how do you cope when they just wont behave?

[IAmBooyhoo]

my children are taking the piss tonight. they were in bed but my landlord came and the dcs got up to see who was here ( i had hoped they would be asleep before LL got here but no such luck), ever since they have been hyper and i can't get them to settle back down to sleep. they are switching between fighting with each other, running back and forth to the toilet and playing (jumping about by the sounds of things). i have been up more times than i can count already, i have told them loss of priviledges if it continues (it has) and i have even shouted (not happy with myself about that but i am really struggling to cope) i dont mind them reading or playing quietly, but they aren't doing this. when i went up the last time (a few minutes ago) ds1 threw a sock at my face whilst i was tucking his brother in. what do i do? they are 6 and 2.

Threats love! Something along the lines of "if you don't go to bed right now and stay there, we won't or whatever tomorrow"

Problem is if they dont do it, you MUST follow through with the threat....

Good luck!!

Oh sorry, I obviously didn't read this properly.

Can you separate them? They seem to be egging each other on?

They'll crash soon!!

yes, i can but it would mean putting one of them in my room and past experience tells me that is a worse option. they destroy my stuff, make-up, hair stuff, put it in my bedding and walls. i have literally spent the past two days scrubbing walls i cant risk them undoing all that and i know they will, whichever one i put in my room. it has gone quiet now, hoping that means they are sleeping rather than occupied with mischief.

Oh bloody hell. Well I hope so too!

Don't mean to interfere but sounds like you're having some discipline problems?

yes i am, i'm crap at it. they dont behave for me. i hate it.

:-( are you on your own too? Must be hard. I know because my dp works away from home a lot so I may as well be a single mum most of the time!

You're going to have to start getting a bit tough, make sure you follow through with those lost priviledges tomorrow so they know you mean business. Or do you always do that and it makes no difference?

yes it's just me. i always follow through but ds1 just seems to be so in the moment when he is being defiant that no threat is enough to make him want to behave. we dont have tv just dvds and i remove those as consequence he is usually not bothered by this, another one is not being allowed out to play, it works sometimes but then the next time he will say he doesn't care. he has a few times in the past climbed out through the living room window to get out and has run away and hidden on me. i have confiscated toys and given him the chance to earn them back but he doesn't respect his toys, he has thrown them at me and out his bedroom window or down the stairs. he has no special toy that he values higher than the rest. i threaten to cancel trips (and always follow through) but it has meant all of us missing out on things we were really looking forward to. again he tells me he doesn't care if we dont go. his brother is only 2 so it isn't as easy to remove priviledges as he doesn't nderstand. his behaviour is generally normal for his age but he gets carried away witrh his brother. and they fight. i hate the fighting. sometimes they are best friends and i really praise them when they are getting along but other times they hit each other. ds1 will stick his foot out to trip ds2 up out of badness and he smirks when he does it. is that normal? i hate that he wants to hurt his brother.

i started a reward chart also and the novelty lasted a few days before ds1 wasn't interested anymore. he got stickers for good behaviour and at the end week the plan was to give him money for each one so he had some pocket money, even that didn't encourage him to want to earn them.

Sounds tough. He does seem a handful, especially for 6, sorry.
What is he like at school? Does he behave there?

I am used to cracking tough behaviour in children in my job so I know what you're going through, although I absolutely accept it is so so so much harder when that child is your own.

I usually find something that they care about losing, it can take a while and they all say they don't care! They will though. If you keep consistent it will start to irritate him and he'll decide life is much nicer and easier if he gives in and behaves. It sounds like he's playing up for a reaction/attention from you? Maybe a bit of jealousy of his younger brother?

The reward charts do work, I've found them surprisingly effective with even the toughest kids. Did you make the reward chart go down as well as up? So good behaviour moves up, naughty move back? And sometimes even if you don't feel they deserve it, find something you can praise to let them move up the chart. I find that the first 1/2 times you do it, you need to contrive it a bit so that he does achieve the prize at the end because then he will realise it is good to get the prize! And see his mum so happy with him, which is the best bit!

Don't beat yourself up! You are doing great, keep going!! I can't imagine looking after two,on my own. My dd is 18months and a little monkey but it is hard to implement any sort of discipline at that age because she is just to young to care understand.

at school he can be hit and miss. some days he is hyper and distracting the other children and other days he gets 2/3 stars on his chart. last week he got pupil of the week. i cant work out what affects the difference in behaviour.

yes jealousy is an issue, i really try to giv him lots of special time with just me. his brother goes to nursery two days a week so those afternoons we spend together, we also have a dvd night on saturday nights with just us two and most nights he stays up later than his brother for maybe half an hour so that we can have some wind down together although tonight that wasn't possible as i had LL coming, perhaps that's why they played up because they both went to bed at the same time? usually ds2 is asleep by the time ds1 goes up so i think that's maybe what happened tonight.

the reward chart was just for good things, i didn't take stickers away for naughty behaviour. i'm going to reinstate it again tomorrow. does losing a sticker mean a loss of a priviledge or is that over kill? i think i' jsut in need of a good method that works, i always seem to be guessing how to deal with them and end up either under or over reacting to behaviours. i think he knows this aswell, he knows i dont know how to handle him.

I think if you are beating yourself up for shouting, they probably know they can play you. Why shouldn't you get angry when they are being disobedient and not listening despite calm warnings? You don't sound like a bad Mummy except being too nice!

Another thing is a points chart, get a point every time they do something nice (list the behaviours you want eg. listen to Mummy and do what she says, put pyjamas under pillow without asking, hold hands crossing the road, whatever...).

You could also do a penny jar, where he gets a penny for good behaviours and loses one for bad behaviours, then he gets to keep the money at the end of the week. (Try noticing more good ones than bad ones, so it is motivating and he makes some money!). My ds1 is also 6 and really into money/ counting.

