To see or not to see....a psychologist

[hocuspocus]

My dh and I have a dilemma.

We are struggling to maintain a happy home at the moment due to the strain of dealing with the challenging behaviour of my ds(4). On a good day, ds is charming, great fun, and of course devilishly handsome . The not so good days (more often that not) are filled with conflict whenever we ask ds to do something which he doesn't want to do.

We have tried to combat the tantrums (screaming, laying on the floor etc) by use of time out and sticker charts in the past - but the reality is starting to sink in that we don't really seem to be making much headway. Dh and I have always consoled ourselves that ds will grow out of this behaviour (or it would as least improve!) as he got older....but our optimism is now fading.

We are also getting more concerned as ds is due to start school in September and we anxious that he will be labelled as a "problem child". His behaviour is also having more impact now on dd (1), as I feel that she gets an unfairly small portion of our time as so much energy is directed at keeping ds under control.

In desperation, we have thought about seeing a pyschologist. I have no experience in thie field. Do they really help? I wonder whether we will just hear the same advice (star charts etc) that we have already followed - or is it worth a try?

I am also worried that a consultation at this stage will form part of his records when he starts school - and would like to avoid this if possible.

Can anyone help?

Hi, were having behavior problems with ds too and feel the same, so bumping this for you

Does he go to nursery? If so, what do nursery think about his behaviour?

Hi guys,

Yes, he goes to a great nursery school 5 mornings a week. They have noticed his "challenging behaviour" (although it seems to be more frequent at home) and we agreed to have a consitent approach by using time out.

I had a chat with his key worker last week and although they feel the time out helps he is still having fairly regular wobblys. They are keeping a log of when these occur to see if there is a particular trigger but nothing has shown up yet....

I'ld see who the nursery thought was most appropriate for onward referrals.

We see a clinical psychologist fairly regularly (and she is at the end of the phone whenever I need her). It depends what support you are after really. She hasn't ever really waved a magic wand, and she has no magic solutions, but she helps us decide what to tackle, what to leave and can sometimes give an alternative suggestion to try. I also know that if things get really bad she will come out and observe ds1 (at school or home) and give us her analysis of triggers and ideas. She's another perons who knows what they are doing (and she is very good) so I find her one of the most useful people on our team really for bouncing ideas, getting reassurance that we are doing the right thing etc.

Hi Getbak,

Can I ask at what stage you consulted with the pychologist (ie before or after your ds started school?)

Please also confirm whether the records form part of ds's formal school record.

Thanks

Ds1 is severely autistic so he has records coming out of his ears. W saw a clinical psych when he was being dxed, then last year I asked school to refer us back to clinical psych, which they did (special school though). We collect professionals which is why I used the term "team" . The clinical pscyh has been a great practical help though. If you go for a psych chose them carefully. Both clinical psychs I have seen have been good, ed pscyh less so ime (although have seen one excellent one).

look, i hope i'm not suggesting something really obvious and rubbish, but my ds had been biting and hitting and kicking and pinching and grabbing whenever thwarted for over a year when i got recommended the book 'how to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk' and we've tried to use some of the ideas in it and we are really making progress to the extent that he hasn't done anything like that for a few weeks now...i know he is only 2 and i know that it is probably completely different and evidently much more serious and possibly you should see someone, but thought i'd post about it just cause i found it incredibly helpful (and have read loads of books and found them all next to useless)...

sorry if it is an inappropriate post, but thought i'd just mention it...

I think its a sensible point Sophable and the same as the one I was trying to make earlier (although it got lost a bit). becuase we know a lot about dealing with challenging behaviours, the theory, the practice the works the clinical psych hasn;t really taught us anything new, but she has helped to prioritise etc. Thats what I meant by saying no magic wand, and by saying depends what you want to get out of her. Of course we have the advantage that she is NHS, and for us its worth getting decent professionals on board as early as possible.

Getbak,

Thanks for that. I think I will start asking around at nursery school to see if they know of anyone locally.

Got to start somewhere.....

hi hocuspocus
your situation sounds similar to mine in lots of ways. We have a ds who turned 4 last july and started school in September. He is Very challenging and a real drain at times trying to maintain an equilibrium with him.
He is very strong willed, has a very quick temper and is articulate and smart. The combination is quite difficult.
My dh and I have asked ourselves too whtehr we should get some form of help or whether this is normal (if not at the high end of normal) behaviour.
My HV thinks it is his age combined with his particular character and gender that are causinng him to challenge us the whole time.
I received numerous complaints about him from nursery and was worried about how school would deal with him.
So far he is doing ok-so I am going to wait this out a little I think.
There are tons of threads archived here about four year old boys and their bloody awful behaviour-hope it can reassure you as it has done me.
x

Sophable,

No, your recommendation is great - I haven't come across that one before (despite my extensive library!)

