Please dont laugh, my son has really upset me

[WhatIsGoingOn]

Im a regular with a name change obviously. All afternoon my neighbour's kitten has been in our house. (we have cats of our own) and my children have been loving it to death and playing with it. My son is 8 and he adores animals. I was sitting here at the pc when i suddenly noticed ds doing something very strange. He had this kitten held in the air, both of his hands around its throat, shaking it. He wasn't laughing or anything like that, he looked in a trance if anything. I cried out in shock and he dropped the cat. I can't believe he did something so cruel.

Now before you think my son is just a nasty little stbag (as tbh i think i would if i saw another child do this), my son is the most gentle boy you could ever meet. This is why it worries me so much, it is so out of character for him. He's never been like other boys his age, he doesn't even stamp on ants! He loves all creatures. He writes me letters telling me how much he loves me. He still takes a soft toy to bed (i know, i know). Sometimes i worry he's too soft but he is a really nice child, is polite and well behaved. He doesnt ever have tempers, he hardly ever cries (in fact apart from when he was a baby i think i've only ever seen him cry about 3 times).

But he does have a tendency to act very strangely at times. He gets "moody". Very much how teenagers do aswell. He thinks strange thoughts. Just before he did this he had made a little book with pictures of our cats in it and their names. It was a sweet book apart from the bit that said "It's nice to have dark powers" and pictures of animal "gods". I kid you not. It freaked me out, (i dont mean that i think he's possessed, i dont believe in all that stuff!). I just mean it freaks me out that he has thoughts like that and i dont know where it has come from, this little boy is scared of his own shadow.

Im upset. I dont know why he acts the way he does. His behaviour seems to me that of an abused child. (not this incident in particular but his general "wierdness" ), but he's had a very good childhood. He's well loved and cared for, has everything he wants (within reason). I dont know where im going wrong and have been feeling like this for some time, tonight was just the last straw. He was such a happy, bright toddler full of sunshine and over the last few years he's turned into this strange, withdrawn, overly sensitive boy.

I asked him why he hurt the cat. He looked totally ashamed and upset and said he didnt mean to. I told him that he knew doing that to the cat could hurt or even kill it. He just said he didnt know why he did it.

Now if you're going to take the piss please dont do it here, i know it may appear comical to some of you but i really don't need that right now. Am hoping for some explaination or advice on why my son is doing things like this.

Thanks for reading if you got this far.

Ditto invalidusername. I would share your concerns.

Hi whatisgoingon. Much sympathy with you. My ds2 was 4yo and he quite calmly informed me he had killed our gerbil. I was shaken to the core. I adore children and animals and have lots of pets and teach all 3 of my kids to be kind to all animals. I cannot offer any advice, but hope that knowing someone elses son has done something similar will help iykwim. My ds2 is very different to his sister and older brother. He is the youngest of 3, I was pg with triplets, but miscarried two and managed to 'hang on' to ds2. He is a complete mystery to me. The other 2 are polite well mannered can take anywhere children. Ds2 is like 'The Omen' unleashed and sometimes I feel very alone and helpless. He hates 'other people' crowds, any change to his routine, noise. He looks like stig of the dump cos I cannot brush/wash/cut his hair, clean his teeth. Even new clothing causes massive problems. You are not alone, tbh it was a relief to read your post. hope this helps you, take care

I remember going on an absolute blood bath killing as many wasps as I could with a tennis raquet and thinking nothing of it until a grown up came and shouted at me saying I was cruel. I guess I was about ten. I was mortified. It hadn't occured to me I was being cruel.

I also remember, quite disspassionately, doing nasty things to flies to see how it affected them. I've always been an animal lover. I've been a vegetarian forover twenty years now.

My point it that I don't think we can judge kids on our standards of behaviour. That's not to say we shouldn't guide them away from these cruel instincts, but let's not be overly alarmed by them. (The man shouting at me over the wasp situation had quite a profound effect on me and I felt guilty for years afterwards.)

whatsgoing on, I've been thinking more about the original post and thinking...if it were me, I'd probably want to get an objective, professional opinion. Not sure who from, but a GP might be able to refer you to the appropriate person.

