ds's challenging behaviour

[pumpkin28]

Have just had a dreadful half term week. Ds aged 4 can be a challenge at certain times. He is strong willed and often does not listen/follow instructions. On holiday as a family and dh has been getting quite angry over his behaviour. He clearly believes that I do not discipline him enough. However, his way of disciplining him is to shout and had hit him on occassions. (Not hard) Something I do not believe in.

Need some tips on how to handle this situation. I do appreciate that I probably need to be firmer but I know there are issues to be resolved with dh's behaviour too.

I don't know as I am in the middle of this as well. I will watch the thread with interest.

Thank you gaelic. Let's hope we get some good advice

Consistency.
What do you do?
My rules for dd1 also strong willed and angry at times.

1. Do not hit your sister with that or I will take it off you until tomorrow and you will go into time out.
2. dd1 hits her again
3. I remove it and it doesn't reunite with her until tomorrow and she sits in our hallway on her own.
4. She has to apologise to her sister.

Or

1. DD1 please eat your dinner, you have until we have all finished, then your plate will go.
2. DD1 continues to dawdle and doesn't finnish (or nearly finish).
3. Plate goes, dinner goes in the bin and no dessert.

We have had this approach since 18 months so usually have good behaviour. More difficult to start at 4 years but it should work.

Don't make idle threats that can't be followed through.
Always carry out any threat after 1 warning.

Oh and I agree hitting and shouting doesn't work and makes children more likely to copy your bad behaviour . It acts as a negative reinforcer - bad attention is better than none. Look at what the precursor has been, try to understand the frustration and deal with the underlying problem, not just the behaviour. There is usually a reason.

All good captaincrocfamily, and I try to do all that with DS but to no avail at the moment. The one thing I wish I could stop doing is shouting, but I get so sick of asking the same thing 10 or 12 times! From what I've read though, 4 year old boys are more challenging, even, than 4 year old girls due to a big testosterone surge. Not belittling the challenge of any 4 year old though.

I have looked after both. I have found girls more determined, answer for everything but boys listen less . Try getting down to eye level, eyeballing rather than shouting works, then follow through.

Oh and another thing I do is do controlled shouting Give a warning of 'do as I ask I am going to shout. Then let rip if they continue . That way you don't lose it. I do put on a very angry face though but don't often need to do that.

Controlled shouting - I like the sound of that one! Going to try it tomorrow.

Since you seem to know what you're talking about, please tell me it gets easier after 4!

Both of my boys were horrid at four.
It was without doubt the worst age, and yes it just gets better and better and easier and easier.
I've also read that there is a huge testosterone surge at 4. It also often coincides with starting school which is stressful and tiring for them. We had tantrums and bad behaviour that we had never had before.
The Captain's advice is sound. Something else that helped here was moving bedtime forward, to about 6.30pm

One thing I can see from your post - "but I get so sick of asking the same thing 10 or 12 times!"
Ask once. If ignored ask again and warn. If ignored again then follow through.

If they know you're going to keep on asking then it becomes a game they've won.

Much easier said than done I know because it is an effort but it is also worth it. But your OH will have to follow the same tactics.

Yep, I agree with previous people's advice.

Ask nicely, ask again maybe more firmly ( if there hasn't been previous refusal to do things.... if there has then straight onto next step ), then it's warning and into punishment whatever that is (for us it's being sent to his room).

You need to agree with DH over no hitting, no shouting (well certainly the first and on most occasions the second) regarding punishment. If you have clear strategy on what punishment is then this may make it easier to get him on board.

Oh and avoid I'm going to count to five and if its not done then......

Only do it if your going to do 1,2,3,4,5 then consequence. The 1,2, I mean it you have until 5. 3, I really mean it, 4, I've asked you to do it now please do it by the time I get to 5, 5. Oh thankyou for listening. Yes when they wanted!!!

Not saying you do but seems to be the habit when your fed up with asking.

With regards for boys of 4, touch him when you talk so you know he's listening, ask him to repeat back what you've asked. Clear consequences that are carried through ...... and most importantly a good pillow fight when you feel you or him getting cross - it's a great way to reconnect. [hgrin]

oh sorry just realsided that came over a bit ranty - can't you tell I've spent the day with a parent that does.

Sorry.

I realise I've hijacked pumpkin's thread .

Anyhow, I think we are following all the suggested strategies. We most certainly do follow through with promised consequences, but he does not care! And it makes no difference. He is on a mission to control the household just now and I'm at the end of my tether!

On the up side we had a much better day today. He was helpful, mostly did as he was told and actually ate his dinner for a change. I don't know what was different but I wish I did!

Say "No!" earlier on in the day.

If DS is being really difficult he responds well to firm handling from early in the day.. rather than the "trying to be nice" approach that winds you up and you end up being the opposite when you've had enough!!!!

Be polite but firm, ignore screaming, stick to your guns.

In fact we don't really allow screaming here (!) Well... a bit is ignored but anything- screaming/moaning/tantrumming etc etc is a "go to your room" offence....
.
Once boundaries are established and you are in control everything much easier!

Hmmm, this is not supposed to sound like I know it all- I don't. You are on a losing battle if they are tired- so yes move bedtime earlier.
Also... once you get on a negative spiral hard to get out of.. you need to break it somehow, start having fun and enjoying stuff again rather than it being moan central, so plan some stuff that you can both enjoy and go from there.
Keep expectations of behaviour clear and consistent.
Sermon over, good luck!!!!

Like evryone has said, no parent is perfect. We can try our best.
Definately agree about tiredness in reception and trying hard to control the household DD1 tries but doesn't get very far. .

Oh and thats a really good tip regarding boys especially, touch them when you talk to them to get them to tune in. Boys need short instructions to and without to much detailed explanation or they tend to switch off (same with men!).

Diffuse tantrums with 'stop or I will tickle you!' by the time they have been tickled they are in a better mood and it diffuses things quite well.

thecaptaincrocfamily - we tried your "controlled shouting" today! I also started an "indoor voices" rule. I think both of those might have contributed to the better day, actually. It felt less fraught all round.

Ah, thats good glad it was a better one. Just a case of picking the right tool for the moment iyswim. Minor misdameanors = minor solutions. Only shout for serious offences then it comes as more of a shock when you do iyswim.

I do still use the pillow fight one with DS 6. He's usually so chirpy and pretty well behaved but a terrible relaxer. When he's whinging grates I often pelt him with the pillow then we have a fun pillow fight and often it'll wear him out and will chill on the sofa with hot chocolate and biscuits and then be in a better mood.

The touching works brilliantly but is a PITA when you want to yell call from another rom to get dressed, shoes etc.

thecaptaincrocfamily some great advice. Can I just ask (DS almost 3) when you remove DC say from soft play as they are being rough and continued after a warning, if they then throw a wobbly and try to run back, kicking shouting etc what do you then do?? I am finding the almost 3's REALLY hard!!

trying - is there an area away from the soft play you could take DS, empty party room, corridor where the toilets, baby change. Just thinking away from where he can see the soft play he may calm down enough for 'the chat' .

Failing that if you have decided to leave I would just take him out to the car ignoring the tantrum. I know it is easy to write and hard to do but they learn very quickly that the behaviour won't get attention.

It is a hard age.

Thank you for your advice. I too had a better day today. Like the idea of touching. It certainly is a good way of getting their attention.