'Stealing' from school and other children

[Heatherbee]

Hi there all I am new here and am sad my first words are worried ones but here goes:

My DS is almost 6 and has recently been found taking items from the school and other childrens pockets. My husband and I were shocked but put it down to 'boyish' behaviour. We have always felt we have explained fully the wrongs of taking other people's things and the school have talked at length to him about this also but words and star charts, missing play time etc don't seem to be making any difference. In fact the school are totally at a loss with what else to say DS has been to the head master regarding this and we now have to frisk his pockets before leaving the school. He breaks his heart when we discover there is something else he has taken and claims he 'cannot remember' to NOT do it. This behaviour seems SO unlike him - I cannot stress this enough and wonder if there is anyone out there who's child went through anything similar? Any advice would be wonderful -Thanks for listening HUGS a confused Mum! xxx

Heatherbee - welcome to mumsnet. I don't have any experience of this behaviour (phew - one thing my dss HAVEN'T done .. well so far anyway!) But wanted to bump it up to the top of the list for you, as I'm sure there must be others here who have been through this.

Hi Heatherbee,
My friend had the same thing with her DS. Never really got to the bottom of it. Starcharts, grounding you name she tried it.DS even stole the dinner money for the week.
The good news is she just stopped. We think it have may be attention seeking and she was also playing with children that seemed to relish in her being told her. My friend told DS to play with other children and grounded her from playing with children that appeared to enjoy telling tales on her. This did appear to improve the situation.

Hope this has given you some comfort that you are not alone in this and this has happened to other parents as well. Hope all goes well Lars xx

My 8 yo has just been doing something similar. Tbh, his "problem" seems confined to Pokemon gameboy games. He doesn't really steal them, just seems to want to borrow them despite the owner asking for them back. He doesn't seem to intend to keep them indefinitely - just until he's played with it enough. We've had words and he seems to have stopped. Does your ds take things he really wants or are the items totally random?

Thankyou so much everyone who has replied and for your kind welcome! I really appreciate it and your words have given me much comfort-For the first time it is a situation that has got me (and the school!) stumped! Freckle - It has been toys from the 'rainy day' box or other childrens pockets (has been caught sneaking to the cloakroom a lot) but today it was money from another childs coat.What is hugely frustrating is that he has managed to lie so convincingly and makes up stories about who gave him things or where he found them. The whole class has been asked to 'watch' my ds to 'help' him stop which I am not sure I agree with - Mud sticks etc and is he just being who he is expected to be? I don't know-maybe I am theorising too much? lol! - I just wish I knew why he does it so I could put it right

Hi Heatherbee,
My five year old girls (twins) regularly used to come home from school with their pockets stuffed full of loot - small plastic animals and buttons were their main obsession. Their Teachers' reaction is that they all do it and as long as they bring it back and are told it's not acceptable they like not to make a big thing about it... My first reaction was pretty much the opposite, of course. I was really worried and gave them lectures about stealing, prison etc! Anyway since I've taken a more softly softly approach their light-fingered habit has definitely lessened. Now they get all sanctimonious if they find stray sheep in their pocket and say they don't know how it got there but they will most certainly be returning it to the farm tomorrow! Don't worry too much.

hi heatherbee. was just searching the board for help on exactly this problem! our son (6yrs)has been coming home with toys from school and i am at a loss about what to do. I told him that i would be talking to his teacher tomorrow and he did seem a bit worried. my husband has lectured him about prison etc but i think he just switches off. i feel like i have failed him somehow and also scared because i feel like i dont recognise him anymore. i never expected him to do anything like this. to me it is a big deal. i am reading a book i saw recommended on another thread - how to talk so children will listen and listen so children can talk (i think) and i hope that will help me! it has already recommended against lecturing!! sorry i dont have any advice - i am struggling too.

Wecome to mumsnet, heatherbee. Your problem has me stumped too, I must admit, since I have yet to encounter this with my sons. As you say, I wouldn't be mega keen on all the class being told to 'help' your ds to stop stealing, because of the mud sticking aspect. Your son sounds as if he's having much fun trying to outwit everyone with his believable stories. He must be a bright little boy.

What's your son like in toy shops? could you tell him you'll take him to a toy shop and let him choose something if he steals nothing from school for a week?

And what happens if you 'steal' his toys? can you say you'll take away one of his toys at home every time you find a school toy on him? These are the tactics that spring to my mind, but they are pretty obvious, so you might well have tried them.

It is very reassuring to see from other posts that this stealing thing is a phase. I will file this knowledge away in my memory so I am prepared if it happens to us.

Hi Heatherbee and welcome to Mumsnet No experience of this, but it sounds, as tigermoth said, that he is a bright and imaginative little boy rather than a master criminal in the making. I'm sure it's just...those dread words...a stage he's going through. Hope you and he get it sussed out soon.

My 8 yo is the most convincing liar I've ever come across. He's either destined for the stage or prison! I did see a programme on children which indicated that lying is actually the sign of a very bright child, so I try to comfort myself with that, but it is small comfort when faced with a situation like this. On the one hand, you want to believe your child (starting point for parents is always to believe your child), but you know he's a practised liar (when it suits him) so what do you do? I've tried to explain the long-term effect of lying, i.e. that people will not believe you in the future even when you're telling the truth, but I'm not sure if it's sunk in.

Have you tried tit for tat? Each time he takes or attempts to take something which doesn't belong to him, you take something of his. It has to be something he really likes for it to have any effect.

