Nearly 7yo DD has no interests

[Claennister]

DD has absolutely no interest in doing anything new or different. She will draw the same picture again and again and put on the same "show" again and again, but apart from that and wanting to watch TV she is utterly without an interest in doing anything.

I have brought in all sorts of exciting things for us to do together, but she's not interested. Baking with mummy? You make it, mummy, I'll eat it. Craft? You make me a mask, I'll wear it for 5 seconds. Stamps? I'll draw you the same picture as before then add one random stamp to it. Let's go to the beach and make sandcastles - mummy, you make the sandcastles, I'll watch (and criticise). Can we leave now?

She wants to do nothing but watch TV (often putting it on then ignoring it, which makes me turn it off - TV is not a background which you can use all day long) and when I spend all my efforts and sometimes plenty of cash on an activity all I get for it is "Is it finished? Can I watch TV now?". She treats all other activities as frustrating interruptions to the TV. We have simply bucket loads of stuff for her to do, but every single one is greeted with constant groans of "Can I nearly watch TV yet?" "Is it nearly TV time?" "Is it TV time after this one yet, mummy?" I don't want to make it into even more of a reward and focal point for her. sigh

It isn't that we don't do other things, we do loads of them, it's just that she moans about them all. She is not interested in the journey, only results which lead to stopping, which lead to not having to do it any more.

Worse than that, I am a member of another mums group where it seems their children are angels day and night (unless they have been diagnosed with a learning problem of some kind, which is the only possible reason for a child to be non-angelic or not top of the class) and if I talk about TV they reassure me their children never watch it. Of course! The very middle class attitude that TV only happens to other people. Yet they are familiar with all the shows and characters...

I want to see if I can encourage her to have some interest in doing things rather than making me do them for her, but I'm all out of activities which are new - take her to an art place and she wanted to know when she could leave - "When I've drawn my picture can I go home?". Everything is something to be completed and ticked off so she can stop.

I'm so tired of it all.

There could be a few reasons behind this.

1: Medical causes. She could have some sort of condition that makes her lethargic and apathetic. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Lupus, anaemia (especially if she's a faddy eater) could be sapping her enthusiasm for anything that requires more thought than lying down and watching TV. I have fibromyalgia, and i was a lot like that when I was younger, I didn't want to go anywhere or do anything.

2: No creative streak. Not all kids are interested in creating things, just like not all kids like sport. It might take a bit more digging in unusual places to find something she can get passionate about.

3: Story-follower. I know you say she turns on the TV as background noise sometimes, but do you ever find she gets completely absorbed in a show? How is her reading? Some kids have a great inner imaginative voice and take in stories more emotionally than others. There are hobbies where she can make the most of this.

Anyway, that's all I have to suggest. What are her favourite toys? And what does she watch on TV? It might be a clue to unlocking her interests.

What if the tv "broke" for a few days? (leave it on a boring channel and take the batteries out of the remote, or even take the plug off the cable maybe?) Then she can't watch it at all, so it might break the cycle if she's forced to do other things.

Have you tried a primary science set? They're fab and absorbing. Making things happen is exciting for little ones. The learning Resources one from Fun Learning (online) is great. Often overlooked in favour of craft.

Does she ever just play, with dolls or Lego or anything? I banned Tv for a while and all the toys came out and they were all played with.

Ds was the same with his x box, it was like crack!

I took the plug off.

Suddenly he could concentrate again.

Have you tried things like swimming lessons or gym lessons? Does she like reading books or comics or riding a scooter?

So if the TV isn't on she will draw?

Even if its the" same picture" over n over at least she is interested in putting pencil to paper. what would she do if there were no paper either?

DS ( who is 7 )seems to like rolling around the floor and leaping over the sofa, if left to his own devices. Tho after a bit of doing that he might read a comic or play with his toy cars. When he does watch TV ( i-player) he wants to watch the same program again and again.

When she continually moans, do you give in and switch on the tv? If so, you are feeding her habit, and she knows that by complaining, she will get what she wants.

You need to take control of the situation, and only allow the tv on at set times. Make it clear that the tv will not be on between these periods. She will probably moan, but if you are strict, she will soon adapt to doing other things, although initially will probably,y say she is bored.

Maybe your tv should 'break' completely for a couple of weeks. When ours broke for real I wouldn't agree to us buying a new one for a few weeks and we had to amuse ourselves in different ways. It was great and I was really disappointed when the neighbours offered us a perfectly good on they were taking to the dump.

I am seriously tempted to make ours break on purpose again sometimes.

