Should I ignore tantrums or is there another way?

[gourd]

Do people think it's OK to simply ignore tantrums and get on with things that have to be done, (making a meal etc)? I try distraction but it rarely works now. Distraction used to work really well when LO was younger, a suggestion of a game, getign a book out, saying ooh look a bird etc and of course offerign food, but at 20 months if she decides she wants to scream and thrown herself on the floor for 15 minutes she will just do it. Food still sometimes works, but not always and I have this fear that offreing food every time she cries or screams may create problems with comfort eating in the future - but I may be overthinking things. Ignoring tantrums seems to work, in that the tantrum doesn?t carry on any longer than if I don't ignore it, if you see what I mean.Tantrums can last 5-20 minutes but usually only about 5-10. Nothing I actively do seems to stops a tantrum except, occasionally, the offer of food, so, especially on work day evenings I tend to get on with jobs that need doing whilst she is screaming (packing her lunch for next day etc) to free up my hour between her bedtime and mine a bit, since I cant play with her anyway for a 10 minutes or so that she is screaming. I cant help wondering if I am doing the wrong thing, in not acknowledging her distress in some way. I sometimes try to cuddle her and comfort her, but she pushes me away so that doesn?t work anyway but I don?t want her to grow up thinking her feelings will be ignored or not feeling able to express her feelings. What do you think?

Yes, do ignore - from the sounds of your post, that works with her, so keep going.
It is horrible to listen to the screaming, but once you know that it's sheer temper and not anything else, it's easier to manage.

Also, there are several threads floating around about the magnificence of tantrums for example the classic 'cutted up pear' thread if you'd like a giggle.

Yes, ignore.

Hi, I try to distract, resolve, ignore or stand ground depending what the tantrum is about!

If the tantrum is about something small e.g. another kid has taken the toy they want at toddler group, I try to move them on/distract.

If the tantrum is about something I can solve and makes no odds to me e.g. they want a specific bowl/spoon/mad food combo, then I will resolve it by accommodating.

If the tantrum is about something silly and distraction doesn't work or something routine where a tantrum won't stop us doing something vital e.g. I want to put my fingers in the washing powder box then I explain why they can't and then ignore.

If the tantrum is about something there is no option on e.g. seat belt or collecting DS1 from school, I try distraction but will end up standing my ground, which means strapping DS2 into his pushchair/car seat and ignoring.

On food, I feel it's ok to use food as a distraction if it is normal food e.g. 'come on it's time for lunch' or 'can you hold your snack while I put my shoes on', but it seems unhelpful to say something like 'stop crying and you can have a biscuit' due to the risk of creating an unhealthy link between suppressing emotions and 'treat' food IYSWIM.

Was discussing this very subject today, me and a friend both saying how KNACKERING the tantrums are sometimes!

Well I don?t say things like ?Stop screaming/throwing things and you can have a prune/raisins/fig etc (she loves fruit and especially dried fruit) but I do say things like "Mmm look a juicy pear, would you like some?" which does sometimes work, but only if she?s already hungry I guess. Tantrums are mostly about frustration (things not working/not being able to do something properly) but also about being strapped into high chair or car seat (we just strap her in and ignore of course - there?s no choice about the car seat anyway) but they can be about anything really. Basically everything you want her to do (get ready to go out, go out, go home, get in the car, have her nappy changed, come to the table for tea etc) is a major inconvenience for her as she is usually busy doing something very important and cant be disturbed! We do sometimes manage to avoid tantrums by asking her if she can show Mummy what she wants or ask her can she do something (i.e. get ready for bed and put her dirty clothes in the laundry basket - she loves doing that so this is a great game) and we also have started waiting till she has finished an activity and is about to start something else before calling her for tea, but we still have at least 6 tantrums per day! Thanks for your replies. I feel a bit better now about just getting on with things whilst she screams on the floor. Hopefully it wont scar her for life or anything?

You can validate her feelings after the tantrum.

"I know you were sad because you couldn't have xxxx but now you have calmed down would you like a xxxx instead?"

or

"You must be tired after all that crying. Shall we have a rest and read a book?"