I personally know nothing about childhood onset schizophrenia, but I do know about a range of other emotional and mental health issues and I'd just want to be sure my child was getting help if they needed it...could be just support in dealing with 'difficult' feelings, could be more, could be less, but I'd want to do something.
Let us know how you get on, wishing you well..xx

Agree with Spidermama if its a one-off incident, ie just the kitten thing..but not so sure if its an ongoing worry about moods/thoughts.

4blue1pink, just wanted to add a hug for you..it does sound like a little boy finding it hard to express his feelings in other ways, nothing sinister but still upsetting. Will he talk to you, or anyone else? Maybe he just needs a bit of help in getting himself heard in more constructive ways?

bakainyourjimjams this story made me remember just the same thing. I adored animals as a child and adored our darling dog even more, but i remember [with shame] when i was about 7 or 8, smacking him quite hard on the nose. Just once. After I saw the shock on his face i felt so bad and never did it again, but i wonder why i did it the first time. Some sort of curiousity and exploration of power i suppose. maybe this is what your son is going through whatisgoingon.
If you are worried about his behavious generally then maybe you should ask for a referral, but this one incident seems fairly normal [though obviously not to be encouraged] to me.

Ruty, I did something similar with my kid brother, when I was eight and felt dreadful for years!

Definitely a test of power, and 'what will happen if' - wonder if its a developmental thing, sounds like lots of us experimented with violence at that age
But it was a one-off, not a pattern of behaviour.

Can none of you remember doing things that we would now consider awful?
I did snail stamping. I spent hours caring for a selection of animals I imagined were lost / orphaned etc, but we also thought it was hilarious to TRY to throw hollow crusts of bread over swans and seagulls necks so that they would have a sort of bread collar which the other birds would pursue them for (thankfully we were too hopelss in our aim).

The other stuff about his books sounds entirely normal, too. Did none of you write bloodthirsty stories, imagine you were involved in witchcraft etc etc? Compose never-to-be -sent threatening letters and blackmail notes? Make up fake spells against peope? Spy on neighbours and keep logs of their comings and goings to inform on them when the police arrive?

I honestly think children need opportubnities to try out the darker areas of their imagination, to project into the 'what if' and in doing so, learn about their emotional responses, AND re-inforce just how good their own lives are. They NEED ghastly stories like Hansel ns gretel in order to understand how nice thier own Mums are, and to prepare fthier emotions or a badder wider world.

if you have other feelings of 'something really not right' then it may be worth making gentle enquiries, but apart from making sure that children DO know that cruelty is not acceptable, please do not make him feel like a freak because he has not developed adult sensibilities.

Absolutely Blu. Good post.

yes agree blu. And i had an obsession with ghosts at around the same age, came and went, thankfully.

Spidermama's first post made a lot of sense to me. Most societies allow for children's need to externalise their fears and inner dark feelings as they get older and the nastier side of life and nature starts inevitably to become apparent to them. Our society is peculiarly anodyne, especially around children and how we expect them to feel/behave. I also think that exposure to violent material in the form of computer games etc gives children entirely the wrong outlet for these feelings and makes matters worse.

I remember kicking a friend of mine as hard as I could, in the shin, and watching with a sort of dazed fascination as he collapsed in tears. It was because I had seen a similar incident in the playground the day before and it had unsettled me - I didn't really understand pain/hurting and wanted to explore the mechanism. I felt dreadful later, when I came to understand that it had hurt him as much as it would have hurt me to be kicked like that.

I would talk to his teacher though, and possibly to your gp. If he was mine I would sit him down and have a very gentle chat with him about how he is feeling and how things are going for him, and whether he has any ideas about why he did it. He knows you saw him, so I don't think it would be a good idea to just let it go completely - he might conclude that you are so disgusted and disappointed that you can't bear to mention it. I could be totally wrong though, my sons are still much younger.

I hope you do find some peace of mind in all this, it must be very worrying for you.

Great post Blu. Were you and I separated at birth I wonder? I was a frightful Goth as a child. Real Boo Radley stuff . Elderly batty ladies across the road in a "Boston Marriage" having fled for their lives from Hitler? Obviously witches. Ill-tempered School secretary with aquiline profile? false nose made of cork. It screwed off at night, everyone in school knew that.
Also agree with Spidermama that boys' testosterone is a huge added factor here. I thought terrible things but never did them...
Whatisgoingon - only you know whether your post was an understandable response to a shocking incident, but not really typical of your boy in general, or whether you feel you really do need to get him referred for some specialist assessment. Certainly not laughing at you, but concurring with others that children can have really yucky inner lives at times. Fairy stories, the Rascally Cake, even Horrid Henry...all respond to this side of our psyches.

