4 year old violent and angry...all the time?!

[nerdinator]

my 4 year old has always been a handful since she could walk and talk and since talking to a lot of health visitors, support workers and doing a course on child behaviour there seems to be no end of her bad bahaviour. she is always violent over things that are minor such as saying no. i seriously just dont know what to do with her anymore. i picked her up from school today (her 2nd day) to her continuously hitting another boy, the teacher didnt seem to notice but i was waiting to collect her so was powerless to stop it, i felt a complete fool when all the other mums noticed her doing it and when i asked her why she was hitting him she said "he was giving her a headache". on the way home she said the boy in front of us walking with his nana said she was a theif when he actually said nothing at all and his nana also told her he said nothing of the sort. coming home its worse, i get hit, slapped, shouted and her teeth gritted at me for saying "no cake till after dinner" and also other minor things such as "i will watch you on your bike after i have prepared dinner"

we also have a 9 month old who im afraid is going to grow up copying this bahaviour and then we have 2 of them like this. im so lucky we have such a great family and support network as mother in law often takes her out which is a great help, but i need this sorting, she is getting way too out of hand. her sleeping isnt great, her eating isnt great and sometimes i generally dont want to be around her. no punishment works and we have literally tried them all very consistantly since she was very small such as the naughty step, start charts, reward charts, taking toys away, removing other favorite things, sending her to her room, ignoring the behaviour but as soon as you try to ignore her she will throw anything in sight such as cups, toys and even plates sometimes.

please give me some advice
thankyou

No personal experience but I have heard wonders about this book:
www.amazon.co.uk/Explosive-Child-Understanding-Frustrated-Chronically/dp/0061906190
I hope someone else comes along and gives you some useful advice. Best of luck.

You could try reading 'how to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk'. My dd is only 11mo so haven't put it into practice yet but seemed like lots of good advice.

I'm not quite sure what to suggest as you seem to have already seen a lot of professionals. All I can say is try speaking to school and see if they can start a process to get her assessed/looked at by perhaps the educational psychologist and behaviour support.
That level of violence is unusual in a child of her age with no 'issues' or additional needs.
You have tried a lot of different strategies, how long did you persist with each one?
Does she have any periods of calm where you (or anyone) can talk to her about her behaviour.
Is she like this for other people and in all settings?

I did manage to talk to her just while she was getting into bed which is a plus as she usually doesnt let me get a word in edgeways. she is generally like this with everyone but since starting full time and having new teachers I think she is still settling in. she also tends to not be so argumentative and violent with people who she doesnt see all the time like her nursery staff. mil has always said she is exactly like her dad who had adhd as a child but non of my concerns seem to bother any health professional. she was my 1st child and I'm not saying she does have any health or behavioural problems but surely this isnt normal? a health visitor contacted nursery and asked for an assessment a couple of years ago and they seemed to have no concerns but she had only just started at the time and was quite shy. since then she has seemed to get worse and she just doesnt stop no wonder im so tired

You seem too have many issues and a confused child, ask your GP for a CHAMS Referral. there may be issues underlying that may not seem obvious. such as SID's (sensory problems) noted in your statement "He was giving me a headache" perhaps he is, may be your little one is sensitive too noise, also other sensory issues. Hence need too ask GP
for a referral too assess such problems. Talk too her ask her, how she feels when she is angry, can she remember , how she feels how other people feel. Some children have short term memory so any sanctions that are put in place are a waste of time, the reasons they are on the naughty step are forgotten by the time they get there.

My DSD has a lot of emotional/attachment type issues and being a step parent things have been really, really tough. I have used the book recommended above, how to talk so kids will listen, it is brill. We do still have issues but I feel I can manage them better now.