That way you are acknowledging that she was upset and why but also making it clear that the tantrum won't get her anything.

You're doing the right thing by ignoring the tantrum and not allowing it to change what you're doing.

You could try saying "When you have calmed down we will do xxxx" but that will only work if she is not too far gone to process language. Sometimes even if they can hear us children cannot understand what we are saying when they are in full flow. They have gone too far to think so negotiations are pointless.

Timandra I think that is good advice, and the validation thing also works quite well in mid-flow I have found, just acknowledging how they feel seems to help sometimes.

Absolutely don't ignore or distract your child when they are having a tantrum! I would suggest reading 'tears and tantrums' by aletha solter which explains why a child is. Crying and what to do. To put it simply you listen and offer comfort. Same as you would do with a baby or an adult. If your friend was crying would you ignore them? I don't see why we should treat our children any worse

One of the things aletha solter explains is 'the broken cookie phenomenon' that a child may be crying over something small and petty but really it's a build up of hurts that may be bigger and should be taken seriously with listening and understanding

Sorry one more thing to clarify! You listen and offer support while they are crying but that diesn't mean you give into them and try to stop the crying by giving them what they want.

I thought 'ignore' meant the opposite of 'give in' - not literally ignore! I agree do not ignore in the strict sense.

Even if validating and listening all the while, I have to put DS2 in the pushchair, because otherwise DS1 will be left standing in the rain! So in that sense, I may understand/validate the feelings, but I ignore what DS2 wants, I have no option.

I think distraction is useful tbh, a little 'heading off at the pass' saves much heart ache?

Does the book distinguish between tantrums and tantrums, IYSWIM?

Oh I was thinking literally ignore if you mean opposite of give in then I agree. Personally I would use distraction in a public place but at home I would listen because tantrums are a way for children to offload negative emotions and restore emotional equilibrium - ie they have a therapeutic purpose. Listening and offering comfort tends to make the crying stronger though because they offload more emotion when being listened to.

Sorry not sure what you mean by distinguishing between tantrums and tantrums?

Sorry, by 'tantrums and tantrums' I guess I mean they are not all the same - there are ones that have solutions e.g. Tom took the pushchair I was going to push and I am upset even though I have been offered an identical pushchair vs. ones with no solutions e.g. I have broken my favourite toy vs. ones where there is no option to what is being asked e.g. I don't want to wear my seat belt... but we have to leave pretty soon to go see dad in hospital! (welcome to my life btw)

What I mean is, I give more weight to some tantrums than others I think.

Maybe I should just read the book rather than asking you to relay it all to me!

I think by 'ignore' most people mean don't give the response the child is looking for i.e. be unconcerned and relaxed.

It is fine to make it clear that hugs are still available, make eye contact, make sure they don't accidentally hurt themselves etc.

I would try to appear to be busy with something else, not to show the child that he/she doesn't matter but to prevent myself being an audience thereby feeding the tantrum.

The important principle to remember is that if the tantrum gets the desired result it will be repeated many times over. If it doesn't achieve anything there's less point in trying it again. You don't need to add anything to that so ignoring in a way that makes the child feel unimportant and rejected would be pointless and unfair.

pullupapew, the book mainly focuses on the big tantrums, the ones that can't be 'solved' I guess with the smaller ones, it's more about finding a solution,
it is a really good book, as it explains what is wrong with the ignore/distract/feed model, and how that just sets you up for having even more tantrums!
I really believe that tantrums should be reacted to with kindness and love, rather than getting busy with something else. its a popular misconception, that we should ignore so we don't 'feed' the tantrum' giving a child care and love is clearly not the same thing as bowing down to their every whim to stop the crying! a child may be crying that they didn't have ice cream or something like that but the point i was trying to make in earlier posts is that is just a trigger. They are not crying to 'get' ice cream, they are crying to offload negative emotion that has built up over time. If we understand that then we can really help to improve the wellbeing of our children, rather than creating a battle of wills where they are crying alone, while we're cooking dinner in the other room.

Thank you paranoid, that sounds interesting reading.

I do find with the big tantrums, the ones where DS2 gets beside himself, that just telling him I am listening works better than anything else. I find them sad sometimes, when he is all worn out afterwards.

