when to enquire about speech referral?

[3duracellbunnies]

Ds will be 3 in September. He has a huge vocab and most of what he says is understandable by me, and I think most people would get the gist of what he is saying, but there are still a number of sounds he doesn't say clearly, e.g. Fook instead of book, diss instead of kiss, dare instead of there, focolate instead of chocolate etc. He has a mild uncorrected tongue tie too. TIA.

ds got referred at the age of 3 and had speech therapy before he started school. He came on a lot at nursery and his speech improved further at school. He only had 2 courses of 1 to 1 speech therapy and we also had work to do at home with him but it really helped him.

He doesn't sound like he would qualify for NHS SALT.
DS qualified for NHS SLT because he had only 11 words at age 2y2m. At 4yo2m he could not say the sounds K or hard G at start of words. He is borderline for getting any SLT.
You would do well to get a private assessment. SLT involves loads of homework which they can go ahead & suggest to you now.

Well, in my area, you sit on the list for 9 months - a year before you are first assessed, so my advice would be to ask for a referral and get on that list, and you can always phone and say you no longer need the appt if it's an immaturity thing, when the appt comes round.

A year! Took 6 weeks for our assessment, wow.

This is a good site to give you an idea if there are any issues.

Thank you all for sharing your experiences, VelvetJacket would you be able to send the link itself. We have 2yrs before he starts school, but if there is a year to wait here it sounds as if it is good to get the ball rolling. We don't have a problem getting him to talk! Just not sure how much I should try to correct him. I usually parrot back what he has said, so 'can you read fat dook?' 'you want me to read that book?', but don't do it all day and not sure how much I should be actively teaching him pronounciation. He is a sponge for words though.

I think we have to go through health visitors so will give them a ring and find out. Thanks.

Sorry link again, mustn't mumsnet while decorating cakes and watching TV, should get my priorities straight!

You are doing exactly the right thing with the parroting.

If he goes to pre-school, they can refer for you or you can ask the GP for a referral. I would do it if you're concerned and the sooner the better!

www.talkingpoint.org.uk/Parent/Directory/Progress-Checker.aspx Here you go, sorry I had to run there - teething.

Ds is only 2 so its more about getting him to talk full stop. She did say to us not to correct him, just as you say repeat the correct pronounciation. She was really good and helpful so I would recommend asking for a referral. As others have said if it sorts itself out then no harm done.

Here it's a 3 month waiting list.

I wouldn't worry about the 'dare' instead of 'there'. One study on four-year-olds showed that both th sounds (as in this and thin) were consonants which frequently still caused problems in pronunciation.

Our paediatrician suggested asking for a SALT referral for my 2.6 y.o. because his speech is unclear and he drools a lot (I suspect he has a slight tongue tie too). He said at this age (which I know is a bit younger than your DS), unclear diction in itself wouldn't be enough for a referral, but the extra issue (drooling) might mean a SALT would be prepared to see him. DS's vocab and grammatical ability is very good.

He also suggested a hearing test, which I would never have considered was a problem. It turned out that DS has glue ear, which has probably affected the development of his pronunciation. Has your DS had his hearing tested?

Our GP was reluctant to refer DS for a hearing test (but did because the paed had requested it), and the same surgery (different doctor) was completely dismissive of my friend's request for a hearing test & SALT for her 2.6 y.o. The HV was very happy to refer for both though.

I think he'd got a good chance at getting SALT under NHS. The k sound is an age 2yo sound.

You get speech therepy for pronunciation as well as lack of words. Ds (glue ear) has had speech therepy since about age 3yo, we got him referred shortly after his grommets were in. The first sound he worked on was "k/c"

The waiting list is about 9 months to a year at that age-I think they give priority to school age approaching children, so it's longer at that age. But they do do it. One of the first things they'll ask for is have you have a hearing test, so it's probably worth being asked to be refered for that too.

That's great and the link was useful too. I rang the HV and someone will ring me back. They said that they don't refer until 3, so won't be until Sept, and he is going to be the oldest in his class so we have two years yet before school. He does drool too, sometimes he gets all frothy at the mouth, hadn't linked it with the tongue tie. I don't think the t-t is too severe as he can now after lots of practice with his sisters stick his tongue out a fair way, and it did take 9 months before finally b/f counsellor identified it as a reason why b/f was still uncomfortable.

The other thing that I am doing which someone suggested is trying to teach him new words, as they said it is less frustrating for them to listen and be corrected over new words than old words, he seems quite receptive at the moment to trying to say things correctly, and the up side is he now recognises a tyranosaurus rex!

I guess what I really want is someone to just listen to him and tell me which sounds to concentrate on, I find it hard to work out the sounds and listen to the content at the same time. I will ask about hearing test too, he hasn't been tested since birth, but he always knows when food is on offer so I doubt it is a major factor!

My ds had speech probs and we had a private SALT come and assess him aged 2.

Was horrified to hear he was in the bottom 1% of children for pronuncation at the time.

Later had his hearing tested and he had some hearing loss and needed grommets - so many children who need SALT have this problem! I'd get your ds's hearing tested first.

My ds is having NHS ST now and getting on really well. He can say th, sh and y (used to say l) now after 2 x 6-week blocks. Only got ch/j sounds to go now!!

I'd ring the HV and ask to be put on the SALT list, then you can always take him off if need be further down the line.
hth

Parroting hasn't had much effect with DS3. Very stuck in his ways! You really want to go down private route now to help you hear what is actually missing, you'd only need one session to formally clarify it for now in your own mind. SLT screening will give you a list of defects & point out how the mouth needs to be different from what child is actually doing. Make sure your child can see your mouth as you form the correct sounds. But SLT starts with listening exercises, DSs struggled to even hear that they were saying anything wrong. So there's no pressure on child to say it right, just to work with better listening, to begin with. Listening exercises can go on for months before you start to tackle productive speech.

I am not surprised that you've been told no referral until he's 3yo. DS starts school in 8 weeks, & has one of the issues you mention (no K sound at start of word). We see (NHS) SLT every 3-6 months & she gives us loads of homework until we next see her; homework which DS refuses to do most of the time (did I say he was stuck in his ways?!). I will have to apologise next time I see the SLT, but DS really does not want to change. DS probably won't improve until after he starts school & qualifies for weekly sessions with the actual SLT & he can't wiggle out of it so easily.

Apparently often children don't explicitly recognise the difference between what adults say and what they say. Studies show that when 3 year olds are played recordings of their own speech, they are unable to understand 50% of the words they mis-pronounce, whereas they are completely able to understand an adult saying the same words.

So trying to get him to repeat sounds after you may not help that much unless you've had some advice from someone who knows what they're doing.