Another though might be that she is using it as anxiety management. Children with ASD often use repetitive and very familiar activities to to help their anxiety because the demands on them are low and there are no surprises. My own ten year old with AS would watch tv all day every day if allowed simply because it is relaxing for her. Could it be a stress management thing for your DD?

I get the impression that your DD will do activities, she just doesn?t want to and grumbles about it? She may have a rather anxious and perfectionist character and not want to try new things because she isn?t confident, or hesitate to do things with you because you can do them better? Or she may not want to do anything for very long, especially not after a busy day at school.

I wouldn?t worry so much about trying new things. She may feel more confident doing familiar repeated things. Some things to try might be:

1. Be really really evil ? restrict her TV to a couple of hours a day max at a specific time. She?ll hate you but maybe if you are absolutely rock-steady about it she?ll start to enjoy other stuff (though she may never show you any pleasure!)
2. Do some descriptive commenting and/or attends, and do a few minutes of only that kind of attention each day while she?s doing something active like painting, making sandcastles, baking. It?s like doing a running commentary but without any judgment, no praise or criticism or suggestions for how else to do it, it sounds completely barking but it can be very effective for anxious/perfectionist types, even quite small amounts helped my DS stay interested.
3. Do some totally child-led play (anything except watching TV!) for 10-15 minutes each day.
4. Encourage other kinds of passive amusement too ? story CDs, you reading to her.
5. If she has the co-ordination for it, simple sewing on binca can be very soothing ? not necessarily making a picture, just rows of simple stitches in different colours to make little mats. My DS did a lot of it at that age.

"often putting it on then ignoring it, which makes me turn it off - TV is not a background which you can use all day long"

Coming at it from a different angle, what does she do when the tv is on but she is ignoring it? If she is playing her own games / involved in other activities but just likes the tv as a background noise, does it really matter? There are plenty of households where that is the norm, and if not tv then radio. I grew up with radio 2 or 4 on pretty much 100% of the time, and find that background burble comforting.

Could you persuade her sometimes to swap tv in the background for story tape or radio in the background if you'd feel happier with that?

?Medical causes. She could have some sort of condition that makes her lethargic and apathetic. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Lupus, anaemia (especially if she's a faddy eater) could be sapping her enthusiasm for anything that requires more thought than lying down and watching TV.?
Sadly this is not unlikely as there is some genetic illness in the family. They keep evaluating her and saying she is fine, but then I was symptomatic for 16 years before I got diagnosed.

?And what does she watch on TV??
Anything! If we ask what she wants it?s often Scooby Doo or Spongebob, but she honestly doesn?t care provided it?s on. I wonder if she thinks of it as company? (only child)

?Have you tried a primary science set??
We tried a few things but she is a little slower in her development, so it would need to be a set for age 4-5 or so. She always just wants to watch while I do it, which lasts all of 10 seconds then she says ?You do it by yourself? and leaves.

?Have you tried things like swimming lessons or gym lessons? Does she like reading books or comics or riding a scooter??
Terrified of swimming lessons, terrified of gym lessons, can?t really co-ordinate a scooter and won?t practise. She likes to read books so long as it doesn?t take more than ten seconds! She takes ballet classes and loves them, but isn't much interested in ballet without the other girls in her class, whom she adores but don't seem to want to come to our house to play.

?When she continually moans, do you give in and switch on the tv??
No, never. She does eventually go and play with something if I ignore her ?crying? for about ten minutes, but it?s very second best to the TV.

?I get the impression that your DD will do activities, she just doesn?t want to and grumbles about it? She may have a rather anxious and perfectionist character and not want to try new things because she isn?t confident, or hesitate to do things with you because you can do them better??
Some and some, there are a few activities which she will do and moan about and a much, much larger list of things she will not do at all. She certainly is a perfectionist, she won?t do anything if she might do it wrong, and she struggles with her reading because she won?t try a word in case it?s wrong. It takes each teacher till the summer half term to coax anything out of her and then she gets a new teacher and shuts back down again. It would be a disaster of epic proportion if she thought a word was ?what? and it turns out to say ?when?. And since school is so much about producing a ?right? thing I suppose she worries that home life is about ?right? pictures, ?right? baking, etc.