Pull up a pew, your son is so lucky to have a kind listening ear! I think you would love the book, though it sounds like you are doing something similiar naturally, it's so nice i think to follow parenting instincts rather than just think that we have to ignore them so they 'learn'. Sounds a bit harsh and old school to me!
Maybe also have a look at a parenting website called Hand in Hand parenting, they have articles you can read online. They talk about how to deal with tantrums in a kind gentle way, the really interesting thing I read is that children remember their births and sometimes when they tantrum they are working through feelings of fear and stress, that come from their birth, as well as other stuff as well. There's also advice there for if you do feel a bit sad and worn out from really helping a child with their crying. It's hard work, but the main point to take away from it all is that if you really listen with love and care to your child, they will be much safer and secure and happier in the long run, because they can get the feelings out.
the kids that just get ignored end up going round in an endless battle trying to get their feelings out, making life a lot harder for everyone in the long run. Right I think that's enough or I will have retold you the whole book!

paranoidandroid, I think it depends on the individual child what is best for them during a tantrum

for a child who is overloaded creating a quiet place with little attention on them can actually be the kindest and most helpful thing

dd used to go into violent tantrums where she tried to bite and kick- listening didn't really apply because she was never verbal when she was in tantrum mood; she was actually better off without too much focusing on her- though sometimes she did have to be restrained for her own safety and that of other people

db used to have days when he went from person to person trying to pick an argument to be able to go into a tantrum; it was obvious that his tension was just building up to such an extent that it had to be released

we never knew what triggered those days, but they got less frequent as he grew older

both are now perfectly sensible mature people who get on well with others

Thankfully I only had one child that was great at tantrums. I ignored. He eventually would "throw" himself on the floor sooo gently so he wouldn't hurt himself! lolololol....

I'm glad he wasn't a biter, or mean either, as I don't know what I would of done!

Depends on the child...

I remember my sis taking my screaming child during a tantrum from me when we were shopping. I could hear him screaming thoughout the store. Eventually she just took him outside and put him in the car. Not only was he screaming but trying to get away from her. She said, she was never so embarrased!!!! People prob. thought she was kidnapping him!!! He was 2 yrs old.

Dr greens toddler taming book is my bible during toddlerdom!!

Some great tips in there and reassurance.

Hi Cory I said it on the other thread that yes tantrums are a way to offload tension I totally agree. I offer support and reassurance that I am there for my child . I don't try to get right in her face when she tantrum just a few words here and there and then I just let her get on with it. By listening I dont mean words, often it'd just non verbal support , just my presence rather than going off to do something else. The child might 'hate' me because they are in the midst of some strong feelings but that does not mean I will go away which would give my child a sense of avandonment . I'm like the safe anchor to help her deal with the strong feelings.

Hmm cant see me saying "I'm listening" working at all. DD is only 20 MO though, perhaps that's better for older children? At the moment once she's off you can't cuddle her unless you want to be hurt with kicks etc, well, you cant really get near enough to her to pick her up or cuddle her anyway, not when sh'es in full flow - she just pushes you away until she has calmed down a bit at least. That's when I cuddle her, and give her teddy as well. In the car seat, offering her teddy (her comforter) only works once the tantrum has begun to peter out a bit, if she's right in full flow she simply flings him to the floor (or out of the car whilst you're trying to get her into her seat) and ignores him.

We used to say "What's wrong DD, can you point/tell Mummy" or talk to her, but actually once she's off this really seems to make it a lot worse, initially at least - it seems to be over quicker if we wait till it's already subsided a bit before intervening. As I said, the tantrums actually don?t last as long if I ignore them, it's just that it feels a bit odd to do that - as someone else said, you wouldn't ignore a friend's crying, you would intervene and offer comfort, so it feels uncomfortable to me, to not do that. On the other hand, the crying friend would probably accept a hug or some sort of comfort rather than kicking you!

Can't post much am on phone but started with 'I'm listening' around 18 mths here. I guess you could try it, no harm done by trying. Comforting used to annoy DS2 sometimes too, I think listening helped cos then he could 'say' what was up. (Of course he didn't literally say, he was too little)