Is it just developmental delay or something else?

[3littlebadgers]

Very worried about my nephew! In fact I have been all the way along but even more so now. He is two years old and freaks out whenever he sees anyone other than his parents of one of his grandparents. He is OK at a distance (super market or something) but if anyone is in his house or one of his normal settings, looks at him or tries to communicate with him in any way he is inconsolable to the point that it is really upsetting to watch . Not just adults but children too. He is not yet saying anything apart from very early baby babble (dada, squeals and raspberry sounds) and his routine is very regimented through I am guessing his own choice in that he has a set route through the house which he repeatedly takes and a few activities which he will do in a certain order. Part of my worry is that his mum my SIL, I am guessing, has post natal depression or something. She has really isolated herself and as a result him. I am constantly trying to get her out of the house, to the park, to a baby group, to ours anything but she always has a million reasons not to . I thought maybe it was just me but according to her family and friends no one ever sees her. I mentioned it to my bro and he flamed me and basically said he can?t say anything because she will go off at him as she already thinks the world is against her. Is it likely that her isolation is making it harder for him to develop (for example he is still eating smushed up baby food I guess because she has no one to compare notes with)? Do you think it could be that he is just naturally quite late and that it will all right itself eventually anyway? Poor little mite he is such a gorgeous little fella my hearts breaking for him. Anyone have or know of a child that was similar at the age of two?
I guess I am looking for Hope or advice please.

my nephew was quite similar in terms of the speech - he barely said a word before he turned 2. He didn't behave in the way you describe with strangers, but did behave in a way that I just thought odd (can't really explain) for a toddler. he also had this wierd thing where he would look at you, but look right through you IYSWIM? Like a real vacant look. He did it from a tiny baby and never smiled back like most babies do when you coo at them. He also rarely ate any decent quantity of real food until way past 2.5 - he was having countless bottles of milk instead!

He is almost 4 now, and was diagnosed with some sort of speech impairment, can't remember exactly what it's called, but the abbriation was SLI if I remember it right. Oh, specific language impairment i think it was. He is also on the autistic spectrum...

I don't mean to worry you, and it might all be OK with your nephew, but in my experience, no speech at 2yo needs to be checked.

Could you go and visit her more often? It sounds like she is definitely anxious about going out. Perhaps this is because she is worried about her ds's development, and is scared, and doesn't want to confront the issue.

My ds has ASD, and when he was around 2yo (before he was diagnosed) I knew something was different to other children the same age. It was hard going to playgroups etc as I saw the differences with other children (even though no-one else may have noticed, the differences were subtle). Maybe she is feeling like this?

Or (and?) she may also have PND. Either way it sounds like she needs support, and you sound supportive and care about her. If she's not ready to go out much, then please go to her.

FWIW although ASD is a huge and varied spectrum, so there are no real generalisations, but actually her ds doesn't sound similar to mine. However no speech at 2yo definitely should be investigated. If you can, try and find a way to broach this issue with her, for her ds's sake. It might be a hearing issue, a speech issue, or a more complex developmental issue (such as ASD) but whatever, it needs to be looked into.

Hello,your poor SIL.I wonder if she herself inwardly feels there is something wrong but is as yet unable to tackle it?I think I kind of knew dd wasn't developing "normally" but it took me until 18 months to see a HV and set the ball rolling.I guess I hid my head in the sand really.I second the prev posters advice and would also be concerned re speech.It isso hard because you don't know what she is thinking/feeling,so tread lightly and be there for her

Thank you all so much. He is such a sweety and I'd do anything to help him out. Maybe if I just pop by unannounced she would find it harder to get rid of me. I would never judge her or her little man so she has nothing to fear from me. I just want to be there for them.

Isolation to the degree you describe won't affect his development at such a young age - but if your sIl has noticed he has some difficulties she might find it unbearable being around children of a similar age.

