Worried about son (4YO starting school)

[Billynomateswontbemyfriend]

My son, who is 3.8YO appears ambivelent to the outside world.

He's clever, no doubt about that - he knows his alphabet and numbers and can spell 3 letter words but it's always on his terms. If he doesn't want to do it: MELTDOWN.

I didn't send him to preschool last year as he wasn't really that dry and his speech wasn't great either (still isn't, to be honest)

I have him down for a school which requires an assessment (he didn't get in last year). My DS2 will start this year at the same school (he has had his assessment and passed). DS1's assessment is in a few weeks time. I am trying to be upbeat about it, but I am not sure if he will pass. Academically, he can do all the work they are doing, but, socially, he doesn't seem to WANT to and if he has an off day, then I am in trouble.

What options do I have?

I could send him to the local primary (assuming he got a place - which is by no means a done deal) but my feeling is (i) I don't want to send one child to a 'good' school and another to a 'state' school (and PLEASE this is not a discussion on whether you personally believe state or private is better / worse) and (ii) if the 'good' school (small class size, extra help etc) don't think he can cope with it, what chance does he have in a primary which is short staffed and over subscribed? He'll be lost.

I could home school... But I have no experience of this.

DS2 is desperate to start school so I don't want to knock back his admission because of DS1.

Of course, there is a chance DS1 will get in (My god, I am praying)... but I have no clue what the schools really assess against. If it's academic, then I'm fine. If it's ability to conform, then I'm really, really not.

Views?

I'm really open to suggestions.

My DSS has Asperger's. He's 9, reading books in quantum physics, insanely intelligent yet is likely to go to a special school in the near future as he cannot cope in his small, mainstream primary (where he has a one-to-one). Intelligence does not unfortunately mean that a child can cope with school.

DSS has no friends, will only partake in activities on his terms and has meltdowns regularly.

We're in West London and looking at Blossom House in Wimbledon which is a private special school with a particular focus on SALT and those with AS. Obviously funding may be an issue given that most children there are funded via Local Authority (fees are upwards of £60000) per year.

Can you speak to GP/health visitor/paediatrician to try and get a referral for more assessments for your DS?

I'd be inclined to seek a different Paed..preferably one who has an interest in autistic spectrum disorders..unfortunately a surprising number of Paeds think that autism comes in one size only.. and if they are verbal, not flapping and and can make eye contact it rules it out.

It doesn't.. and many children are disadvantaged because their ASD difficulties aren't picked up until it all goes horribly wrong.

My son is gentle, makes eye contact, and as a small child was delightfully friendly.. because he didn't distinguish family from stranger, his odd speech was 'just a delay' and 'poor muscle tone' and the paed said he couldn't be autistic!

He was, he is and as he got older it just showed more and more! He can read everything you put in front of him, but can only talk about his obsessions, his anxiety can be terrible because the world is so bewildering to him. When we finally saw a psych, through CAHMS who really knew about ASD.. well the diagnosis came swiftly and it has helped no end because while he can read etc, what he needs most is help with social skills, with managing a conversation without boring the poor recipient of his one way monologue senseless...

I work with children; all have autism..all are as different in their presentation as could be imagined. Some have no speech, some are sociable but odd, some cannot handle interaction at all.. some are amazingly clever ...

If your gut instinct is also telling you there is 'more' to it..don't accept the paed's word as gospel!

Good point medusa. I think it's time to do that. I have done a million 'symptom checker' type things and it does appear that he falls into the class of dyspraxic.

Freckledleopard - I have struggled to get DS1 to participate in any class, he doesn't attend nursery or preschool at the moment. He does, however, have a tutor and his ability to sit still has improved MASSIVELY plus, I often take then to soft play areas and I have noticed recently (last few months) that DS1's desire to intergrate with other kids has also improved MASSIVELY.

Tantrums are linked to stuff he can't do. For a long time, he couldn't hold a pencil correctly, but he 'got' it a few weeks ago and now he loves colouring and writing his name (his spelling is good). Same with getting dressed. His ability to do that is improving, but if he encounters a problem, he will get massively frustrated and tend to tantrum / give in rather than try to solve it. I could think of at least 10 examples off bat - if he's playing with a toy and it doesn't do what he thinks it should, he will get angry / frustrated.

one thing he does have a problem with is turning around and going back the way he came - but, to be fair, DS1 adores being outside and running (his athletic ability is astonishing!) and he'd quite easily walk upwards of 5 miles each day. He hasn't used a buggy since he was 18MO.

