reflux or an allergy ??? advice please

[yasmin247]

Can anyone please offer any advice.... my 10 week old baby has been poorly now for almost 8 weeks. ..symptoms are :

• A blotchy rash which comes out every now and again. It never completely goes and seems to remain under the skin.
• constipation/loose stools
• fussiness / crying at the bottle
• sick after every feed
• seems uncomfortable after every feed
• when put down ( at an angle, never flat ).. is still wriggly and does back arching.

Basically we have been back and forth to the doctors and paediatricians and don't seem to be getting anywhere. We started baby on cow and gate stage 1, switched to comfort milk, then paeds changed us to hungry baby milk.. then lactose free milk after baby's stools tested positive for reducing sugars. Still no improvement so was changed to neutramigen, this seemed to make the sickness worse. Now the paeds don't think baby has any intolerance or that it could be a cows milk protection allergy, they just think its severe reflux... changed last week to a reflux milk and although baby is now taking more ounces, she seems sluggish, is still being sick just the same and seems uncomfortable after every feed.. keep asking to be referred for allergy testing but appear to be wasting my breath.

Feel fed up, a little stressed and worried about my baby.. has anyone experienced the same/similar or have any advice please ??? :-(

(Confused)

That does sound stressful, you really have my sympathy. I can't offer much advice but could she be milk protein intolerant? (apparently diff to straight forward milk/lactose intolerance). My cousins little one was so I can ask her for more info if you like. You might also benefit from re-posting this under breast and bottle feeding section too; their might be others who have experienced this there x

I am sure you have considered this but you didn't mention it, is the wriggling and being uncomfortable after feeds wind? Does she burp easily? Wind also makes babies sick.
Have you tried different teats for the fussiness at the bottle? Too fast/slow?

There's also an allergies section on MN so you might be able to get advice there about allergy testing.

Thank you both for your replies.
Ladypop yes please to you asking your cousin. Thank you for offering.
The wriggling and uncomfortableness does start after baby has taken feed. Although she can be wriggly during feed too. We tend to wind her during and after feed. Sometimes wind comes up easily sometimes not and to be honest it doesn't seem to make any difference to the sickeness :-(
She can also start to be sick up to an hour after feed. We tend to see the following pattern..
Sick immediately after feed - milky
Sick about an hour after feed, the texture is thicker and the longer the time since the feed the more watery it becomes.

Last night for example, baby fed at 7.30. We kept her upright for half an hour as we always do and as soon as we put her down the sickness started. It carried on until 10 pm. It doesn't matter how long we keep her upright for either and occasionally she is sick immediately after feed.
Will have a look at the allergies section too x

Can anyone please advise me how to re post this under a different section ? Sorry im new to this.

Hi my dd had horrific reflux. Peads diagnosed this and also cow milk protein intolerance. They diagnosed the 2 together cos they are really reluctant to do allergy testing until 18months cos if its just an intolerance they often grow out of it so it's easier to just cut it out of the diet and gradually reintroduce at a later date and take it from there (personally I think money saving thing!)

Have they not suggested any medication for reflux? Dd as well as a soya formula once I stopped bf was given domperidone and ranitidene. Didn't make her symptom free but put an end to the 10 hour screaming fits and allowed her to sleep

You have my absolute sympathy though. It's bloody tough and half te time you feel your bangin your head against a brick wall

The allergies section is here
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/allergies

You'll have to start a new thread there, but you can just copy and paste what you've written here.

