Really, really, really shy boy!

[fartmeistergeneral]

My ds is really shy. To be honest I've always defended him in the past if someone says to me they tried speaking to him and 'he's sooo shy, isn't he?' and I always breezily say 'oh,he's just fine, just the way he is'.

Now he's 10 and it's really getting to me. Yesterday my friend tried speaking to him and he just mumbled one word answers and when she asked about this thing they are all doing in school (won't go into details), and asked what he liked best he just said, 'I don't know' and I had to say, 'oh come on, we were speaking about this, what is it you like best?' and when he again said 'don't know' I said 'wasn't it such and such?' and he mumbled 'yes'.

Now I was quite shy myself as a child (not like this surely??) so I know it can be a bit stressful to be like that and have someone speak to you. But it's getting to the stage now where I could genuinely scream at him to say something, ANYTHING! in response. I hesitate to say it's rude like some people say, because it's not done with the intention to be rude. But, really how hard can it be to construct one single sentence in response?

Am I being too harsh, or is it time to say, enough is enough?

I think you'd be doing your ds a great favour by helping him with this. It might be worth pointing out that even if your ds doesn't mean to be rude, other people will think he is being rude. Also that if he wants people to know that he likes then he needs to smile at them and be friendly, otherwise people will think that he doesn't like them.

My dd went through a period of being shy when she was around three. It was due to a very particular set of circumstances though. I found this book very good although it might be a bit young for your ds. I also found The Unwritten Rules of Friendship excellent. It has lots of very practical suggestions for parents and kids to think about and do.

I do feel I've said exactly that to him over the years. I mean, people think you are being rude, remember to be smiley and friendly (have said this a few times cos he goes to a club and often sits on his own - rather than feel sorry for him I just feel angry and frustrated!). Nothing seems to have worked. He does seem popular at school though, always has people calling for him and goes out to play all the time. Just seems to have a real problem with adults and friendships outwith school.

Thanks so much for the book recommendations, neolara. I've added them to my next Amazon order.

fartmeistergeneral, my DS is a long way from your 10yo (being only 3.6!), but nursery have already picked up that he is not enjoying interaction, and although they know he can speak perfectly well, he also hides that when he closes up. If they come up with any ideas in the course of their assessment, I'll let you know. Your poor boy sounds crippled by this shyness.

You may have something, though, with the idea of telling him people see it as rude. If he really wants a way of being invisible, a social mask might be a good start? That helped for me. If he likes reading, Edgar Allen Poe's "The Purloined Letter" is the classic of hiding-in-plain-sight.

What has his teacher said? Does he speak out in class etc and work well in class groups?
I was a shy child, my mother never said much about it but in hindsight I see how she often let me to situations to have to deal with them myself. eg I had to call up and make my own dentist appointments or she would leave me with her friend/s for a while on my own. She kept enrolling me into things too from band to language trips! I have to say it all worked - most people will not believe I was shy when I was a child Ds1 (5) is just like me! It can be a painful reminder! He wont volunteer in school and goes bright red when called up but does as he is asked and answers well. I have asked his teacher to take no notice and not to make a big deal of it. Praise him when he does well but expect the same as others and not to make allowances unless he becomes really upset. I pick my battles with him. Sometimes I work around him and make allowances (new situations, crowds etc things I know he is genuinely insecure about) but if its something I feel he is is just being reluctant or has done before I dont pander to it. Let your friends in on it and tell them to work away and grill him! Even leave or engage in another conversation for a few minutes and see how he gets on! At the very least he will learn its easier to give up the details in the beginning than to have it dragged out of him!

I don't feel I do pander to him. His teachers always say he's a shy boy and he must try harder to answer in class but he works well in small groups.

When he's with his peers he's quite boisterous and takes control. He certainly seems popular in his class but hopeless with adults.

Im sorry I didnt mean it to sound harsh! I know with DS1 its heartbreaking when I watch him crumble or not do something I know he really wants to but just cant get beyond his shyness. I do support him at those times and I honestly believe if a child is supported and generally secure they will overcome it all in time. I guess I just meant to push his boundaries comfortably. (though he might not think so!) Like with your friend. If she is a good mate of yours then have a word and next time have her be the one that says 'come on..Im looking forward to some news!' He will pick up that others expect a bit of interaction. I get DS1 to bring the biscuits to my friends etc when they come over for a chat. Its funny how he will be a bit (small bit!) more talkative when Im not there rather than looking for me to fill in the gaps. He has even become quite friendly with one of them.

Google 'selective mutism'. Not saying he needs this label but very useful reading about when shyness is so crippling that you feel almost physically unable to speak.

epeems, it really doesn't sound like this ds has selective mutism at all. Selective mutism is not just shyness, and goes so far as for the child to be literally silent outside of the home - silent tears, silent smile, not a cough or a sneeze. This ds sounds normal with his peers, just awkward and shy with adults.

No. I don't think he sound as if he has it either but having a very shy dd myself I've found literature on sm very useful in helping me understand her anxiety and some of the approaches that help reduce it.

Positives: Being good with peers and hopeless with adults is a hell of a lot better than the other way round. For me it was only a real problem at school - at 18 other (okay youngish) adults are your peers and the whole world is suddenly a lot easier.

Warn other adults e.g. when he goes to the doctor that he doesn't mean to be rude, he is uncomfortable talking to adults but it is something he is working on. If you / other people make him feel he is being rude it will make him feel more uncomfortable. He shouldn't, at 10, be made to feel responsible for how adults feel imo. Fuck em. IYSWIM.
Pick decent people used to dealing with shy children to improve his confidence.

I honestly think you are on the home strait with this and he will naturally grow out of it may be that as a teenager he is a bit of a Perry off Kevin & Perry if anyone else remembers that - e.g Yes Mrs Smith no Mrs Smith but behind the scenes a bit of a tearaway! IMO this is way better than being cocky overconfident with his elders and betters.

"Am I being too harsh, or is it time to say, enough is enough?"

I don't know.

I think I would have a reread of "How to Listen so kids will talk" then spend a couple of months trying to find out from him why he doesn't reply. Is it that he feels overwhelmed? That he can't think of what to say? or that he can sense that the adult involved is asking him the question merely to test him (which frankly seems like the case in the example you outlined - why did your friend care what he preferred?) and that the situation seems phoney. I don't really see how you can progress on this until you know what you are dealing with.

He may perform worse when you are there as he will sense your anxiety.

he might well perform better with an adult who was talking about something that meant something to him. What are his interests?

I had to get a bit strict with my shy DD who is now 7. She was coming across as rude. People were greeting her in the street...someone from school or whatver and she was blanking them.

I gave her a talking to...it's fine to be choosy about who you are friends with...it's also fine to not join in everything but you MUST reply when asked a question or when greeted and I will be cross if you dont even try.

She has improved a lot. Now she will say "hi!" or "Bye" which is a start! I eplained that avoiding conversation actually garners MORE attention...and she has grasped this.

It is hard....but I would say that at 10 he can try.

I came on here to post exactly the same thing about my 7 year old so it is reassuring to know that i'm not alone.

My DS is absolutely fine with his friends and will talk to his teacher/TA in class (on a 1to1 basis) but with adults he completely dries up. He even struggles to have a conversation with my parents.

Lingle - does 'How to Listen so kids will talk' deal with these situations as i feel i have a very good verbal relationship with him myself. In fact he's one of the few boys in his class who actually tells their mum what they've been doing at school.

Fartmeistergeneral - is your DS an only child? Just wondering if he has an older sibling who has spoken for him in the past?