Colic/reflux - unlucky twice?

[AliceAnneB]

My DC had horrible colic/reflux and screamed for the first year or so and it left me with awful PND. Now DC is three and I never thought I would consider another after our first experience but....I'm feeling broody! So tell me straight have you had two screamers?

Sorry to say, yes. DS2 was just as bad as DS1 and the stress and sleep deprivation meant that I developed severe PND after DS2, when with DS1 I was "only" exhausted. However this was 12 years ago and decent reflux meds weren't prescribed as widely as they seem to be now. The infant gaviscon we tried was basically useless, but that was all we were offered.

No, my first was colicky but my second wasn't.

I think there may well be some genetic element. The children I've known have been bad reflux, have also had siblings with reflux.

It could be explained by saying the parents are more looking out for it, but I don't think entirely.

However all my dc were different.
Dd1 was very placid and only cried when any self respecting baby would, dd2 had a scream that ensured in a room of 50 babies she'd have had every member of staff dashing to her at the first yell , and ds had constant ear infections so was grizzly but not a screamer.

And not all the babies with reflex I've known have been screamers, some of them have been more "bring the whole meal back up again, but not appear to be in pain" type.

My DS has awful reflux and it was very hard work, my DD two years later had nothing and was a very chilled happy little baby. So it's doesn't always mean it will happen again

Lightning doesn't always strike twice but given at least half of all colic cases are linked to a temporary (1-3 year) dairy intolerance, which is largely genetic odds are pretty good. My ds didn't sleep well for 17 months, but his little sister won the paediatrician's prize for career worst case of reflux. Oh and she was three months prem, so just fitted right into our family no stress whatsoever. deranged cackle.

Yes. But I knew it woild pass which made it easier!

I'm hoping the perspective that it will pass would get me through but when I really think of how awful it was I can feel that old rising panic! I remember breast feeding while circling the house because the baby wouldn't feed otherwise. I remember the hours and hours of screaming and resorting to head phones and I break into a cold sweat. And then I hold a newborn and turn into a puddle of broodiness!

Both mine had / have reflux. DS was a champion puker and couldn't be laid flat on his back for the couple of months of his life. We had to always prop up his Moses basket / crib and hold him upright for at least 30 minutes after feeding. He fussed endlessly with trapped wind. I blamed formula feeding at the time as I ended up FF after about 8 weeks.

Now I have DD, 4 months, though and she is EBF and still has reflux and pukes up as much as DS did but just more watery stuff since breastmilk is thinner in consistency. She was diagnosed with reflux and the doctor suggested giving her zantac but I was reluctant to medicate and she was sleeping OK as long as she was burped well. Her sleep has got worse recently though so I've finally succumbed and given her some of the zantac to see if it helps her and she seems to be a little easier to settle - so far...

So basically both DC have had reflux despite different feeding methods. I think there is a genetic element to it unfortunately! At least you know what you are / might be in for this time. I found it less stressful to deal with DD's reflux because I know it's a phase they grow out of eventually and I had learned techniques to deal with it from handling DS.

Well with my second I knew quite quickly what I was dealing with so went to the gp quickly. I also harassed bf counsellors etc and got advice. Plus dd lived in the sling for the first few months. And I coslept from day one, didn't bother fighting that battle. Nor trying to get self settling etc until she was much older.

She turned into the better napper and sleeper once she got older!

If I had another child I'd definitely go dairy free while breast feeding. I went dairy free for my dd for two years but only after two months of colic/reflux after significant gut damage occurred. She needed significant medication for two years and still can't tolerate dairy or soya. My dsis went dairy free after just a week of having her baby and her dd is an easy baby, great sleeping, delightful little being (but even the briefest trial of dairy results in screaming and insomnia). I like milk chocolate but I love my sanity more.

Yes both of mine have been reflux but has been easier second time round as i knew what to look out for. As a previous poster said not all babies react the same way. Ds1 was a screamer, constantly after each feed, wouldn't lie on his back only his front. I listened to this for 5 weeks thinking this is what babies do and therethere'll be no more. Thank goodness the HV noticed and put me in the right direction with gaviscon. Ds2 is also being treated for reflux this time with carobel. I noticed the signs straight away and
aftersome trial and error the dr prescribed carobel. However &Ds2 is only in pain on an odd occasion but this time would spew more and has brought up near full bottles. He also sleeps on his back which is a huge relief to me.

Good luck. It definitely does feel easier second time as you feel more prepared with how to deal with it.

I should add that ds2 sleeps on his back but is significantly proped up whereas that didn't work at all for ds1.

Crazyqueen what do you mean by gut damage? I went on the elimination diet of eating nothing but Turkey sweet potato and rice for two whole weeks trying to sort out what in my breast milk was bothering him but it made not a blind bit of difference. It's a wonder I ended up with PND! Next time I think I would be more likely to try formula so I didn't have to endure all the night screaming.

