My 3yr old DD is frustrating me!

[Mandymoo]

Hi

My dd is 3.4 yrs and is a beautiful, lovely little girl who really is the apple of my eye BUT.......................................................................... she is really frustrating me atm.

1. She whines for England and can barely answer a question without scowling, shouting or being generally groucy.

1. She talks endlessly about playing with certain children and as soon as they come to play, she scowls at them and refuses to play. Its actually embarrasing as the other mums obviously dont want their children feeling bad because my child wants them "to go home"

1. She refuses to go to the toilet on her own at home even though she does it at nursery and preschool

1. When ANYONE (even grandparents) say hello or goodbye to her, she scowls and buries her head into me or teddy - i find this very hard to deal with as it is just plain rude imo but i dont know how to deal with it effectively. When she was younger i would say it for her but tbh i think shes more than old enough to be able to say that herself.

It sounds like im quite down on her atm which i really dont mean to be - i just want to know how best to deal with this as its getting to the point where its easier to stay at home sometimes rather than have people dare try to socialise with her!

Your thoughts and suggestions are eagerly awaited!!

TIA X

PS. i should add that i am expecting number 2 (a son) in a few weeks and am obviously giving her the benefit of the doubt in a lot of things atm but i really want to get her out of this "situation" as quickly as possible.

Anyone? Please?

On the whinging front know exactly what you mean but sory no help whatsoever as mine is doing my head in too.

mine is about the same age and we have all those sorts of behaviour - at the moment NO is her favourite word and she does not want to do anything she is asked and then does what you tell her not to...

it could be related to the new babe as well as her finding her feet so to speak.

Is she getting enough sleep?

Do you ask her to repeat herself nicely?

What do you do when she whines?

What makes her smile?

HMMM, well not sure i can give advice as I only put my own plea for help on here yesterday (29 mth old where did I go wrong)
BUT I can say that I know how you feel, my daughter scouls at people and if anyone has the cheek to tell her off or say no she gives the look of death.
She is very sociable though and loves having friends to play but is not very good at sharing at the moment and I have met several kids who do the 'you go home' bit.
Have you noticed your daughters behaviour changing over a period of time? might sound obvious but is it not connected to imminent arrival and her being very territorial and clingy over you and 'her patch'especially as she knows soon she will be sharing both

6 months behind you, but snap!

I have the whining one... not helped by it really irritating my friend which makes me more embarrassed.

Not so much #2, as we only really see the one set of friends and she thinks she should live there

Toilet - I'm getting to the bribery stage. She has only been to 5 preschool session so far (possibly not even that many), and I was when they told me that she took herself to the toilet - she refuses point blank here!!! Finally got her to yesterday by refusing to take her until I'd finished putting the washing out, and said I'd meet her up there when I was done... she decided that was better than wet knickers. Not been brave enough to call her bluff before now though!

1. Yup - mainly we walk into my friend's house (the one she wants to live at), and she burys her head and refuses to speak.

We also have 5.... Mumbling if she is asking for something, and looking down. Drives me nuts!

I've just had baby #2... believe me, at the moment you are finding it even more trying because you are worrying about her reaction to new baby, and you are tired. I'm just starting to relax a bit more about the reaction to new baby business - she seems to be forgiving me for bringing him into the house now .

Not a lot of helpful suggestions - I'm going with staying calm (as much as I can), and trying to gently encourage her out of it with the hiding. The toilet I have now decided to just be tough and do battle of wills - we might end up with a soggy carpet though!!! The whinging, I am telling her that I will talk to her/listen when she is speaking properly. It normally takes a couple of times repeating it, but she does stop.

Thanks guys for your replies - tbh she has always been this way but i have always made excuses such as "she's tired" or "she's ill" etc etc but after 3 yrs of it i have run out of ways to try and get her to be sociable, etc. This morning we went to see an old colleague and i gave her a pep talk beforehand, gently explaining that should someone say hello to her then it might be nice to say it back. Anyway, my friend says the dreaded word and dd hides between my legs and scowls. I asked her after why she did it and she said "because i'm shy" - that's my mum's doing im afraid. My mum is constantly saying "oh are you shy today?" and it drives me up the wall. I keep asking her not to say it but i think its a generation thing. The in laws do it too.

With the toilet issue - i today refused to take her and she eventually went herself although she shouted out to me when it came to washing her hands as she couldnt turn the tap on.

I know baby 2 is going to have a huge effect on her (and me and dh!) but tbh this has been going on for months and i know i should have dealt with it long before now but i just kept telling myself it was a phase and that when she started preschool she would come out of herself - but she just doesnt seemed to have changed.

She goes to ballet on a sat morning with her little friend but refuses to sing the songs and sometimes refuses to hold hands with other girls for the dancing! What the hell do i do? I cant force her to do these things.

I am just running out of ideas.........................................................

If ds is doing something that winds me up I wrap it up into a "Freddie the Penguin" story. My father invented him and he's basically Bob really, although he's a little blue penguin that lives in Oamaru his burrow has our house number and does the same things that Bob has done.

So if he was whinging a lot - I would tell a Freddie story were another character was whinging and Freddie was sad, and then he used a nice voice and Freddie was happy.

I've read a couple of NZ experts on shyness and they say that you should get tough - prepare them, but then if they do the hiding thing you should put them in the car and go home explaining that it's not acceptable. She is being shy because bizarrly she thinks thats what Grandma wants - because she gave that behaviour a label. In this method she needs to know what being sociable is. Try to find Diane Levy on this.

my DS is quite similiar and the same age.He does the hiding thing and so on. I picked up a parenting book in a charity shop the other week and it echoes a bit of what threebob was saying.