He's having a 'good' day today and I'm confident that, if he behaves like he has this morning, then we're OK. He's practiced his numbers and his letters, got himself dressed, tidied away after breakfast... but on a bad day he will just keep repeating 'blow whistle LOUD CHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO'

Thanks again for all the lovely replies, especially from the mums who have experience of dealing with ASD children. I do know, with DS1, that the start of school is just the start of a VERY long journey. I just so desperately want him to be accepted. The school is fantastic (know lots of very different different children who go there and they've all been catered for) and I am sure that, once he's there, they will work to provide the corect support (obviously, at my cost. That is not a problem and I appreciate that we are so fortunate to be in that position).

Goodness... that was long! Sorry

takes after dad does he? :)

It's tricky isn't it because on the one hand you know that his dad came good enough for you to fall for him! But on the other hand, ever such a slightly different mixing of the genes might mean DS is slightly more "uneven" than his dad. Which could be the difference between being delightfully quirky and really struggling. Someone said to me it's like the difference between a full bath and an overflowing bath- just a little bit more water changes it from a bath to a crisis!

I had a mixed relationship with the professionals. they recommended assessment for a diagnosis of ASD at one point. We turned them down and it was the right thing to do for us as a family. But what we and they agreed on was that we had to set aside his pattern-recognition skills (the piano playing, the spelling, the absurdly good memory) because "those will be there for him later provided that his other skills are good enough for him to be able to learn effectively" and that was great advice. Once the professionals saw how hard and effectively I was working, they didn't care whether I had a diagnosis or not so we got back on the same page pretty quickly.

The Hanen book "Talkability" would be good for you. It's available for £32 from the Winslow publications site. the authors don't care about diagnosis they are too busy recommending helpful strategies.

DS2 is 6 and top at maths now but he also has a best friend whom he plays with flexibly.

good luck

Thankyou lingle - I will be checking out that book!

DS1 has been an angel today. Perfect behaviour, sociable, happy, communicative.

Feeling very happy with things tonight :-)

Billynomateswontbemyfriend the assessment will be highly based on social development as it will be through games and play based learning. For example the teacher will ask him to perform a series of short tasks. I am assuming you want them at the same school and we are talking about upper and lower nursery/kindagarten??? If so the assessment really is to see uf the school will suit them.

Yes! I want them at the same school.

I am 99% sure, however, that they will accept one and reject the other. I just don't know where to go from there (assuming it happens). Find a school that will take both of them (finding that school is another thread!!) or send one?

No experience of private school assessments but I think what I would do would be to visit all the possible schools, private and state, and be totally upfront about his situation and ask what support they would put in place.

So before you start worrying about whether he is good enough for the school, I would start by asking if the school is good enough for him.

I wouldn't go by the size of the school or even the size of the classes but would pay a lot of attention to how they react to him when they see his difficulties. Do they seem thrown by them? Do they look worried or do a cat's bum face? Remember whatever school you choose, he will have to live with every day; if he is not happy or does not feel wanted, this will be far more unsettling than occasionally reflecting that his brother goes to a different school.

Speaking as the mother of two children with minor extra needs, one thing I would never do again is to put them in a school that does not want children like them. So do the rounds, don't try to cover anything up and watch their faces narrowly.

Cory, thankyou.

You have made me see things in a different (more positive) way.

Honestly, the school head had a cat's bum face on when I picked DS1 up, honestly, she practically ignored me (whereas she was ALL OVER DS2). That's why I am so sure they will reject DS1.

Being completely honest with myself about what I feel is right for DS1, then my gut feel is (and has been for quite some time) home schooling for the next year or two and then reassess.

THere are some lovely prep schools which I have not looked around (which would start at 5.5YO). DS1 is perfectly happy, sociable etc., AS LONG AS IT ON HIS TERMS

The only way I can get DS1 to concentrate is on a 1-2-1 basis. But, I think I will contact local state school (for which I have applied, but there is no certainty of getting in) and be honest about DS1's little quirks.

Thankyou again for your lovely and positive message.

Hi, much of my thoughts have already been covered. But have you considered a boys only school? You may find that as ASD mainly affects boys, large single sex boys schools are more used to dealing with these issues and consequently happier to accept children who are bright and academic,but lacking from a social perspective.

If you go for a meeting at the state school, remember to ask to see the SENCO (Special Needs Coordinator); s/he will know more than the teachers about what support they offer and a brisk positive SENCO makes a lot of difference to a school.

Actually, Cory nailed it. Right school for the right child. Where one of your children thrive the other may not, and you need to be assessing the schools from that perspective

I don't have much to add other than to agree with mince. Different children will invariably thrive in different schools and finding the school that is the best fit is far more important than ensuring that siblings are at the same school. My brothers and I all went to different (private) schools, our respective individual needs were well met and it enabled us to develop confidence and independence IMO.