Food intolerances cause the bowel to get inflamed, ulcerate and even bleed. Hence they are linked to Crohns and ulcerative colitis in later life. It's this damage that takes a while to heal even after a problem food is removed. That was a seriously extreme elimination diet op, wow. Unfortunately - it wasn't really going to be able to tell you much of anything after just two weeks. Although I doubt anyone could stick to that for much longer. Dairy protein takes three weeks to leave the mums system, and a further three weeks to totally leave the baby's. So you'd hope to spot something after a month or so, but it could be 2-3 months before the full benefits are there, once the gut has recovered. Things like soya pass in less than a week. I'd eliminate the two overwhelmingly most likely contenders religiously - dairy and soya rather than cut everything out. My dad also helpfully reacted to sweet potato and rice when being weaned so that diet would have been a no go for her!

Meds wise though there are now much better options than the waste of time that was gaviscon. Omeprazole at 3mgs per kg gave us our lives back - but only in conjunction with an elimination diet. And there are two truly hypoallergenic milk free formulas - neonate and nutramagen lipid - which are what you want if you choose to ff.

I slowly started adding food back in after two weeks but stayed dairy and soy free for the entire 10 months that I breastfed. And it made not a jot of difference. We did Zantac (ranidine) but I wasn't brave enough to try the omeprizole. The Zantac didn't improve things either. I was at my wits end. He eventually seemed to outgrow it on his own at about 14-15 months.

At 10 months he stopped breastfeeding of his own accord but refused the nurtriminigen point blank. He ended up taking the Hipp organic which didn't seem to have any different effect than my dairy free breast milk so I really don't think dairy was the issue. That's my issue with trying for baby two - we never did sort out what the problem was for baby one.

Eggs maybe... I think that's third most likely, but yes you are getting into the realms of a mind bending guessing game.Or else there was trace dairy and soya getting in - vitabiotics are a great hidden source of soya for example. And my dd could react to me eating just the barest trace. Tbh my dd would have been awful just on an exclusion diet, and we lasted a week on ranitadine. For us it was omeprazole for two years that 'fixed' it.

Lots of babies self wean v early to avoid the allergens in milk, but if you want a lo to take neonate they have to try it before 3-4 months or they won't touch it as its bogging.

Really appreciate your insight crazyqueen. I also cut out eggs - I'd forgotten or mostly likely repressed it! If we end up with another one I'd be more inclined to try the omeprizole. I was desperate to BF exclusively but looking back Im not sure it served the greater good.

I don't think I dare have another baby after living through DD's reflux and colic. It was sheer hell.

If! I ever did have another baby I would be taking some very good quality probiotics during the later stages of pregnancy as I think there is some good information about early gut flora and colic and reflux. I.e. you want to try and make sure they get a good dose through your breast milk at birth.

I was desperate to bf too. Esp as I'd fed her brother for two years and it alleviated the mummy guilt at her arriving three months too soon. Am not sure it was the best thing for our family either looking back but at the time it was so important for me and her (esp as there's no hypoallergenic prem formula and she was having blue baby reflux incidents on even trace dairy). I kind of have a cod theory that in families which have a history of intolerances the mums own immune response to dairy and soya is passed to the infant during bfing - exacerbating the next generations intolerance. Just anecdotally Bf babies seem to suffer far more with cmpi than ff ones. Anyway good luck.

I remember reading about probiotics as well Monica. We have our baby BioGaia drops from three months but I'm not sure it did anything. If and its a big if I get pregnant again I will certainly be chugging probiotics through the whole thing. It's good to remember all these things and to think them through. I just wish I didn't feel like I was preparing for battle! I often feel like I didn't have a baby. I had a reflux baby who was miserable and so was I. I guess I feel cheated. I was lucky to have the most lovely NCT group that included me even though my baby screamed so loud no one could actually hear each other! But other than seeing them
I really didn't go out because he screamed most of the day and it was so antisocial. I think in talking myself out of it over here!

Yes I tried the BioGaia and Nutrivene baby stuff too, I agree it didn't do much but I still believe it may be key. I think gut flora is hard to change once it gets going. As you can tell I am not an expert but I too would be chugging probiotics IF I ever got pregnant again.

I know exactly what you mean by feeling cheated, I see my peers having their second baby now and coming to the toddler classes with their baby who happily sleep through the class! Unimaginable with DD who screamed for 12 months and cried and whinged for the next 12 months after that!

People keep trying to tell me lightening doesn't strike twice but crikey if it did! You have to have been in the reflux trenches to know what that would be like with a baby plus another child . Shudder!

We had terrible reflux with dd1. Nothing worked to improve it. (We tried gaviscon,ranitidine, omeprazole and nutramigen).

Dd2 is looking like she will be the same (only 2 weeks old at present).