Spot on post Blu. I think we all underestimate just how dark our children can be at times and they need to experiment/express etc.

My DS cant be left alone around animals. He went to a friends house and played a game of footie with their hamster whilst it was in the excercise ball.
The difference between your son and mine is that mine does not understand that what he is doing is wrong.He has no empathy towards animlas at all...almost none towards humans either!
Your son knows that what he did to the cat was wrong, he understands what the concequences of his actions might have been. I doubt very much that this is anymore than your son expressing his imagination in an outwardly way.
If this behaviour continues then you should go and discuss it with your GP and ask for a referral as Jimjams has already stated.

And agree with Greensleeves too that whatever you decide you need to have a gentle chat with him. He has probably scared himself half to death over this too.

Not read the whole thread so forgive me if I've missed anything ..when I was 6 I 'deliberately' dropped a kitten off a balcony - it broke its leg -ouch - naturally everyone was shocked, I got a huge telling off, nobody could understand how this sweet little girl could do such a terrible thing. Now I remember the event fairly clearly, and I remember why I did it - I had heard the phrase 'cats always land on their feet' and being an inquisitive experimental type I decided to test it out - there was no malice intended, I genuinely believed that this kitten would land on its feet and walk away. Now trying to tell that to adults who were telling me off and saying 'you know its wrong to hurt animals' etc was a different matter!

Who knows, perhaps he genuinely didn't think ...perhaps he thought that 'cats have 9 lives'or something ..perhaps he was daydreaming and didnt realise what he was doing...don't think it has to be anything sinister at all.

On the other hand the 'absence' could be something like 'petit mal' epilepsy and should be checked out. Oh and mental illness is very rare in children of this age so very unlikely.

I totally agree with other posters in that we have all most likely done some strange (cruel?) things as children that, looking back as an adult, we cannot believe that we did. Jung has some excellent books on dealing with one's shadow side and I work with this on a continual basis. Our "modern" society has taught us to shun the darker side of our nature and it can therefore reveal itself in unsettling ways. If you are really interested in a professional opinion I would personally seek out a Jungian child therapist/play therapist (I think play therapy is wonderful for this age group).

In the meantime, it might not hurt to read a little Jungian theory on Shadow Self just to familiarize yourself with this. It really is quite interesting to realize how much we have submerged part of our psyche in order to comply with what is considered normal behavior.

Yes, also agree with Greensleeves about gentle chat.

I toed a neighbour's child to a tree and left her in the wood at 8. In my defence, she was the living embodiment of Violet Elizabeth Bott....

Not to trivialise your feelings WIGO but agree about the 'dark stuff' described by Blui and other posters.

Tied! Didn't knot the rope with my feet....

Just re-read your original post, Whatsgoingon....you said 'this little boy is scared of his own shadow'.

Which is pretty much what lots of people have been posting back.

!!!!!! Must be in the air. Just found ds2 (sweet, sensitve, 4- but a sensible 4) doing somehting hideous to our cat (not sure what- because I turned around after it had been quiet for a while and found the cat cowering). I was in the same room. I said "what are you doing?" and ds2 went bright red and started to cry.

I gave him time out.

Agree with Blue etc.

really agree with blu, jimjams, spider, marina etc re children having a darkside and that being normal...

having said that, if, instinctively you do feel that something is wrong then act on it, gently now.

i am extremely dubious about the concept of 'child onset schizophrenia' let alone applying it to your son tbh.

I agree that this is probably not especially unusual behaviour but the description of "trance" like appearance did throw up a faint possibility of epilepsy as the systems of this can be odd, but it's much more likely to just be within a spectrum of normal behaviour, unless there are concerns flagging soemthing up more seriously for you in which case I would go to the gp for reassurance/diagnosis

i would just hate your little boy to be labelled with something when he may just be going through a perfectly normal phase, or he just may be feeling anxious about something at the moment. I suppose child psychologists are responsibly enough to avoid a child feeling labelled by a condition, but i agree that a gentle chat with him first and trying to find out if anything is worrying him is the best first step.