Agree with jj, i think its far more likely she is isolating herself because he isnt developing typically than that her not going out much is causing any issues. Do you have a very young child? She may find it hard if you have a child who is same age or younger but achieving more. Agree that no words at two is a concern, and ideally she shld be getting gp or hv to refer to salt, for hearing test and probably to paediatrician

Hi again thanks for your replies. I have three children 5,4 and 18 months. My nephew was IVF and we waited untill they had had the all clear at 12 wks before we tried to conceive. Originally we were planing on the same age gap between all 3 (18 months) but decided to hold off untill they had been through their cycle so as not to add pressure. I going off on a tangent.
Anyway before my dd was born I was constantly calling up asking her she would like to do X Y or Z because I already worried she was starting to hide herself away as was my bro which is why I wondered about the isolation thing. She hasn't seen my little girl and the only way I see my nephew is when my dad looks after him occassionally to give her a break. He adores my dad but other than him and his parents he is so distressed
My mum broke down in a garden centre the other day when a little boy came up to her chatting away. His mum appologised and my mum was smitten. When she asked How old the little one was the lady said he had just turned two. My mum said there was such a huge difference it suddenly became clear to her that something may seriously be wrong. We are all so worried for him and are scared of upsetting my sil too and she seems to be so fragile.
Thankyou all so very much for your replies it has given me something to hold on to. I will try and find a way to suggest him going along for a hearing test or something without causing and upset. Maybe i'll get my dad to do it as my bro is a bit scared and too close perhaps.

Oh it is the worst stage - when you can see the gap but you are stuck with nowhere to go.

Is there any chance she is getting assessments done etc but just not telling you?

You sound like a lovely considerate auntie :) she may find it hard being around your youngest. If sil is into the internet she cld post on mn sn or netmums sn to find mums in a similar position

I'd love to think that she was but I doubt it. Mainly from the things that my brother has said that whenever he has broached the subject it always ends up in a row. She I guess is already so worried and having someone else disscuss it prob just makes it all the more real. I guess when I look at it like that I can see the logic in her locking herself away.
Is it still routine for all two year olds to have a developmental check up with the HV? Both my eldest two had them and I remember them discussing language development etc. From what I know he hasn't had one as yet but maybe that would get the ball rolling. I am spending all of my spare time trying to find ways to help and I am scared I wont be able to. Talked to some freinds about it and a few of them (seperately) have suggested there might be an IVF link .
Even if he does have a developmental disorder of some sort at least if we know then we can all support him to make his life the best it can be. It is the not knowing that is a killer and I and not good at waiting .

No, 2 year checks are no longer routine in all areas.

It is hard, I think all you can do is sit and wait really. Does he go to a nursery/childcare setting?

I don't have any advice, but just wanted to point out that while studies have established an increased chance of cerebral palsy with IVF (still a very rare event), no link has been established between IVF and development delay or ASD.

I wouldn't want any prospective IVF mother reading this thread to freak out.

It is a tough one and she does sound quite fragile.

But maybe if you went round (if you knew when might be a good time not to be disturbed), without your DC and just gently said something to let her open up? I dunno, like, how do you feel things are going now DN is 2?.....and let her talk.

She may collapse in tears & let it all out and you can go from there. Maybe.

Speech esp needs attention & with help he may be fine but it shouldn't really be allowed to go on as it is indefinitely.

primafacie - many babies with cp are originally dx with 'developmental delay' so that doesn't entirely make sense... but i know what you mean. ivf not relevant to the op's concern.

would make an effort to be friendly. take a chocolate cake round and say 'i haven't seen you for ages, how are you?'

your bro needs to man up though. he isn't helping her by not seeking medical advice if she is indeed suffering from pnd or anxiety, for whatever reason. you need to explain you are worried about her, and not let him fly off the handle. how can you support her better? (ask him that, lol, i'm not asking you). maybe invite them all over for sunday lunch every week? get your mum to invite you all? start a family tradition. start small and informal? maybe she might be able to cope with that?

Thanks ladies, I bobbed around this morning, with a big bag of clothes that my boys have grown out of a wonky chocolate cake (thanks madwomanintheattic) and I left my youngest two with my dad like justkeepswimming suggested. She kept me on the doorstep (don't blame her as I didn't call first) but we did have a short chat. I asked how dn was to which she replied "ok" I mentioned that I wanted to start going for more exercise and so weather permitting would be going to the park each morning if they fancied joining us and I also mentioned that I bumped into my Bro's Best freind's, wife (who has a newborn) and said she was feeling pretty lonely and would appreciate some company. Although we didn't get much deeper than that I do feel possitive that I have at least put the ball in her court again and at least she knows I am here if she needs me. I also had an idea about asking her and my bro if I could take dn to jo jingles or tumble tots along with my little girl. It falls when my dad is looking after dn so she wouldn't have to go if it would be too stressfull for her but might be beneficial to him (he loves music).We will see.
Thanks again

Well done for keeping at it. Wld avoid tumbletots as ime its too regimented and frustrating for a poss lang delayed child, think jo jingles may be better, or even a library story time. Hope she takes you up on the park.