Ok, so he is manipulating you for sure. You could do that super nanny type thing where you say right, these are the rules of this house and this is what will happen if you do not follow them. So your expectations are clear from the start.

It will take a while when you make any change to have an effect, you just have to try and stick with it. I personally would take one away and that be it but if he loses say three in a day, give a punishment.

Although it is hard, once you've dealt with something, try not to react further- I.e let him reel you in and wind you up! He most probably knows what buttons to press to make mummy shout!

It is good that you make time for him, keep that up even if he has been in trouble. Maybe try playing a game or doing colouring together so you get to have a chat, and really listen to him so that he feels very important!

If he is having a good day, maybe give him a little job to help you with something and then obviously loads of praise after. That's good for boosting self esteem.

How did he react to getting pupil of the week?

I hope I don't sound patronising, just want to try and help and these are things that have worked for me before.

I've got to go to bed now (boring I know!) but let me know how you get on tomorrow. Don't forget to lock the window! :)

thank you merry. i hate myself for shouting. it's loss of control and i dont want to go there. my mum did it and hit us aswell but justified it by saying we pushed her to it. my children may push my buttons but i am responsible for how i react to that. i dont want to be scary to them.

he was delighted with pupil of the week and so was i, i gave him so much praise, we were both on a high for the rest of the day, and we told his grandparents about it too who were also delighted for him.

no it isn't patronising at all. really good advice. going to write down some house rules and have a think about what sort of punishments might work. thank you.

I do understand what you are saying IAmBooy about the loss of control when you shout. I shout at my kids far more than I want to do but do you know what? They DO push me to it!!

It sounds like you had a negative experience with your Mum on this, so understandably that affects your perspective on this, but I do think that at 6 your DS is old enough to understand that his bad behaviour has a negative influence on how you feel. That is not to say that it is ever justified to be violent or even aggressive with your DC, as you say you are the responsible one. It doesnt seem like removal of things or treats makes any massive difference, so maybe he needs to realise how his behaviour impacts on you?

RE-read that and it sounds like I'm suggesting you have a right go at him - I dont mean that! I just mean trying to explain things a bit clearer to him whenever you have a bit of quiet time together. A bit of a one to one. I think kids are capable of understanding a lot more than we credit them with sometimes.

thanks chunk. i am very aware of how much my own childhood has influenced how i parent, or how i try to parent anyway. i know i go too far the other direction, in an attempt not to be how my mum was. i dont want that for them.

i think you are right. my ds knows that i am frustrated with him and angry, but i dont actually say the words to tell him how his behaviour makes me feel. for some strange reason i have this idea that i shouldn't let him know i am upset (maybe from my mum?) but why shouldn't he know? i am a person with feelings not just a mum who has to take it all.

He must know, when you get angry and shout. I do this too sometimes. Afterwards I apologise, because, as you say it is not good to shout. But on the other hand, I don't beat myself up too much, because he is old enough to know he will get that reaction. I do also explain that I am stressed, maybe about other things, having a bad day for other reasons. I remember someone once told me that the worst thing you can be for your kids is a perfect parent as they will never be able to good relationships with anyone else. I like that one! And I think it's true. You don't want to 'ruin' them for anyone else, especially future partners or work colleagues, by thinking their behaviours don't affect anyone else's emotions.

yes merry that is a good point. i had never thought of it from that perspective. we were apart for most of today as they go to their nanny's today and i spent the day out with a friend, so i have had a lovely break. he was still a bit hyper when he came back but we have settled down now in our jammies for dvd night and they are both pleasingly calm so hopefully no repeats of last night.

Hiya, well the fact that he was so proud of that award is great, means he responds well to praise!!

I'm glad you've had a good day today. I bet that little break has done you good! I am jealous! :) Merry makes some really good points, please don't beat yourself up, it is natural to get frustrated.

You could also try to develop empathy skills while you're reading stories by asking him to guess how a character is feeling at points in the story (I don't mean to test him, just slip it in now and again for positive and negative emotions) then as this develops, when he upsets you, you can sit down afterwards and ask him how he thinks you felt when he did whatever. All helps towards knowing consequences of behaviour and making good decisions!

Ps, your DVD night sounds so sweet! Looking forward to my dd being older so we can have that too!

yes it is, i really look forward to them every week. good idea about the emathy skills. i sort of do things like that sometimes but with our pets (kitten is scared when you run towards her etc) but i will start doing it with his books and dvds too. thank you.

i actually bought that book of amazon about a year ago but i just didn't get on with it. i have tried to read it a few times but always end up just closing it.

hey - iam - have you asked his teacher for an appointment to discuss his behaviour? let her know about issues you're having, and further question his behaviour at school to make sure you know the whole picture. ask for their advice and support - do they have parenting classes, knowledge of cheap/fun clubs your ds can do at the weekends etc? make sure your ds knows that you and his teacher are a team in supporting him - then you can add "do you want me to tell miss_" about this?" and she can feel sure that you will support discipline she applies in school too.

good luck - sounds like you're doing brilliantly - and your kids are very lucky to be so loved and have a mum who is so caring and loving x

no, i haven't. i guess i was just thinking of it as a 'me' problem. as in, he misbehaves for me. we have had the normal parent teacher meetings in which she mentioned that sometimes he is away with the fairies and other times he really aplies himself to what they are doing. she has spoken to me a coule of times after school on days where she has had to tell him off for his behaviour but she always says "so that's something you need to work on him with" which i do, i talk to him about what happened in class and i remind him in teh mornings before he goes in about concentrating and making sure that the teacher knows he is listening to her (making eye contact and answering questions) because i guess if he is trying hard to concentrate on her he wont be thinking about being disruptive will he.