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Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

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Original poster

At end of tether please help! 2.5 yr old tantrumming... at night!

13 replies

birdsnotbees · 01/10/2013 20:17

Lately, DD wakes up around 10-11pm, sometimes later, and basically has a massive temper tantrum for between 30mins-1.5 hours. Hits, screams, refuses to get back in bed. Asks for you then when you go to her, punches you in the face. When you walk away, gets even more hysterical.

She wakes up her brother (they share a room), and NOTHING seems to get her out of it: we have tried cc, distracting her, reward chart. Tonight she just refuses to go to bed and is currently screaming her head off.

I'm at my wit's end. She refuses to be comforted or held and she's just so angry - if I try and be kind to her, she usually just hits me.

She's a lovely girl in the day. She is a monster at night. I don't know why she wakes up and why she's so bloody angry when she does. She just screams at us whatever we do, like it's some sort of game - except she's dreadfully upset. And in the end either me or DP ends up losing our temper with her, so we all feel awful, drained and exhausted by the end of it - which seems to end when she feels she's had enough.

Does anyone have any experience of this? Any advice?

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NomDeClavier · 01/10/2013 20:19

Have you considered night terrors? Are you sure she's fully awake?

I remember my brother having awful night terrors and I don't think he knew who we were when we went to him.

bellablot · 01/10/2013 20:21

Night terrors

cherrytomato40 · 01/10/2013 20:25

Sounds like night terrors to me, DD has these occasionally, usually when she is overtired. Best thing is to stay nearby, keep her safe but don't wake her.

Does she get enough sleep generally? With DD it always happens after a few too many late nights or if she has had a particularly active day.

humphryscorner · 01/10/2013 20:29

that sounds terrible . No advice except I hope you all get past it soon.

Original poster

birdsnotbees · 01/10/2013 20:45

No, she's definitely awake - she did it this evening and she hadn't even gone to sleep. She's always been a bit like this but it seems to be escalating.. I have NO experience of a child like this and nor does anyone I know.

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cherrytomato40 · 01/10/2013 21:01

If she does it before she falls asleep that's different, but what you describe as waking up having a tantrum a few hours after she's gone to bed definitely sounds like night terrors to me- they can have their eyes open and talk to you but still be asleep www.nhs.uk/conditions/night-terrors/Pages/Introduction.aspx

Have you spoken to your GP or health visitor?

sittinginthesun · 01/10/2013 21:04

Also sounds like night terrors. They look awake, and can talk and shout. I used to take DS downstairs and let him wake up properly before resettling.

Original poster

birdsnotbees · 01/10/2013 21:26

Honestly, it's not night terrors. She's awake, sometimes we can distract her and calm her down, and then as we try and get her back in bed, she starts up again. She has behaved like this in one form or another since she was weeny, it's just getting worse (possibly because she can now get out of bed and rage up and down the corridor). She is completely awake - we can have conversations with her, she recognises it when I say "I'm going to count to 3 and if you don't stop X or Y then I am leaving the room" etc.

She uses prize manipulation: I want daddy. Here's daddy. I want mummy. Here's mummy. I want DADDY! Or screams at us, we go to leave the room, she screams that she wants us, we go to her, she hits us, we leave, she screams she wants us etc.

I feel very sad for her as it must be horrid but I am just so so so sick of it. We have had this weird manipulative behaviour in one form or another since she was 18 months old. She has always been a terrible sleeper, and very angry when she is tired. I thought she'd grow out of it - I thought she had - but we're back at square one again.

Sorry - rant - thanks to everyone who has replied, I do appreciate it. Just a bit fed up!

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SauceForTheGander · 01/10/2013 21:36

Mine DD did this at a similar age. And had always been an awful sleeper too. I know it seems like they are awake etc but they aren't properly awake - They are over tired and furious and bit nuts. Everything makes them upset / more upset. It is horrendous. If you go in they want daddy. If daddy goes in they want you. They don't know what they want. They are stressed and over tired. If you move a toy they go nuts.

Our phase lasted a few weeks. It was hellish. I spoke to her every night about it - and she settled / grew out of it etc. I think she was unsettled about nursery etc but she's never been a great sleeper.

I know you're tired but she's not manipulating. She's just completely confused and tired and is an angry toddler.

My DD improves and now just comes in for a cuddle. I let her co sleep whenever she wants - probably 1 in 4 nights. Better than screaming house down.

Original poster

birdsnotbees · 01/10/2013 21:53

Yes, sauce, that sounds like DD. I know she's not being rational - she is awake but completely nuts - and I do feel for her, as losing control to the extent she does must be terrifying. We talk about it in the morning, and she role plays a lot - gets her teddies and puts them to bed - so I know she's aware of it and not that happy.

Just so tiring. And I can't seem to do anything to help. I have been encouraging her to come in to our room for a cuddle but so far she stays in her room and yells - will keep trying. Really good to hear your DD has improved.

Everything at home is stable so perhaps there's some developmental stuff going on. I don't know. I'm just knackered! Thanks.

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cherrytomato40 · 01/10/2013 21:58

Does she do it at the same time every night? Would waking her about 10-15 minites before it is likely to happen help, to break the sleep cycle?

Is something waking her? Sounds ridiculous but we realised last winter that our DDs were wakimg as soon as the heating clicked on in the morning.

SauceForTheGander · 01/10/2013 22:33

It's just awful. DD did it from 1am and I was so fed up. But it passed. I don't know why or how it changed but it did. I think it was just one of those growth / development stages.

We had a spare room so we slept separately and took it in turns. We also agreed on a non negotiating technique. No discussion just said "it's sleep time" till she calmed / wore herself out.

She's 3 now and much better but is a sleep talker / restless. She's a live wire. But she's just sensitive and aware and full on.

ReallyGoodDrawer · 01/10/2013 22:49

My dd does this. When she started the tantrums it was tied up with night terrors (although different things, they started around the same time). We haven't really found a definitive solution but some things that help are:

Taking her to the toilet. I think most if the time she's woken by the need to pee but isn't awake enough to recognise why she feels uncomfortable. We shove her on the potty then she calms down a bit more quickly after that.

Sitting with her but not speaking to her. Having an argument with a raging 2 year old when you want to go to sleep is bad for the soul!

Pacing the floor and rubbing her back like she's a bloody newborn (sometimes this just gives her the opportunity to smack me in the face though )

I sympathise, the sleep issues we've had with dd2 have been utterly horrendous, its very draining.

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