I do think it is a stage, although these stages don't always appear at a time when you might expect them. In your place, I would avoid telling him off too much. As you say, he gets upset when you find out, so perhaps emphasising how sad it makes you and how he really is a lovely little boy so you find it hard to understand why he would do something to upset you and/or the owner of the item might have more of an effect.

This may not be what you want to hear but please don't assume there's nothing sinister about this. I went through a period of stealing when I was 7, and I was actually very unhappy at the time (I'd moved school due to a really traumatic house move - whole family in disarray because of it).

I was stealing stuff from school and cash from my sister at home. I don't think anyone ever knew about the stealing from school but my parents found out about stealing money and I was punished by being sent to my room for an afternoon (what enlightened times they were!).

I look back now and think it was an attempt to make somebody notice how unhappy I was, altho' I wasn't conscious of this at the time. I took things I didn't even want and never used.

Although from what you've said it doesn't sound like there's a similar trauma going on here, I do think you should keep talking to him about how he is in general - not just about this incident. When I stole I didn't have the awareness to know I was doing it because I felt bad, and he probably doesn't unsertand why he's doing it either.

He needs to understand this isn't accepatble behaviour and stop doing it, but I'm not sure a 6 year old can really take in that he's doing something criminal.

Sorry long post - feel very emotional about it - horrid memories for me! Hope I don't sound critical - your ds is so lucky that he has such concerned parents.

I was a thieving child. I remember pinching pennies, sweets in shops. WE (me & friends) just thought of ourselves as clever & sly. It stopped roughly ages 7-11, and then I had another bout of experimenting with "the five finger discount" when I was 12-13. I don't know what you can do different, but I think most kids just outgrow it. I suppose one day as a teenager I just realised it was really selfish what I was doing.

A friend went out with a gal who was a kleptomaniac; her house was filled with bits and trinkets she had nicked from shops. From what I know about this woman, her stealing compulsion had to do with inability to be intimate, and this is not why children nick things. Kids just nick things because they want them!

Thanks so much everyone -some great advice and reassurance there HUG I know deep down I am worrying wayyyy too much as in every other aspect he is doing well in school and from what I can see and what ds tells me he loves going. Tigermoth-we have tried the toy shop reward thing which just seems to have limited results - ds seems unable to relate to having to not take things for the whole week and usually by Tuesday things are back to 'normal' and then the whole 'carrot' idea seems non effective. Freckle- we have tried takiing his favourite toys away and said he can have them back when he has stopped taking things that don't belong to him but he just seems to stifle a smile and nods (HUGELY frustrating!) I spoke with his teacher again this morning and asked them to chaperone him at times when he has access to the cloakrooms (they maintain the stealing occurs on visits to and from the toilet and water fountain) I suggested that at these times he should not be allowed by himself so he is prevented from taking these things and he may feel it is not worth continueing as his independence is taken away from him for a short while -what do you think? They are going to try and do this where possible (if resources will allow pah!!) Annnnnyway - I am just ranting now -I will see how things go today Wish me luck!!

much love and thanks

Heatherxxx

Ms ds (aged 10) often comes home with bits and pieces that he has 'found' at school or school pencils etc. The things that he has 'found' just get taken back and passed to the office - school pencils etc. get returned. His maths homework one week was for him to work out how much it would cost the school if every child in the school took home a pencil each day. I think in your case I would try and get him to understand the consequence of his actions - not just the fact he is 'stealing' but what he is taking - maybe the fact that a child wouldn't be able to play with their favourite rainy day tow because he had taken it - or maybe that a child may have got into trouble for losing something when he had taken it. I would then stitch up every pocket he has - trousers, coat, fleece etc. and replace his book bag with a clear plastic folder so nothing can be hidden in there either - try and ensure he has nowhere to put this stuff and see how he goes.

You could try getting him to see how it is for the other child (I know, this isn't easy). Or, if he is a child that needs friends, point out that he won't have any friends if he keeps taking things from them. It does amaze me, as an aside, how many parents let children take bits and bobs to school - especially money. Why does an infant school-age child need money in school? This is partly what annoyed me about DS2 "borrowing" a gameboy game. Why do parents let their children take valuables into school? No excuse for DS2's behaviour, of course. Just me having a bit of a moan.

Hello Heatherbee.
I think it's interesting how many people have said that they used to do this when they were young: I did too.

I had a very clear idea of right and wrong, and knew not to steal. BUT I had a heightened sense of imagination, drama, and attention seeeking, I think, and quite often used to live little dramas "I AM that person therefore I have the pink pencil case" etc etc. I used to imagine that I was going in to hospital and some coveted item had been given to me as a consolation present for my trauma, and daydream my way through lessons believing my way into ownership of other people's chocolate bars. I didn't mean to be dishonest, but i think it is hard for adults to re-create that blurred line that children have between imagination and reality. If i got told off or punished for these escapades, I would simply develop a new imaginary world in which I was a hard-done-to orphan needing to raid the biscuit tin for a crust simply to survive....
If you think this could be your son's problem, I think I would encourage him to find a 'prompt' to stop, take stock, and say to himself "what will happen if I go home with this?"

Well Heatherbee?
Did he bring anything home today from school?

heatherbee, I think your chaperoning idea is a jolly good one. And if that doesn't work, jaybee's idea of stitiching up all his pockets, while talking to him about the consequences of his actions on others, sounds good to me.

I love blu's description of the fantasies behind her light fingered approach.

Nay more news on this Heatherbee?