It has various scenarios of behaviour and one is where a little girl hides behind her mum and won't say hello to her mums friend. this book says what you can do is when the girl didnt respond is to simply ignore it and carry on with your conversation and if the other person says 'oh isn't she shy ' or something like that, you say ' no she isn't . she just doesn't feel like talking right now, she will later.'

the book says if we want a child to overcome a fault, we have to find the reason behind it, and then without talking about it, act in such a way that the child doesn't get what they think they should get. IE in this case - attention.

I've not really tried it out yet so I don't know if it works. I have ignored his shyness at times, other times I have said 'say hello' that type of thing. Neither seems to have made any impact.

On the other hand my DS used to be a lot shyer and uncommunicative with others - he has changed hugely in the past year so it could be an age thing too and just part of growing up - some people are outgoing, some are not.

Anyway hope this is of some use.

I'm going to be posting a similar thread soon...

In the meantime, my DD is 2yrs 9mths. She also has a tendancy to whine, so we have had a 'talk' about the voice ( as recomemended by other mumsnetters ;- ))We say, oh it that something making a noise or we can't hear what you're saying when you talk like that or Ooh is that Swiper (as in Dora the explorer) followed by a You need to tell me in a nice voice.

All this has seen to have done the trick & although the whiney voice does come out, it does go away much quicker.

Unable to advise on the others I'm afraid.
Gigwig 's advice about saying she doesn't want to talk at the moment sounds good - what book is that from ?

Today i took dd to a musical group for the first time (normally worked on Thursdays and am now on mat leave). Gave dd a "pep" talk beforehand about joining in and stuff (not heavy handed at all)and bless her she really did try her best. She sat on her own on a mat during most of the group (which is a BIG thing believe me as she normally ends up cuddles in on my lap) and whilst she had her thumb stuch in her mouth for most of it and didnt sing the songs, she told me she enjoyed it after. I felt awful about having to talk to her prior to going but i just really want her to enjoy herself but she seems so very scared of other children, other people and seems to hold back on everything, to the point of not even playing a musical instrument for fear of someone paying her some attention. It breaks my heart to see a child (let alone my own child) like this. What can I do to make things easier for her?

I may sound like a pushy mum but I am anything but - i am very sensitive to my dd's needs. I just want her to be a child and not worry about "looking silly" or "people laughing at me" as she's told me in the past when ive asked her why she didnt want to dress up for a christmas party. Surely that is not a normal thing for a 3 yr old to be worrying about - a 3yr old should not be worrying about anything should they?

I suppose im just worried that she's going to be lonely in the longrun because whenever a child comes close to her or wants to play (other than a select 2 or 3 children who she sees regulalry), she scowls at them and they go away again.

Am i just being over protective?

bump? any advice?

I'm sure Mandymoo that you should let her be completely herself. I am sure also it's an age thing - she is just learning and getting the social skills that will come out when she's older.

I feel really strongly that kids shouldn't be expected to 'join in' all the time - my DS (also 3!) is resistant to it as well. He also has what I think of as a heightened sense of self awareness (like your DD worrying about how others perceive her re dressing up) and I think it's part and part of a sensitive nature (and intelligence!).

I just feel passionately that we should let them be themselves, with no pressure. Carry on doing as you are and giving her the opportunities for socialising and joining in, but without any pressure. I think with these senstive types just appreciating them for what they are and what they do has to be confidence building and good for their self esteem.

Not all adults are joier-inners and it doesn't make them sad and lonely.

However, I know exactly what you mean about wanting to see your child happy and carefree; I just think the way to go about it is benign neglect of it - age will sort 90% of it I'm sure. And simply accepting them and enjoying what you love about them will sort the rest.

All sounds familiar & normal for a 3 yearI think they all go through phases of.
They always let you down at the wrong moment though, when ds was about 3 the vicars wife stopped to speak & gently said hello to him. He hid behind my leg & shouted for gods sake go away!

I know you guys are right about just letting her be herself. Its hard though. When ive got preschool and nursery telling me that "ooohh she's a bit quiet isnt she" every time i pick her up like its a bad trait to have and a negative thing. It drives me up the wall. Now im feeling like im bowing to their way of thinking cos im making her join in things when she doesnt really want to. I dont know what to do to make her happy and feel secure in group situations.

I really know how you feel and want to give you a hug! They're just so young, so very young - I think it's a non-problem really, you may well find that at school she functions completely differently because she is that much older...Don't let the pre-school's comments affect you AT ALL. So if they're remarking that she's quiet - what are they recommending? That she goes to boot camp for three year olds to make her NOT quiet??? You can't make people what they aren't, or more relevantly here, what they are not YET!

Give her loads of time before you even worry about it. You are doing all the right socialiation things.

I think she sounds a delightful girl and I bet she's bright. She will come into her own in life! Just try not to take any comments about her as criticisms - if the pre-school had any real concerns about her they would be telling you in an arranged meeting!

with the feeling happy and secure ingroup situations, I feel the key is once more to let her do what comes naturally - if it's watching with her thumb in her mouth, fine! As long as she is not feeling pressure to do anything she's not ready to, she will be absorbing lots just from watching.

My pre-school ladies say that they never exert pressure but simply encourage - sometimes it has an effect, sometimes not - that's how kids learn I guess.

Sparklemagic - thanks so much for your wise words - you have put it into perspective for me!