Been potty training for a year, and accidents, pls help!

[MacMac123]

I am at my wits end.
It's been over a year since I started potty training DS, now 3 and 9 months.
He has always been fine on wees, but terrible in poos. He knows he's doing a poo because he takes himself off into a corner and does it, and he has so many accidents.
He actually had a few months where he did really well but last two weeks have been awful and he's back at square 1.
I am so sick of picking him up from nursery with a poo in his pants that tonight I was really cross with him. The nursery don't help as the kids are all outside at the end of the day and that seems to be their excuse for not 'noticing' the smell but that is a whole other thread. gRRR!
The patterns I've noticed are

• he was better in term time whilst at pre school, but being back at nursery for summer hols has had him worse again
• he knows when he's done it because i can tell from the look on his face hes worried about telling me he's got poo in his pants.
• he doesn't have accidents at home, he goes to the loo.
• he has accidents at nursery and if we're out.

What can I do? I've tried star charts, bribery, guilt trips, anger, losing his favourite things. What's wrong with him? Why won't it click in?
Has anyone else experienced this?

Tonight he said 'are you sick of me mummy' and I feel so upset about it. I just don't know what to try next. Pls help!

One thing I should add is that as a baby and under 2 he had terrible constipation. Once it was so bad that he has trying to do a poo whilst lying on his changing mat and I ended up sort of pulling it out!!
Anyway, I am sure there is some sort of link between his current poo issue and the previous constipation which he no longer has but nonetheless was bad and resulted in lots of tears.

BUT REALLY? Would u expect it to take a year to master pooing in the loo, even after this?! A year! Perhaps even a year and two months.

I'm sorry but it is driving me crazy.

Some children (and adults) don't like pooing in unfamiliar places. Lots of people prefer strongly to only poo at home, my kids have been known to be constipated on school trips.
I would say he probably still is a bit constipated, just not as bad. He may also be trying to hold on.

I would do all of the following: increase the intake of fruit, veg and water, encourage trying to poo before nursery, upping physical exercise, and talk to the GP.
TMI but I have found when exercising it often makes me need a poo. Maybe this is why the accidents happen while your son is playing.

I think he is holding on as what he does in his pants isn't usually a full poo, it's like he's holding it but an inch or two slips out in the way that poos do when they're determinedly on their way ( sorry too graphic!)
He also refuses to tell anyone at the nursery he's done a poo, even if they ask he says no. I think they should check him regardless but anyway.

I also feel really bad as I work full time. I don't think the nursery are pro active enough and a part of me thinks if I was at home for a month I could deal with it. But can't do that.

Am wondering about taking him out of the nursery and getting a nanny. So that someone can keep a proper eye on it. I was holding off getting a nanny until DD1 arrives in November, well until I have to go back to work after that. But I feel for this to be ongoing I must be letting him down in some way.

dH not happy about idea of removing him from nursery due to potty training as DS has such fun there. He thinks it's too extreme.

Bumping for any more suggestions / advice

I feel your pain. Dd 3.3 will only poo in knickers and I am sick of scrubbing them. She's very articulate and I have asked her repeatedly why she can't do it in the potty or toilet but she has no answer. She has been constipated a few times and was prescribed Lactalose which worked brilliantly as it is not a laxative but a stool softener so eases her fear of "pushing". I would LOVE to know how on earth to get her to try to go on the potty-have tried bribery and the story 'Poo goes to Pooland' but she isn't interested. Even if I catch her in the act she screams if I bring her the potty. Have also tried giving her privacy as I'd heard this can be an issue. It's almost as if she doesn't want to let it drop away from her IYSWIM and wants to see it in her knickers...maybe a whole different psychological thread there! People keep telling me she will grow out of it but WHEN?! I did consider she might be 'impacted' when the poo is backloged and is leaking through overcrowding but she's definitely doing it on purpose. I too have dc2 arriving in November and am not looking forward to scrubbing knickers aswell. Am considering taking her to the HV to get advice as nothing I'm doing works. I really hope your situation improves soon. Fingers crossed for us both. Sorry for not having a magic formula for you!

To answer one of your queries, I wouldn't be surprised if it takes a year or far longer. My DS (just turned 6) will still have poo-type accidents occassionally (especially when really concentraing on something). However, the bit of your original posting that really resonated for me was where you mentioned that it was manageable at pre-school but had deteriorated at nursery over the holidays, and that he is fine at home. So he seems to be fairly comfortable with pre-school, really fine at home, it's just the nursery. I would definitely want (expect) them to be doing more to support you (but mostly to support and care for him). If they can't be bothered to support him through this then the least they should be doing is putting him in a clean pair of pants and trousers. It is maddening for you (especially since you are working full time and DD1 is due in November) but it will pass (as everything does seem to). Some children do take longer. He has grasped it at home, and mostly at pre-school - so he is doing really well. I have no advice to improve it I'm afraid - I've just been playing the waiting game; and at just turned 6 my DS now rarely wets or soils himself during the day. Good luck and I will watch with interest to see if there is anything suggested that I should try!

I sympathise, oh how I sympathise. All I can say is that it isn't for ever. It just feels like it is. Hindsight is a wonderful gift.

Currently 7 months into potty "training" dd3 (now 2.11 yo). At wits' end as well.

Ok I'm sort of glad I'm not alone but also I spoke to soon. At home today with DS as he was sick in the night. Just me and him. He'd normally take himself to the loo or say he needs a poo at home. He's just done it in his pants.
He's now lost the TV and his chance to play outside with other children in our road and is playing by himself in his room.
I feel really mean but I am just so cross. Now he's done it at home it is total reversion to those first days of potty training!
I hope someone has some advice (for all of us!)