?Coming at it from a different angle, what does she do when the tv is on but she is ignoring it? If she is playing her own games / involved in other activities but just likes the tv as a background noise, does it really matter??
The TV is quite large (husband?s idea!!) and it uses quite a lot of electricity. I hate paying for several hours of ignored electricity every day, the bills are quite big enough. She comes and demands absolutely instantaneous attention from me during the adverts then runs away again when the program comes back on. I wish that didn?t annoy me so much, but it does! I?m not a secondary object to be pulled from whatever I?m doing when there is no TV and discarded as soon as there is something on the tele! I wish it worked that we could gradually encourage her into new activities during the commercials and she?d sustain them later, but it doesn?t seem to work that way, the TV is top dog and it trumps everything. I am tempted to record commercials which are several minutes long to get some time together ;)
We could never convince her the TV is broken as there is absolutely no way I could persuade DH not to watch it for even 24 hours (see where she gets it from?) and she?d hear it on when she goes to the loo and confront us with the evidence in the morning that she heard the TV on. I don?t know that she?d fall for it getting stuck on the news channel because she knows her electrical goods very well and would fairly quickly spot things like missing batteries. The only thing I could do is send a feed over the network because that plays over the top of whatever else you select, but goodness knows where I can get hours and hours of boring material, if I sneak into another room to activate it she?ll spot that too. She doesn?t miss a trick where electrical goods are concerned. I might give her a try with an audiobook, though, good idea. I think that might give her the same sense of company.

If she likes back ground noise, can you put the radio on and when she asks for the Telly you could say 'not atm I'm listening to the radio'

Could she do an activity out of the house where she regularly meets friends / makes friends e.g Brownies? My daughter goes to dancing, ice skating, piano, riding, swimming lessons that all take her outside of the home. She would otherwise be exactly the same and be glued to the TV (which is a bonus sometimes as an unpaid babysitter when I need it...am a crummy mummy?)

OP you said she loves ballet. Could you perhaps enroll her in a couple of other dance classes? Help her to develop her interest in that area? Would she be interested in going to watch a ballet?

The more you write the more you seem to be painting a picture of a very anxious child.

I'm not suggesting that you're doing anything to make her anxious but the world does seem to hold a lot of fear for her and I can understand how being at home watching the TV is her holy grail.

How have the teachers responded to her behaviour in school? Have they suggested involving any outside professionals? Maybe she covers up her anxieties in school?

You've described a child with at least a slight developmental delay, difficulties with gross motor skills, some social communication difficulties, irrational fears, perfectionism which limits her opportunities to participate in everyday activities and quite rigid thinking.

I would suggest asking your GP or school nurse for a referral to CAMHS or a community paediatrician who can check for a neurodevelopmental disorder.

Having read your recent post perhaps taking away the things she relies on isn't such a good idea. Maybe she needs tv for respite from things which frighten her.

I would suggest asking your GP or school nurse for a referral to CAMHS or a community paediatrician who can check for a neurodevelopmental disorder.

This sounds like good advice. :)

When you said she was drawing the same picture over and over again, that slightly pushed my button for a developmental issue, but it wasn?t enough by itself. Now you have added this other stuff, and especially her anxiety in school, I agree with the others, it could be a good idea to get her development checked out by CAMHS. Her level of anxiety in spite of what seem to be pretty secure and caring home circumstances do suggest something along those lines.

Meanwhile can you gently persist with the activities that she will do, keeping them short and giving her lots of ?attends? during that time? If she wants to draw the same picture over and over again, that?s OK, it?s where she is. If she is willing to pat a stamp onto one of her pictures before she disappears, that?s even better, and she deserves plenty of praise for it. Make her feel like a success for doing that (and it may count as a success for you too, that you helped her to do that much)

I really feel your frustration and hurt about having a child who seems to ?use? you and who only wants to be in front of the TV. But I have a feeling that being in front of the TV is what she can cope with, and there may be many things she would like to do but she is unable or afraid to try.

I don't think she needs a doctor, just the tv turning off.

My 7 year old would watch tv all day if I let him. It's limited to 1 hour/day school days and 2 hours during holiday max. Let her get a bit bored and she'll figure out things to do. If she gets really bored ask her what she'd like to do. Ds can manage quite long board games now (we play cluedo, talisman, proper monopoly, Lego games).

I agree Karo, do would my ds , interestingly at that age he also drew the same things over and over again.

Interesting that some are pointing to more assessment, she does have quite the history!

She was born at 36 weeks exactly, but because she was 7 hours over the cut-off for "premature" she was not followed up on the premature track, she was followed up as a Term baby. She really struggled to feed and after a festival of projectile vomit leading to them sending a specialist cleaner to my room and the collection of the 36 towels she'd thrown up on, she was taken to special care to get her blood sugar up and get her breathing properly. She was there a week or so, but we had to keep taking her back to the weight loss clinic, feeding clinic, jaundice clinic, clinic clinic.... I lose track!

