Mornings: am in despair and need sound advice

[MissM]

DD started school in September. She's not 5 until May, but has coped reasonably well so far.

My problem is the mornings. We have to get out of the house by 8am to get DS to pre-school. It has to be this early to be able to get back home and out again to get DD to school.

Every single morning she dithers and dillies and dallies over putting on her uniform, eating her breakfast, cleaning her teeth etc. etc. etc. Every single morning one of us ends up shouting at the other, and she often cries. She just will not get herself ready!

I have tried everything to get her to stop procrastinating: from gentle words, encouragement, star charts, being understanding, to shouting, nagging, yelling, screaming... (not quite, but you get the picture).

I know everyone has nightmare mornings, but I'm getting to the stage where the stress is getting too much. How can I persuade DD to get herself dressed so we both don't end up in a state? I feel like I need to crack this now or we'll be in a horrible place by the time she's 15.

Forget the walking to school and concentrate on her morning routine instead. You're putting the cart before the horse here -- yes, walking is good for everyone, but it's putting pressure on everyone to get that walk in and is not necessary. On a list of priorities, it should be quite far down, behind encouraging the self care (dressing and tooth brushing) which is the really important thing in the mornings.

Your DD probably hates to be rushed in the mornings and probably feels incompetent about dressing and taking care of her teeth if she's being rushed and nagged every day, as these skills are not that easy for 4 yos -- it's more important that she has the time she feels she needs to accomplish those tasks than it is to walk. She probably gets enough exercise during the school day, but having enough time to do the dressing right and go out to school in a calm frame of mind, with breakfast eaten and no doubt about whether she is capable of the tasks she needs to accomplish are important.

I understand you wanting to walk, but you're just making life more complicated for yourself by coming home just to set off out again.

I'd concentrate on getting out on time and drive until she's a bit older and able to get herself ready better.

I think 4 is quite young to get herself ready if she is making a fuss. i have 3dds and still help my 8 year old if we are in a hurry. They want to be in control so maybe you can try and let her think she is in control somehow. My middle dd is 5 and has just started school but is being a pain in the morning so i am paying him 10p a day to stay in his room. We've got a new money box and it has worked a treat. stickers and charts never worked for him. would probably be giving him this as pocket money anyway.

My DD is quite a bit older (just turned 6) but was starting to procrastinate a lot in the mornings, getting distracted by books, games, her brother etc.
What has worked well for her also is that she has a clock in her room, she knows that she needs to be dressed and downstairs for 8 am, I know, although she doesn't as it becomes less of an issue once we're all downstairs, that she needs to be brushing her hair by 8.20 and out the door by 8.30.
Even if she's not telling the time, putting a bit of onus on her (though not too much, I still often help DD with her tights), can at least reduce the nagging.

I drive on my work days and we walk the other days. Dont make a cross for your own back. You will at least habe a few stress free mornings.

MissM I really disagree with people who are saying 4 is too young to get ready herself.

I had this exact problem until a couple of months ago. We have to leave the house at 7.30am to get to childminder so were on a strict timeframe. I would get up, get DD up and then tell her to 'eat her breakfast, brush her teeth and get dressed'

Three simple tasks, I thought!

But then i had some fab advice which was to break each part down so that is was manageable for her.

For the first couple of weeks I got up extra early so that I was completely ready myself and could help her with her tasks (or atleast watch her so she didn't stray)

Now, I get her up and take her down stairs. She eats her breakfast in front of the TV while I get ready. I pop my head in half way through and if the TV is distracting her she is moved to the table quickly.

Once that's done she brings her plate and washes it up (not very well and I have to do it again but it's all part of the learning!) And she is then asked to brush her teeth.

When her teeth are finished she only then receives the next instruction which is to get dressed in the clothes that i laid out the night before while she was asleep.

Breaking it down in to manageable requests has really helped us a lot. She was overwhelmed by being asked to 'get ready' and I ended up chasing her round the house shouting at her because she wasn't doing anything she was told.

Don't do it all for her whatever you do! Yes it's quicker but there are loads of things we could do for our kids to get things down quicker but it wont help them in the long run.

Our dentist advised that DD clean her own teeth in the morning and I clean them at night. Apparently if you clean their teeth for them they don't learn properly and are lazy about it as they get older. DSD is testiment to this.

ha ha your emoticon has nice teeth!

I've just read 123 Magic which has some really good ideas re morning routines.

