be any kind of genius but am simply surprised that he is not above the average range given as 90-110.
So my question is.....can a child perform exceptionally well academically at school and yet have a very ordinary IQ?
I never had mine tested but always thought it would be around 120.... But perhaps I am also Average Jane.
I don't actually care about the number ( this isn't about Pushy Mom wanting a Child Genius to parade around!) but, since I don't know much about the whole IQ testing theory and how it translates on a practical level, I thought I'd see if any Mumsnet experts can shed some light.
Will an average IQ mean he will have limitations as far as academic achievement and career opportunities in the future or are there loads of other factors?
Just FYI, we are not in the UK and are a bilingual family, so UK schooling terminology means very little to me Confused
Thanks

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adoptmama · 27/04/2015 18:52

Bilingualism can impact the testing even if he is tested in his stronger language.

After 'natural ability', concentration/focus is the biggest indicator of academic success. If your child has a good ability to persist with a task and ignore alternative stimuli it helps.

Ed psych did tell me once when I queried our results (as school peformance in no way matched assessed levels) that tests can be wrong and, when they are, they tend to under estimate ability.

Nerves and confidence and relationship with tester can also impact eg if he is perfectionist he could be more cautious or hesitant when he knows he is being tested.

CultureSucksDownWords · 27/04/2015 20:36

I would echo what the PP has said, and be cautious of drawing conclusions from a single test.

Also, speaking as a secondary school teacher, a child of average intelligence should be able to access the curriculum and achieve the highest grades with a decent amount of effort and enthusiasm. If that wasn't the case then there would be no point trying to teach them! It's the job of his teachers to teach him, encourage him and enthuse him so that he can achieve. Children with two interested, stable and happy parents are also at a huge advantage, so don't forget to factor that in too.

nellorr · 27/04/2015 20:44

I'm a speech and language therapist and while I was at uni, our psychology professor (published and respected in her field) poo-poo'ed the use of IQ tests.

DrDooRatheraLot · 27/04/2015 22:57

Thanks all for the feedback.
I had also heard that there are many who think IQ testing is flawed but I haven't heard of any new alternatives for measuring intelligence. I assumed that the testing being done these days would be a bit broader than just coming out with a number but obviously I know very little about this field, hence the post.
Just seems strange that a child who is obviously picking concepts up faster than his classmates at an age where studying and hard work is not really required, could be of only average intelligence. It implies that 40-50 percent of his little buddies are probably brighter than he is.... So why are they having to work hard to read and add numbers when he isn't?
Of course it could all change later and he could be the slowest to catch on in two years' time but if this is a measure of his present day IQ.... Does this mean the rest of the class are all subnormal ??!! ( unlikely since it's a private school in a good area and known to be quite pushy academically) oh God, now I sound horribly elitist!
Anyway.... Just trying to make sense of this as it doesn't seem logical to me. Sorry if I'm waffling !

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CultureSucksDownWords · 27/04/2015 23:11

A single score from an IQ test tells you very little about the detailed picture of his ability though. In the UK children in secondary schools do CAT tests in year 7 (aged 11-12), which give three scores - verbal, non-verbal and quantitative reasoning, plus the average of these. Often children have an uneven profile with one score being higher than the others. My point is that intelligence isn't just a single score - people have a range of abilities that make up their overall intelligence.

Also, entirely possible your son was just having an off day when he was tested!

LIG1979 · 28/04/2015 03:24

If he is not used to doing IQ tests he may have found the test style difficult. I did lots of scholarship exams for 6th form and they all had IQ tests. When practising my "IQ" initially went up as I learnt how to do the tests. Then it stabilised on my true IQ.

As for performance I have a high IQ but my limitation is that I am not that way inclined. So I can pick things up quickly but if I ever wanted to be truly excellent academically I needed to sit down and learn (and not spend my days mucking around and doing sport.) So you need both for performance.

As a very bright guy I know at uni discovered, as clever as he was, he still couldn't pass an exam on a module on something he never attended lectures on!

adoptmama · 28/04/2015 04:27

I would be very surprised if what he was given was an IQ test. More likely - if this were an ed psych you saw - that a battery of tests would be used to assess many different areas eg WISC tests. You should ask to see the full report or speak with whoever tested. Most school personnel are not fully qualified to carry out these assessments as the interpretation of the results is crucial.

madwomanbackintheattic · 28/04/2015 06:06

I was going to ask which test was administered. Likely it was WISC, in which case you should have a far more detailed breakdown of how they got to the broader IQ score.