Hi melliebobs
Thank you for replying.
Baby is currently on omezprazole and domperidone and the dosage has already been increased twice :-(
Paed not convinced it's an intolerance or a cmp allergy because there was no improvement on the neutramigen, to be honest things seemed to get worse. I spoke with allergy UK yesterday and was advised that neutramigen does still have cmp in it although it's broken down so the body shouldn't recognise it.
I agree, I think its a money saving spin that they are reluctant to test for allergy but im not giving up just yet.
Just because she is gaining a little weight and looks well im not being listened too but she is only happy when being sick or opening her bowels :-(

Hello again! here is what my cousin had to say about milk protein intolerance:
"symptoms were writhing and moaning after a feed, like she had wind/indigestion. Was awful to watch her. Plus alot of reflux. Gp insisted it was lactose intolerance but i knew it wasnt. Child specialist at hospital said milk protein intolerance and prescribed 'Pepti Jnr' milk. She only needed it til about 12 months. Was fine on normal then. Tell her to research online and be insistent with the gp!!! They know little about it incredibly!!!!"
.....I hope that is of use to you x

I think I would be looking for a second opinion from an allergies paed.

Oh and carrying in a sling rather than putting down.

Many thanks ladypop x
Thanks simlondon... I will asking for that today at the paediatric review ..

Hi, sounds like allergy more than straight reflux to me (my DS was reflux bub).. Have a look at fedup.com.au website they will have lots of advice, info, parents stories about milk protein intolerance, allergies etc ..

Have you got cot/bassinet raised a little? I raised his crib with folded towel under mattress, then got a cot wedge for cot for the reflux..

Its so frustrating when you know your bub is in discomfort and you cant find a health professional to diagnose, or even listen! All the best.

Hi cabbagehead
Thanks for your reply.
I will have a look at the website. ..
We have baby raised when on changing mat and a reflux pilow in her cot. Any other time we have a swing/bouncer to hand.
Thanks for your best wishes.. off to the appointment shortly..

Poster I have every sympathy for your situation. My son (now 10 years old) had similar symptoms. It drove me to distraction as a new mum. We went through a series of tests - reflux, colic treatments, dietary review with a hospital dietition etc. I was continually covered in sick, he cried incessantly all day and night and he never kept still. I lost count of how many times I was advised about basic burping techniques that I was already efficient at. It was a superb health visitor (via baby and toddler group) who finally took action when he was 18 months old. He was taken into the children's unit of the local hospital and patch tested in controlled circumstances. They found out that he was allergic to dairy (and therefore formula). He was prescribed a milk called Nutramigen (think that was how it was spelt). It tastes savoury but gave him everything that he needed. We were also prescribed egg replacer and other substitutes so that he could now be weaned properly.

In your situation; sometimes health visitors/G.Ps etc hold off on diagnosis for the first 3 months as the child's digestion is still developing.

Keep prodding people both for support for yourself and your baby. You're doing a good job.

Anything else you need - just shout out.

Good Luck

It sounds really tough for both of you

I just wanted to make sure you were clear about the difference between an allergy and intolerance. An allergy is an immune response to an allergen, and typically results in hives, itching, swelling, and more severe cases, trouble breathing etc. Most allergies can be confirmed by a blood test known as a RAST test, or a skin prick test, though non IgE allergies do exist, which aren't picked up by a blood test.

An intolerance is a digestive problem, typically showing as tummy ache, unusual poos or vomiting. There's no definitive test for intolerances so they're harder to diagnose. An elimination diet is the only way really, by removing the trigger and seeing an improvement.

Your baby does have a mixture of symptoms which makes it harder to make a clear diagnosis, and trial and error with different milks and drugs may be the only way forward, unfortunately.

I really hope you find a combination that helps.

We have seen the paediatrician today and he is sticking with his theory of this just being severe reflux and has basically said there is nothing else to try and she will grow out of it :-(
Having said that he has said we can try neoncate as a last resort to rule out a possible allergy to cmp.
What is puzzling me is why her stools tested positive for reducing sugars and the staydown milk isn't staying down... she is literally feeding now every two hours and then spending the rest of the time on the run up to the next feed being sick. ... is it worth changing the milk again ??

Thank you both for your replies x
It's nice to know we are not alone xx

Ask your paed for a prescription for neocate formula.

Our baby is v allergic and has horrendous (mechanical) reflux too and this formula has made things better for us - although we still have reflux issues, all allergy symptoms have gone.

Thanks alexa007