Mine are too little to try it with yet (17 months), but sound like really good ideas in there.

barmbrack out of interest (if you don't mind reading my post just a couple above) does it advise anything like what i was advised to do? I'd just be interested because it has worked wonders for me.

Hi secondMrsS,

He has two big behaviour management strategies, one for 'start' activities (like getting ready for school). Yes, quite like what you did above, but it advises that the stages are broken down on a sort of chart, with illustrations, and that you use a timer to count down for the child.

In a similar way to the 'story' idea, you tell the child :If you get all these things done, then we will use all the rest of the time on the timer to have a story / play together / do something special"

A sticker for every day she gets it right too, if that sort of thing floats her boat.

Also, the book is big on NOT doing loads of explaining.

He also has a method for getting them to STOP unwanted behaviours (like messing about when they should be getting ready) Instead, of the child is not doing what it ought to be, you 'count' them. No explaining, just say, as soon as they start messing about "That's 1", then "That's 2". At 3 they get a 4 minute time out, but apparently most kids don't get there.

Hope that makes some sense.

I'd definitely drive on the days you work which will give you a lot more time and then walk on the other days.

I drive DS1 to school on the days DS2 goes to pre school and walk the other days. It makes sense

To clarify, when I say "not doing loads of explaining", he means not saying "come on darling, I need you to do this now as if you don't we will be late for school and mummy will be late for work and you don't want mummy to get into trouble etc etc." He says cut all of that sort of chat out of behaviour management. He says it is counter productive and kids don't generally respond to it. A clear indication that they need to change their behaviour and do what you have reasonably asked is what he recommends, and 'natural consequences' if not (like not getting the story/playtime etc.)

And you are NOT allowed to nag or say "I told you so" or anything if they don't get it right the first few times, but you CAN praise, a lot, if they do get it right.

I know a lot of MNetters have had a lot of success with his strategies - I bought the book because I have seen it repeatedly recommended on here!

Our morning routine is for me to be up by 7:30am. DS1 & 2 may already be up at this point. I give them breakfast which needs to be finished by 8:00am. I then give them their clothes and ask them to get dressed whilst I shower and dress. I'm usually done by about 8:20am, which gives me enough time to come down and chivvy them into getting their shoes and jumpers on whilst I do packed lunches. At 8:30am I supervise tooth brushing and we then get coats on to be out by 8:40am.

DS2 is 4 (5 in July) and can get himself completely ready, given enough time. If they're having school dinners, I often help DS2 get ready. He stands there and I dress him. Takes 2 minutes rather than him taking 25!

If I get up early (7am), then it's lovely and relaxed and we have time to have a second read of reading books, look at spellings etc. Just depends on how attached to my bed I am in the morning!

We drive as I go straight from school to work, and then from work to school in the afternoon.

You are making things too hard for yourself. Find some other way to get your DD exercising, leave later, and help her get dressed. She's not really up to it yet - especially under pressure - and you will both just start the day stressed.

I still dress my son who will be 5 in April. It is just quicker and easier. I let him dress himself on weekends.

Well I've mixed and matched advice, but am now intrigued by the 123 Magic book. I also think DD is able to get herself dressed - I've seen her do it (and DS who is 18 months younger) - but I thought long and hard about whether the demand to do so quickly is making her more anxious. So today I told her that she needed to get herself dressed, but that I would help with the tricky bits. Hence I helped her do up the fiddly button on her t-shirt and put her sleeves into her dress (it's a pinafore that does up at the front and she often gets her arms stuck on the way in).

I dangled a story as a carrot before we left if both were ready in time, and (crucially I guess), I took the advice to drive DS to pre-school later, park a way from the school and scoot the last bit. That bought us an extra half hour which I have to say made all the difference. So I'm going to try that on the days that I work as some of you also do.

Result: happy DD, smiling, no tears, no ranting on my part and a much calmer morning! DH also helped by clearing up the breakfast things before he left which was an unexpected bonus. My period arrived this morning, so I may have been more emotional than usual yesterday (small understatement!)

I think you are making life very hard for yourself. Just get her dressed and drive her to school. You have nice ideals, but they don't fit with your actual circumstances.

Ah, x posted. Glad things can now be different :)

Thanks barmbrack i think I'll buy it. I don't go in for too many explainations either so it sounds like a book that might re-affirm that what i beleive I'm doing right i actually am doing right iykwim. We all need that reaffirming sometimes don't we!

Absolutely. Good luck with it all.