Elsqueak does your little girl do wees on the potty? Just not poos?

The whole thing is so wierd. I know my DS doesn't have any issue with sitting in potty or toilet as that's how he does his wees and at preschool they had to take themselves off all by themselves to the toilet. It's just poos into the loo that won't click in!
I have wondered about smacking him when he does it in his pants. Resorting to violence!! That's a terrible thing to think but i don't know what else to try.
The previous method we had that did work (get X number of stars and I will get you a toy of your choice) is no longer working even remotely.

Kw13 you are right the the nursery. I've spoken to them about it so many times but have to speak to them again. I even said a few months ago that if it carried on id report them to Ofstead.
It is just the worst thing to pick him up after working all day to find a dried up poo in his pants, them get home and deal with it. Often it's clearly been there for several hours.
They claim they didn't notice/ he didn't tell them but there is no excuse, they know the pattern, they should check.
It means he and I instantly get off on a bad foot when I pick him up because I have to say 'is there poo in your pants' and he has to confess there is. It makes me furious even thinking about it. Another

If he was sick in the night a) he shouldn't be playing out, b) he could be getting rid ofpoo before diarrhoea. I wouldn't punish over accidents as that can lead to anxiety which can lead to more accidents. (Rewarding success is better than punishing failure.)

This sounds so much like my daughter who really didn't get sorted out until we went to the doctor and got movicol (which she has been on for about 2 years). The poo anxiety causes witholding, which causes the poo to back up. This leads to a loss of sensation so they don't always know they need a poo or there is very little warning. I'd see the doc and get some Movicol and see if it helps. and try not to get cross (i did and it made it worse and made me feel guilty).

Going to talk to the doctor about movicol. You may be right about lack of feeling. We've had 3 small accidents over past 24 hours. It's like leakage or just an inch coming out at a time. He seems completely oblivious until afterwards.

movicol changed our lives. We suffered for about 4 years until I twigged on that witholding was the problem and that movicol would help. It's not an overnight cure, but give it a month and see....... DD has been on it for about a year now and no longer has poo in her pants every day!

Am definitely thinking withholding is the problem. Yesterday he had 3 accidents (all fairly small Ish poos) and the accidents just kept coming. One was literally 10 mins after another, ie obviously the same poo.

Then (at home) he suddenly said I am going to the loo ( great stuff) and he did the most enormous poo, doubled over in lenght. It must have been 25 cm long! I think that was what he'd been holding in and what has been forcing itself out.

Even worse there was blood on his bum afterwards. I checked and he's always had his teeny skin tag there by his anus. That was red raw and bleeding and he was screaming when I wiped his bum saying it was stinging. He also had a bit of a rash, I guess from having so many accidents/wipe ups that day.

Going to docs tomorrow to get movicol, although am not sure they will give it to me as he won't be there, it's a GP pregnancy check up. I can go again next week with him but would prefer not to take him just yet because he hates the doctor anyway and if the doc starts checking his bum too it will make him more anxious. Obviously I will go if there is any more bleeding.

May I suggest the ERIC people-google them) they are an expert chariety dealing with incontinence/wee/ poo /toilet training in children and are very very good and have a helpline that you can ring and chat to them.
May i also tell you that my son still has very regular accidents of numbers 1s and number2s and has just turned 7.We have been toilet training since he was 3.The last three days have been notable as he has had no accidents of any sort and was dry overnight as well.That is the longest ever period with no accidents we have ever had.

Mac, sorry not to reply earlier. How 's everything now? DD was doing well with wees on the potty but I think withholding is effecting her now and causing her accidents. I'm wondering whether she may actually be impacted as (tmi) been getting fecal smears in her knickers too. She has had constipation before but always got over it naturally. Am continuing with Lactalose. Last time I did this she didn't poo for five days! Worried call to doctor and he just said it was normal. It is exhausting mentally and physically sometimes.

Hi Elsqueak, thanks for checking in!
Well, things have improved.
I have started new star charts that I make on the computer with 5 stars to 'get' and then he wins the toy pictured at the end, which is a toy he has chosen. He has so far won a power ranger on his home star chart, he has 2 more stars to get on his nursery star chart then he gets a power ranger t- shirt and 2 more stars on his 2nd home star chart to get dino-bite board game.

He's doing well and a couple of times he's taken himself off to loo to do poos by himself. So theres been a vast improvement, and it seems to be caused by fewer stars to get ( previous star chart had 9 stars to get ) plus the picture of what he wants.

Interestingly, was reading Dale Carnegies book on winning friends and influencing people, the famous one from 1930s. It said in there about getting people to do what you want by 'igniting a burning desire within them' rather than focusing on what u want and why. So i added in the picture of the toy that hed picked out to win, and kept showing it to him and reminding him this was the goal.

So i want a kid who doesn't crap himself, but am guessing as he's proven he can take himself to the loo if he wants to, and not poo himself, he doesn't care about what I want and doesnt care if i make threats/get upset/get cross when he has accidents.

But he does care about the power ranger that he wants.

But before I speak too soon, he's been through phases with star charts where it's worked but so far nothing has worked long term. And I don't want to get into buying new toys every 5 poos!!!!!

Ps I went to doctors and now have movicol, but before I gave it to him his poos were soft. And since then he's been doing well so am saving it.