Any idea if it is widely available (Amazon etc)?

Chipkid,

Thanks for your post - it is reassuring that we are not the only ones.

Can I ask - did you do a pre-emptive strike with school and talk about your concerns with his class teacher? I've been wondering about whether flagging up the likely problems are a good thing or bad...

yes yes, i bought mine in ottakars....is quite old i think but a classic

language is terrible (is american i think) and you have to bear with the cartoons. but the strategies it suggests are actually quite sophisticated (compared i think to everything from toddler taming to gina and back again) and...well....they seem to work!

here

cristina7 from on here recommended it to me (i was in tears of despair) so i have her to thank (and have tried to on here but she was away!)

hocus-thought about this and decided definitely not-I always felt that ds was labelled as a rebel at an early age at nursery and kind of lived up to his reputation-I wanted him to start school with a completely clean sheet and for them to tell me if he was a problem for them

actually i feel pretty vindicated by the reviews on that amazon link....in fact i'm going to go and re-read it tonight....when i read it a few weeks ago i was so desperate and distressed (over a year is a long time for a 'phase' whatever the age of the child imo) that i skimmed it and grabbed at the ideas that seemed most accessible to me.

it really is excellent.

hocuspocus-what sorts of behaviour are you concerned about in particular?

Sophable,

I shall hotfoot it down to Ottakers tomorrow (and maybe even sneak a quick coffee!).

Thanks for your help.

enjoy that coffee.

whatever happens i hope that things change and become less worrying and more enjoyable...and that whoever you see is good (i'm training as a psychotherapist, and trust me there are so many cr*p ones out there, i'm sure the same applies for psychologists just as it does doctors etc)....if you do go and see someone, and don't get on with them, or feel they are no good, do try someone else won't you....

Chipkid,

I appreciate your thoughts re school - it's a tricky one, but I was leaning towards saying nothing and seeing how things go.

Rather oddly, my ds sounds almost exactly like yours. He is extemely independent, strong willed etc and doesn't take kindly when he is thwarted in whatever he wants to do.

For example, we wanted to go for a walk this am but he refused to go and started to scream blue murder because his favourite coat was in the wash. I tried to explain this calmly but he wouldn't listen... which led to time out and the walk not happening, because by the time he had calmed down (30 mins later) the baby needed feeding etc. It seems a silly example perhaps but shows the extend to which his behaviour affects our whole family (my dd missed out on her trip to the swings etc)

I do symapathise-been there myself! always seems to be the most trivial things that spark them off doesn't it?
My Ds cannot deal with frustration of any type-and he often becomes frustrated because his mind is ahead of his fine motor skills.
He is quite like me in temperament and so we clash a lot!
Interestingly I too have a dd who is aged 1-has he become more challenging since she arrived?

Chipkid,

We must be leading parallel lives!

I'm interested in what you say about frustration. I think that (if I can try and stand back and look at this objectively) many of his wobblys probably are due to frustration - about not being understood, or maybe feeling we don't listen properly perhaps if we're in a rush.

Looking back over the last year, things certainly haven't improved since dd arrived. I wonder though whether time will help in this respect as ds is starting to see her as a little more interesting now that she can stand and is saying a few words. Maybe it's too much to hope that he will get over his jealously soon?!

hocuspocus-I often cntemplate how I can improve things for ds as I think he suffers just as much as the rest of us when he is being a bugger!
I try not to hurry him too much if I can avoid it (he hates to be rushed)
Watch that he is not hungry or overtired as these are really big triggers and I have monitored very carefully the sorts of thing he watches on tv-action hero type cartoons can really over stimulate him
I am careful that he doesn't have toys that are too tricky for him and will trigger his frustration!
most of all I am waiting for his kinks to even out as my HV promises they will!!!!
I don't know-parenting dd is somehow so much more natural-!!!
I have just ordered Sophable's book BTW!!!!

Chipkid,

You really are me, aren't you?

My ds is always worse when tired or hungry. I shall make a real effort now not to hurry him along, as I can see this probably does trigger his frustration.

Your comments upon the TV diet are also interesting....my ds was recently bought the Incredibles video (the first action hero cartoon he has seen) and things have certainly been worse since then. I had reservations about him seeing it in the first place and wish I had put my foot down.

Ah well - not too late, the video will just have to have an unfortunate "accident" with the hoover...

I feel just the same way about my dd, BTW

Thanks v much for your help, ladies.