How do I teach 6yr ds to be less easily led by his bf?

[MerryMarigold]

Ds1 is nearly 6 (in a couple of weeks). He has a best friend in school who he adores. This boy is very clever and a lot more advanced in reading/ writing/ general maturity. Ds1 somewhat hero worships him and does pretty much whatever he says. If he says, "Don't be so-and-so's friend" ds1 obeys. If he says, "Don't listen to the teachers and instructions and do it my way." If he starts messing around, ds1 joins in despite being warned by teacher and then gets into trouble. I wish he obeyed me like that! Ds1 copies all his ways of speaking ("cool, man" etc.

When I asked who ds1 wanted to invite to his birthday it was JUST this boy. I know there's 2 issues here. How to help him have more friends AND how to encourage him to stand up for what HE wants to do/ knows is the right thing, even when he's being told to do other things by this boy. Last year their relationship was like this and during this period ds1's behaviour at school was very bad. When this boy essentially 'dumped' him, ds1 was heartbroken but actually behaved a bit better once he'd got over it and made some other friends. Now it's started all over again and I'm a bit worried we're going down the same road. I don't want to disrupt their friendship and not sure I could anyway, so I think I need to a) encourage other friendships (am trying) and b) teach ds1 to be his own person. Any ideas how I can do b).

Ha ha - I've just started a thread about my almost-same-age DS who has the opposite problem as in he can't give a stuff what anyone else thinks of him!

I've noticed this problem a lot in my DS's age group. A friend of mine had a similar problem with her DS when he was in reception - she invited lots of other children round for tea after school, spoke to him about playing with other children, but the real difference came when he and his bf were put in different Yr 1 classes. A boy in my DS's class has been doing the 'you're not my friend' thing to DS because his bf tells him to.

Do you have friends with children of the same age? I'd just really encourage other friendships and speak to the school about it - teachers tend to be pretty aware of these kinds of relationships. It's hard though. Good luck to you.

wish I could help as I have a very similar issue!

Similarities:
also 6
DS2 also hero-worships best friend - it's been like this since January.
best friend ordered DS2 not to go to tea at another child's house and DS2 literally refused to go (so embarrassing.....)
DS2 also just wanted best friend and best friend's brothers at his party!

DS2 also isn't quite his own person yet.

Some differences too of course. DS2 is quite academic, the best friend is a socialite.

Thanks phlossie. He's in Yr1 now, but they mix the kids for yr2, so if it continues to be a problem I may ask the teacher if she thinks separating them would be a good idea. I think my ds2 may be more like your ds and we will have the issue of respecting people rather than hero worshipping...

lingle, 'glad' you have same problem. ds1's bf is academic and a socialite!! Bad combo. Poor ds1 is neither and is a bit awkward. Have you got any ideas for how to help him 'find himself', esp as you have an older ds...feel out of my depth with ds1, every stage is brand new to me!

I'm struggling I'm afraid! I suspect it's a developmental phase.

His older brother was the same but at 4, he was over it by 6.

Should say that DS2 is awkward too (though will probably be academic in a geeky computer-scientist way). I'm guessing that he wants to be more like his best friend and also that his social skills are limited so he feels "safer" playing basic "run around and squeal" games with best friend.

I delivered lectures on this throughout reception and discovered I just wasn't getting through. it's no good teaching them that a "friend" is someone we feel happy and comfortable with then in the same breath telling them that everyone is supposed to be friends with everyone else! DS2 just said "but I don't want to have lots of friends" in a puzzled way LOL.

Interesting that you lecture in this, dingle! I've noticed that early years teachers (reception and pre-school) seemed very anti best friend situations and really pushed the friends with everyone attitude. Now they're in yr 1, my ds's peers seem to be pairing off. I like your point about telling them friends are people we should feel happy and comfortable with. I think that's really important.

I often feel out of my depth with my DS, merrymarigold - every stage is new and he's very unlike me. My DD, on the other hand, is my 2nd and very like me.

lingle, the run around and squeal games is so familiar!!! And talk about poo and wee all the time...

yes, same here.

Am working tomorrow but will take a look at the thread Friday.

Ds1 is very like me emotionally and I had a hideous time of it at school, so it makes me worry so much (too much) for him. It's hard not to project!

Asked ds1 AGAIN today who he would like to come to party. He said, "T [bf] even though he said he won't come, and he's going to screw up the invitation, but I'd still like to give him the invitation." He just pops out with things like this, but he doesn't come running to me when it happens all sad. Last year when they were in Reception this boy asked Yr1 boys to hit him and they were generally not nice for a week or so before he finally told me. Blessing in disguise as he finally let go of the friendship. But now it's all back on again with a summer's distance.

The thing I struggle with is that this little boy is just a little boy too, and he's not awful or anything, he's just being a kid. But it seems like the combination of the two of them is just not a very constructive friendship for ds1 to have.

I'm struggling with his party. There are 2 options. The easy one is to take 2 friends out (ds1 wants swimming and McDonalds). The other option is to have a bigger party at home with more kids/ potential friends.

Lingle, would love your thoughts. You seem thoughtful and sensible.

Hi Merry.

not sure about the party. I would probably do both(!) to increase the chances of one being a success!