In all honesty, my least gifted kid (125) is the one that romps home with the best grades, because she is a natural grafter, diligent student, and just accepts that's what she has to do.

The other two are brighter on testing, but for various reasons it doesn't translate to school performance (one either has ADD or is bored rigid, depending on who you ask Wink and the other has cerebral palsy)

It is of course entirely possible to be (using the controversial term) 'twice exceptional' or 2E, and have a learning disability or other exceptionality as well as 'gifted ness' or whatever we are calling higher potential.

Ultimately, iq tests are mildly interesting, particularly when you look at the sub-scores, but probably aren't really indicative of performance. It is fun for the paed to tell the five yo she has a higher iq than her doctor, but it doesn't mean much in the longer term.

One of the tests (I forget which one) may also have been affected by cultural interpretations - I know during one test I realised it was highly biased to particular sub groups in terms of the pictures used for word associations or similar. I can't remember exactly which one it was, but remember pondering how many 5yos would recognise the item as I hadn't seen one in twenty years lol...

But yes, ask for the Ed psych report and read the reports from each section. Much more enlightening!

My child genius Wink was in a wheelchair when she did her testing. People used to speak very loudly to her, or to me about her. There was no parading, but it was enlightening to realise just how many people assume wheelchair = learning disability. She didn't ever set foot in a private school as none would take her. I don't think private schools have the monopoly on bright kids, however much they would like to assume so. Just rich ones.

mugglingalong · 28/04/2015 06:30

I think that age 7 is possibly a little young to assess IQ related to performance. Dd1 was still struggling to decode until her 7th birthday, but at 10 she is one of the strongest readers in the class as she reads widely and prolifically. She also has a wide vocabulary because we use a wide range of words at home. Dd2 is 8 and still struggling to read because her eyes don't converge properly, however she is doing eye training which is making a substantial difference. She presents as very articulate and able until you put a book in front of her.

Ds happens to be very good at pattern matching (has always loved jigsaw puzzles), he read very early and is now reading well ahead of his peers. I know though that it could all change as his peers are more able to decode, he is also older than most of them so they might be where he is in 6 months when they are the same age as he is. The early stages of both reading and maths rely quite heavily on a few core skills such as pattern matching, spatial ability as well as basic things like being able to see normally. Don't be surprised if some of his peers do begin to catch him up a bit.

Having said that IQ tests aren't perfect either - the bilingualism will make a difference, plus his response under test conditions. They are most useful at flagging up gaps in understanding rather than as an aggregate. To get that overall mark he might have scored very highly in some areas but low in others - either because there is a genuine deficit there or because he just didn't understand what was being asked of him.

The benefits though of his early academic success should also not be underestimated. Ds is very confident in his academic abilities in a way in which dd1 is not. He approaches tasks with the belief that he can do it whereas dd1 is less confident. Dd2 is very confident in some areas (e.g. maths) but not in reading. I guess my main concern for your son is what the teachers make of this result and what they intended to do if it came back very high which they might not now do. Don't let the test result limit your or their expectations of him. See it as a snap shot of his current ability to complete IQ tests. It would be useful though to see the full test and whether there are any areas which brought the score down.

DrDooRatheraLot · 28/04/2015 10:29

Great feedback! Thanks all. I will dig out the report and get back to you tonight- at work till late. Sad there were a series of areas tested and I think it was the WISC but must just check as the letters are slightly different being in "foreign".
I think he does have a need to get things right and please people so may have been hesitant if he didn't feel confident.... Who knows? Back later. Thanks again

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NickyEds · 28/04/2015 14:00

Children with two interested, stable and happy parents are also at a huge advantage

^^ This. There are all sorts of reasons why your son's peers have to work harder at reading and adding numbers that might not be at all IQ related.

In terms of performance I reckon, diligence, commitment and hard work are far better qualities to have. My nephew has a high IQ and has found school such a breeze up to A level he's become a bit of a lazy bugger really and it's ended up as a bit of a disadvantage. I have a high IQ and I had a small craft business before giving it up to be a SAHM, dp has an IQ similar to that of a pebble (by his own admission!!!)and has a Phd and earns really good money.

DrDooRatheraLot · 28/04/2015 20:42

Urp ! Doesn't say what system they used to test him.
But now I'm kind of fascinated to know whether my own IQ may be average too ( as genetics surely plays a strong role!) I was always told I was very bright and maybe, it was simply that self-belief that spurred me on to great achievements.... As in what Mugglingalong wrote.
Then again, some of my husband's family members are a few bananas short of a bunch so that might explain an averaging out! Hmm Haha

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