She scored not a lot at her 6 week assessment as she was only 2 weeks corrected, but because they didn't consider her prem she stayed in the normal track, so she was behind with her development but it was chalked up to her prematurity.

Next up she developed bad asthma and we had her in and out of A&E but she was followed up quite badly until she was finally placed on a week of oral steroids and a good dose of inhaled steroid and she stopped having the major attacks for a while.

Next she develops a milk allergy and lands up back in hospital. Referred to the dietician but she was not given any replacement formula as they thought they could bully me into continuing to breastfeed even though she was refusing the breast. So again she lost a lot of weight. They took her into the allergy clinic to formally diagnose her but again there was no help, just diagnosis - tick.

Now these may start getting out of the correct order now!

Next we noticed she was not very responsive to sound, so she got into the hearing impairment system, but we were put off for years and years saying she'd grow out of itin a few months. That dragged on for 4.5 years, and thank goodness for the local Deaf school who took her into their nursery. Meanwhile she didn't learn to speak properly because of her difficulties with hearing so next up was speech therapy. That was going well and they suggested asking for a place in the special speech and language unit school for her. Then her core speech therapist fell ill with cancer and the next one came along and discharged her!

She starts school and the school referred her straight back to speech therapy, which she still has, though I'm not sure how useful that is for her as she's making very little progress and is only developing more anxiety about speaking and using the sounds she knows she can't get right.

Somewhere in the middle of all that she was referred to paediatrics for gross motor delay as she was not walking at 23 months, but at 24 months she suddenly began walking so they discharged her. She was followed up by rheumatology and physiotherapy at some point too, but they found no problem in her joints so they also discharged her.

Currently, the school asked did we want her referred back into (I think!) Occupational Therapy because her gross motor skills are borderline concerning. Because they said it was borderline and they were not enormously concerned, just a little, we decided she had been through enough people assessing her and deciding she was just a little this or a little that.

And therein seems to lie the issue, she is a LITTLE delayed, a LITTLE deaf, a LITTLE speech problem, so she's almost always in the "monitor but do nothing" group. She usually walks away with a diagnosis of non-specific delay, and I just don't know whether I can bear to go back around the system, or even which system to go round. We get a very non-commital "Weeeeeelll, we could send her back to paediatrics if you are really worried" then look at me as if they want me to say no. I could say yes, but they have been no use before!

We considered having her in nursery for an additional year and I'm sad that we didn't sometimes, as she is not as socially and emotionally mature as the rest of her class, but we were pushed to send her because she was up to it academically.

So perhaps the TV is the least of the issue!

Personally I would get rid of the TV for a month and see what happens. Then start to seek help if things are the same.

Hi op.
Checkout the tinsley house support thread.
Also google retained reflex therapy and ait.
Good luck x

Ooh that is really hard Claennister! It?s as if her problems are enough to make everything a bit of a struggle, but not enough to get her really solid help? I can see why she?d want to chill out in front of the TV all the time.

In a way I agree the TV is the least of it, and you could decide to let it go (I don?t believe those non-TV mums and anyway I see TV as positive in many ways) but on the other hand it might be something you could tackle if it troubles you. I wouldn?t expect your DD to be happy about it, because she would have to learn to feel comfortable doing other things while TV is still very much her preference, but what would be the difficulty about openly limiting her TV time to specific times of day? And being ?busy? so that she can?t use you as an amusement during the adverts, only giving her Mum-time when it isn?t TV-time?

And is there any chance of going back to the paediatritian and getting a thorough multidisciplinary assessment of everything developmental - hearing, gross and fine motor skills, language, communication, social, problem-solving, the works? Sometimes the professionals leave it up to the parents to push for help, otherwise they do nothing, especially if a child is not causing bother in school.

You have clearly been thorough an awful lots and I can completely understand why you wouldn't want to go through another assessment, seeing another set of doctors.

In some areas, Worcestershire being an example, children are assessed by a panel of experts when a neurodevelopmental disorder is suspected. Reports from assessments by other clinicians and a developmental history form a large part of the assessment so you wouldn't necessarily have to repeat very much at all.

ASD is called a pervasive developmental disorder because it covers many areas of a child's development. The picture you have painted could well be one of a child who deserves assessment for this type of disorder.

In the meantime try Googling Tony Attwood and his writing on girls with Asperger's Syndrome in case it strikes a chord with you.

Her difficulties are clearly having quite an impact on her life now and I know from personal experience that this isn't a process to be embarked upon lightly but I don't think you would be doing her any favours by putting off further assessment.