Where am I going wrong teaching ds5 good manners etc?

[Jemster]

Hi
My ds is 5 and I'm starting to despair at getting him to have general good manners. We have brought him up to say please & thank you but I'm often having to remind him when we are with others or at other people's houses. Surely by now he should know to say it withiyt me chipping in to remind him with 'what do you say..'
His table manners aren't great either as he seems to think it's funny to stuff too much food in, put his feet on seat, swing his cutlery round. I was brought up quite strictly and although have not been that strict with him, I have told him what good manners is but he just doesn't do it. I worry about going out with friends or him going to people's houses.
Also during hols I've noticed he gets stroppy and sulky whenever he doesn't get his way and I'm out if ideas as to how to deal with this. I don't want him to behave like a spoilt brat.
I'm finding it really hard as have 16 month dd too who is just starting to assert herself!!
I feel like I've messed up this whole parenting thing and am so worried that it's too late now to instill good discipline as he is almost 6.

Please can anyone help? I really am struggling and it's making me irritable and down which is affecting my relationship with DH.

jem I have no advice as my children are younger than that. Didnt want to read and run.

I think you will probably have to keep reinforcing it. Would he respond to a reward chart for good manners?

he's 5, they excel at being silly. Just keep cajoling him along.

My 5 nearly 6 year old DS strops like a teenager. I believe it's quite normal for boys at this age, pushing the boundaries. It is prob also attention seeking as I'm afraid. Re-in force the manners bit, don't answer (ie 'I didn't hear you') if he can't add please or thankyou and ignore the strops. I walk away.

Sounds normal. Ds1 is only getting good at manners now he's 7. To me it seems developmental, it's like he suddenly cares about being a nice boy, gets embarrassed if he does something that might look bad ("was it bad that I spoke with my mouth full earlier, I felt really embarrassed"). This was said without me even mentioning it! Something seems to "click", although he's still silly and childish, just much less. It's nothing you're doing wrong.

You?re not doing anything wrong, just keep reminding him, gently. I asked my DS who is 15 and he says, if you keep going your DS will have good manner when by the time he is 10, then he will lose them again as a teenager (my DS should know!) then he will get them back again when he?s an adult. So there you go!

although have not been that strict with him, I have told him what good manners is but he just doesn't do it

I don't think they listen too much at that age bit they never stop watching you.

As long as you show him the courtesy and respect you want him to display ('please can you put your things away, so sorry to interrupt your game but it's lunchtime, do you mind coming up to get your pyjamas on' etc) then he will get it in the end.

And huge amounts of praise for lovely table manners and ignoring the silly stuff. Mine used to love going out to tea; they believed the waitresses in little OAP tea shoppes would bodily eject anyone whose manners were less than perfect [wicked mother.]