Righto Jo Jingles or Library it is than thanks

Sorry to be thick but your nephew has 2 parents why is Dad not taking the day off to go to the dr? Early intervention is crucial for asd or speech delay. She may be entitled to portage worker or speech therapy. It's not uncommon for a parent to be in denial that there is a problem until you go through it you cannot imagine how terrifying it is. It seems as you are closer to your brother your efforts would be better directed towards getting him to take some action? Is he a hands on dad, can he be home earlier / cut hours to be around more? Will he not just get advice himself? You can't rely on HV to pick up problems they usually only respond where a parent raises issues or it's very obvious many dismiss problems. It can be very hard to be around typical children if yours is different. It can be a grief coping mechanism. You need to get expert advice not be speculating about causes. It does not really matter why he is behind what matters is that no more time is lost. Tell your brother to look at Ican afasic and NAS. Can score Mchat to look for asd symptoms And to go to gp. He does not need to take the child he can just go and explain and ask for referral to paediatrician.

Hi thanks Agnesdipesto. My brother is a teacher so he has him from whatever time he can get away from school till sil comes home late in the evening. So really he wounld't even need to take time off I mean surgery is open later some days. He is really great with the little fella but for what ever reason he checks in with sil before he does anything. His argument is that everything feels like criticism at the moment for Sil so no matter what he does she takes it as a personal attack. But really I am with you on this. Whilst, of course, my sil's feelings are very important the issue that has to take priority is my little nephew and the problems that are arising. I am going to ambush him after work today and encourage him to face up. After all there is only so much that my family and I can do. He is in their hands. Once the ball is rolling maybe sil would feel better too knowing something is being done to help. I just hope I don't tread on any toes!

if he is a teacher he should understand the importance of early intervention. if problems are ignored until a child starts school, it makes it more difficult to get any issues addressed, and causes a nightmare for teaching ans support staff who have to kick off any interventions required intiially without any funding or adequate clasroom help.

(it is also your sil who needs help though - your nephew may be absolutely fine, but she is obviously struggling with anxiety or depression. her dh needs to understand that he's doing neither her nor their son any favours by enabling her to hide/ bury her head in the sand/ whatever is happening)

fwiw, it's really difficult to get any therapy appointments in the evenings, as they mostly run during the daytime, with post 3pm appointments usually taken up by cvhildren who are in school. even most school children who require therapy usually have it during the day. in 7 years, i don't think i've ever had an appointment that started later than 2pm... all that would probably happen at the gp is a referral to a developmental paed, or direct to slt if the gp thought that appropriate. there are ususally extremely long waiting lists to be assessed by slt, and then a further waiting list if the assessment shows a requirement for ongoing support, so really, the earlier the referral is done is better for all concerned. particularly if the developmental assessment highlights potential spectrum disorders etc - there are tons of 'early bird' type courses available for parents to give them support and ideas, but you do have to be visible in order to benefit.

fingers crossed he mans up, or that you manage to get sil to open up a bit and she might reassure everyone there isn't actually a problem, she's just shy?

TBH I would try and find out who Health visitor is. I would explain your concerns and explain while you dont want feedback you are concerned. 2 year checks still go ahead and that would be a great time for the HV to pop in and see LO and SIL.

Hi im new her just need som help plz!!!
My son is going to be 3 on the 17th. We have jsut hade the 1st off many developmental assessment because of concerns regarding speech delay, poor attention ect. Just got a letter from the consultant saying "I felt that X had either sever speech and language impairament,secondary social impairament or social communication disorder" PLZ CAN SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT THIS IS?!!! And if he have 1 of this what can be done?! thx

samira - as the assessments go on, the paed will decide which interventions are appropriate, and refer your ds to the right therapy team for support. probably starting with slt (speech and language). if you start your own thread on the sn board with those in the title, you'll get loads of advice.