As to the big picture, we all struggle not to project and it's an important - crucial - struggle. I found the key to sanity was to think in terms of "skills" - "social skills". If DS2 found it hard to learn to read, I would break it down and figure out the most basic skill he was struggling with then build up. With his rather naive social skills, I try to do the same. It makes it less personal, less about history repeating itself, less in my gut and more in my brain, and reminds me of the possibility of progress. This approach has the advantage of dovetailing neatly with how teachers see the children and talk about them so it helps with parent/teacher communication.

I haven't read widely about social skills but I would certainly recommend to you a book called "The Unwritten Rules of Friendship". It won't solve your problem, but it's one of the few books that acknowledges the realities of playground life (the authors tell you, for instance, that advising a child to march in and say "can I join in?" is rarely going to work, for instance). I found that it helped me avoid giving poor advice/developing poor strategies with my older child. Your little boy may not be quite at the age they are focussing on (a little older) but I'd still recommend it.

I've heard about invitations being torn up too. Sounds as though this best friend has a lot to learn (a useful phrase when talking about other people's children!).

Merry I am glad you started this thread. I have a similar problem with my DS, who is 5.8 years and in yr1. He is obssessed with this one boy in his class and the days seem to be classed as "good" or "bad" depending how this other boy behaves towards him.

I was actualy thinking of starting my own thread for advise as yesterday was a "bad" day and we had a full hour of crying last night because "I have no friends, K is not my friend anymore" . We have had this since the start of Yr1 and is hearthbreaking seeing him so upset! And it is getting worst! I have a meeting booked with the teacher next week to discuss as it is becoming a real problem and he is starting to refuse school.

In DS's case he is really bright but seems socially very immature for his age & lacks self-confidence, whatever his friends think/ say about him seems really important to him even if it is illogical. I really do not know to deal with it, 8 year old DD is so full of herself, makes and keeps friends easily and is not really bothered what people think of her! They are so different that whatever I learned with her does not work with him at all!

It does not help that while talking about it with a friend this morning she said he is showing signs of Autism, I know she is not qualified in any way to make such such a statement and I should ignore it but... talk about making you feel even worst!

Sorry to hear of that baabi, I suspect we'll be going through the same if DS2 doesn't move to a more mature stage.

Do your kids get on? Is dd close to DS?

baabi, what you say about the good/ bad days based on the friendship is so true. Ds1 was v subdued yesterday before school and I asked him why: he said he was worried about being told off. Yesterday he said he was told off at playtime, but wouldn't say much more. I assumed a teacher/ playtime supervisor. Today was the same, but when I probed a bit more (when: playtime) and then WHO told him off he said, "T" (the friend!). FGS he is SCARED of a child telling him off and yet this is the only child he wants to share his birthday with. I've seen other kids be really quite horrible to him and it's like he either doesn't get their 'teasing'/ put-downs or he doesn't know how to handle it. He never defends himself. His sleep has gone down the tubes this week, he is waking v early which seems to be a sign of anxiety in him, and his behaviour is more difficult as he's tired on top of being anxious.

I think it's really good your ds is talking about it baabi and you know what's happening. It's the best way to start dealing with it.

Ds1 has certain of the autistic traits, as does my dd, though I believe a lot of people have some of them. He can spend hours ordering things and playing on his own, very simple, repetitive things. He struggles to join in with other kids, although clearly really wants to. He's very clumsy. He still struggles to dress himself. He can memorise whole sentences from TV programmes (he knows that intro to Planet Dinosaur almost by heart!). Then of course the social immaturity. I spent a long time beating myself up, but now I have a more 'normal' ds2 I'm realising it's just him. This realisation has actually helped me love him and my myself more. And he doesn't seem to be 'bad enough' for the teachers to have spotted it as anything major.

Lingle, the advice about breaking it down is excellent. I have to stop panicking first! We had such a hideous time last year, and I was so confused about why he was unhappy. I'm panicking, but this thread and your calmness helps a lot.

Baabi, please, please tell me what the teacher said and what advice she gives you. We have parents' evening next week, but it is a short time to cover a lot. I will also try and get some extra time with her if necessary as she is a v experienced teacher and v good. I feel torn between coming across as an over-protective parent (and therefore doing ds1 no favours) and trying to help him by talking to the teacher.

Oh yes and the crying about having no friends because HE is not being nice that day...very familiar.

my DS2 is on the Special Educational Needs register for his social communications skills (because when he started in the school nursery at 3 he had very little language). This means that he participates on a social skills group weekly and - perhaps more importantly - that his teachers think about his social experiences as an automatic part of their job. I would recommend being aware that this is a possibility for your children. Teacher are used to parents shying away from any "labelling" so might be very open to suggestions.....

I think that for every child who is firmly over the border into autistic spectrum disorder, there will be ten children who are a bit quirky and socially immature and therefore have a particular (and identifiable) kind of vulnerability in the playground. Ds2 is definitely one of those ten!

Thanks Lingle. I feel more confident in talking to the teacher about it. His Reception teacher just kept saying that he was very 'young' (he's a Nov bday) though she also kept saying he's really intelligent. He's verbally very good, but behind on fine motor skills, cutting, writing etc. though to be fair I didn't do a lot of that with him at home, because he never wanted to and I didn't force it till this year.

It's strange as ds1 is very, very empathetic/ sensitive and quite mature emotionally in that area. It's like he doesn't know how to handle those emotions. We were just watching a film and he identified the older brothers as being jealous of the younger one who was getting attention from the father. He used to always run from the room if he was watching a Peppa Pig episode and she was going to get told off, or if someone on TV was going to get told off for something he'd run out of the room. He's always running out of the room!!!