Is this likely to work with a 3.5 year old?

[vladthedisorganised]

I'm having some issues with DD at the moment around leaving the house on time, and I think it's time to change my game slightly.

Her behaviour has gone downhill lately; although well behaved at nursery she really tests boundaries at home and I'm having to be increasingly heavy-handed with her to get her to realise what I won't stand for (like forcing her into her car seat rather than just taking a bit of pasta out of the jar, which is no longer cutting the mustard).

My major issue at the moment is that she takes ages to get ready in the morning. Previously we had a timetable with a star that she could stick on each square when it was time to do the next thing, but now it's ignored. She has a tantrum over getting dressed, she has a tantrum that she can't watch TV in the morning - something I've never allowed - and today's tantrum was over not being able to wear her friend's shoes to nursery! It makes mornings a complete battle and for the last week we've ended up leaving the house late.

There seems to be no end to the tantrums, and the nicey-nicey approach is driving us both insane 'I know you must be so sad that you can't wear Isabel's shoes today. Wouldn't it be lovely if you and Isabel could both wear magic shoes that would take you to nursery on fairy wings? I wish we could all have shoes like that. However, why don't you wear your wellies and I'll wear my black shoes today?' (while in my head I'm screaming 'WHY CAN'T WE JUST LEAVE THE FECKING HOUSE??')

While tearing my hair out, I wondered if allotting a 'tantrum time' would be wise - "you can have a tantrum during Tantrum Time about whatever you like, but it has to finish before the kitchen timer goes off and there are no tantrums outside of Tantrum Time." Is it worth a try? I have to admit that using the naughty step has made us even later so I'm looking for anything that'll work!

Sounds like its worth a shot? It's hard to say without knowing what tantrum level we're talking here. If they are pretty fierce then a timer might infuriate her. Or it might make her realise you're not having any of it!

DS is 3.5 and also has melt downs, often when it's time to leave the house. I just literally ignore them. chin up, child under arm if needs be, and yes, shoved in the car seat. I'm ace at rubbish small talk over the whole performance, 'Oh where's our car? I mean, It should be easy to find, it's red!'

'Snort sniff... it's... it's BLAAAACCCKK!'

'is it? It's a good job I've got you here, imagine we got in that car and it was a postman's? We'd be covered in LETTERS! ' etc etc...

Oh, good job on the magic shoes chat!

I've recently discovered that my DS (2.11) is very competitive likes a challenge.

It goes something like this -
Me: time to go out now DS, shall we get your shoes on?
DS: NO!
Me: well it is time to go out, so we need to get your shoes on. Look, I'm putting mine on. Red shoes or blue ones today?
DS: No!
Me: right, let's pick that up and get your shoes on.
DS: No! waaaaah!
Me: hmm, I bet you can't get your shoes on before I've found the keys
DS (grinning): bet I can!

....and then he puts his shoes on.

When that stops working I'm snookered.

"Either you get in the carseat or I'm going to put you in it, your choice" 3, 2.....1 and force her in the carseat.

My 4 year old generally complies with any request if I do a countdown, although it took a lot of forcing into carseats etc to get there.

I feel your pain.. my dd is 4 in two weeks. U just have to leave plenty of time so you're not in a rush and don't feel like you need to lose it. Easier said than done I know. We have been ready 10-20 mins early for nursery this week because I have made sure that I have half an hour to do a 10 min get dressed/coat shoes/hair routine with dd. distraction works sometimes. Racing each other helps sometimes.. What never ever works for me is if we are in a rush and we have to do in real time on my instructions. She senses we are in a rush and does all sorts of messing about!!

Make them think you have plenty of time. listen. be attentive, firm and fair and fun. It usually works. Good luck xx

That's a lot of star chart rewards etc. I would bin.

I would also leave the whole long talk about wearing shoes etc. Tantrum time, again wouldn't bother.

I find ds getsgrumpy because he doesn't want me to go to work. So if we have 10-15 mins of reading or playing on his terms, he's much calmer. Sometimes I pick my battles. So if he wants to wear inappropriate shoes or no coat, then fine and I bring them just in case and hand them over at nursery. He used to kick off about getting dressed - I now make a joke and put him in the mummy trap and tickle him. Or I tell him I wont talk until he gets dressed. Or sometimes he wants me to do it, which I do. End result, he's dressed.

Try being positive and reinforcing positive behaviour. They do like to please.

I recently have had success with a more basic star chart where she has to earn things like going out to play, having more than one outfit in her drawers etc. There is a lot of 'entitlement' these days I think. I set it up so all was never lost, helping with chores/ playing with little sister nicely etc could earn back 'defaults'

Thanks everyone. I think I'm just really confused myself - I don't want to raise a brat, but I don't want to be overly regimented either ('make one sound and you're on the naughty step!' that BIL uses.. not keen) I get despondent that there's a lot of entitlement around - I was mortified when DD refused to tidy up at PILs while her cousins cheerfully pitched in, for example, and I want to nip it in the bud before it gets out of hand (I appreciate that I'm almost certainly too late but it's worth a shot). There is a middle way between 'shouty parent' and 'my-child-walks-all-over-me' but to be honest I haven't found it yet, however much I try to be consistent.

I've read the How To Talk book and try to empathise so much with DD's feelings that it's driving me slowly round the bend - I must be doing it wrong as it just takes forever to get nowhere; other than that I've acknowledged that she's upset about something. Then she gets more and more annoyed that even though I seem to understand how she feels and why, I'm still insisting on her doing things that she doesn't want to do. I suspect it doesn't work for us.

It's weird because I can see the things that will work in a couple of years - like drawing up together a charter of what's important to all of us and sticking to it, but for a 3.5 year old it's too much I think. I am tempted to bin everything and start with empty drawers, an empty toybox, a broken TV and a clean slate to earn things back: I suppose I need to be a lot less lazy/ absorbed with getting myself ready, and more prepared for setting out nice things to do in the morning that don't take too long!

No don't go down the road of earning things. You want her to help because she wants to not because she must. That's why she won't tidy up - what's in it for her?

It's not easy is it.

I could lend you my raised eyebrow & tone of voice if you like - seems to work :)

The 'how to talk' book - some people seem to get on with it, it's very definitely not my thing