Does shouting work?

[DayDreama]

Myself and dh have a difference of opinion in disciplining our ds age 2.7. I find that raising my voice at him when he misbehaves only makes his behaviour worse so prefer to quietly explain that whatever he has done is unacceptable and leave it at that. Dh believes that he shouldn't be allowed to get away with things and we should be shouting at him so that he realises he has done something wrong and won't do it again because he is afraid of being told off. I can see his point of view but it doesn't seem to work for me. Does anyone have any views either way?

In my very humble experience, shouting is very unproductive. I have learnt the hard way!! I still end up doing it, but only because I'm human.

Shouting at a 2yo especially unproductive.

If you shout they just start to tune you out and if you are already shouting at a 2 year old, you will have to bellow and scream at him when he is 4 to have the same effect.

Think about what you are teaching him by shouting. Would you like him to get his point across to others by shouting? If someone does something he doesn't like, should he shout? You are teaching him other life lessons when you discipline him. I think you are much more sensible in your approach than your husband.

And being afraid of being told off is not the reason we want our children to behave themselves, surely! Explaining why something is wrong and letting them deal with consequences is much more effective and teaches them a better moral outlook.

Thanks for the response ragged, it makes me feel more confident that I'm not letting him down by not being strict enough or something. I also had the same disagreement with my sister when she completely lost her rag with ds for lashing out at her son. I understand that she was upset but surely it is up to me how to discipline my own son?

I think we've all done it in the heat of the moment when the emotion takes over, but I wouldn't plan to use it as a method of disciplining a child partly because ds has become a very shouty toddler because I've shouted at him too much

That is a good point TPL, I think I just worry that he is not listening to me when I tell him not to do something and he just goes and does the same thing again. Some people may say that being told off is the consequence that they have to deal with??

At two, your son has very little impulse control, so yes he is going to do things even though he knows he shouldn't. I have never shouted at my children and DS2 is now a very well behaved (for his age) 4 year old. It might just be luck but it certainly hasn't made DS1 into a naughty boy.

Thank you TPL, that makes me feel better, I think I am just suffering a bit of a crisis of confidence. DS is usually a pretty good but on a family holiday a few weeks ago his behaviour became very unpredictable. I feel like everyone is judging me for not being able to control my son because I'm too soft on him.

You can still tell him off without shouting, and remove him from the situation in to time out of some sort. Not shouting is not an excuse for not disciplining. My dd is 6 months older than yours but I normally give her a warning of time out then follow it through if she continues - generally the warning is enough. If he "lashes out" at other children, he needs to learn that that is not acceptable behaviour. My dd would have been removed from the situation to calm down and asked to apologise.

I do shout occasionally but keep it more for dangerous things rather than naughty...the other day ds ran out of playgroup and there's a road just outside so I yelled at him 'stop! Now!' and he stopped dead,burst into tears and came running back crying. I do think shouting has a place but if it's just very occasional it has an effect,where as constant shouting would probably just be water off a ducks back

I am not looking for an excuse for not disciplining, just looking for an effective method of discipline. DS knows that lashing out at other children is unacceptable behaviour, when it happened I removed him from the situation, explained why it was wrong and he ran back saying sorry without any prompting from me. But he went on to do the same thing again. I have thought a lot about my discipline methods but really think that shouting at him and reducing him to tears is not effective but that doesn't mean I am doing nothing.

"But he went on to do the same thing again."

Well, yeah, he's 2! I don't think that repeating bad behaviour means that your methods aren't working, just that firstly, he can't always control his emotions and behaviour and so will lash out etc, and secondly, kids love to test boundaries. I know DS will be deliberately naughty just to see what the reaction will be this time...

I think you are doing the right thing. Shouting doesn't work. I need to write that in big letters and stick it up somewhere around the house because I often resort to shouting but regret it because it either has no impact at all or just makes DS cry.

Have you read "How to talk so kids will listen?" It's all about how to get kids to do the right thing without shouting etc. Well worth a read.

I think that is quite common in 2yr olds. Sounds like you are doing the right thing removing him and making him apologise (they do this for any child hitting at ds's nursery) but I think it takes a while for the message to sink in! I'd keep doing what you're doing

I've always tried to "explain" to my 2 year old DD why certain behaviour is not good, in low, measured tones, at eye level etc. Then in exasperation last week I started using a more stern and shouty voice - she actually got worse and rather mouthy! So I am back to the low toned, calm, explaining method and reciting to myself "She's only two, she's only two!"

All 2.5yo boys are little thugs towards other tots, imvho.
The only cure really is to keep on top of them, you don't get to sit and chat with adults at social occasions, you literally spend all your energy monitoring them and being ready to intervene at any second.

If they fight over toys I usually give the toy to the more innocent child,btw.

Children at any age quickly become immune to shouting.

I wouldn't myself explain to a child at this age either. after the first 5 or so words they won't follow the logic. keep voice low and calm. remove him from the room if necessary. but no shouting.

let your dh see this thread.

'No' in a word. It intimidates, humiliates and scares them (in my very humble opinion) Having 2 boys, the oldest almost 14 ... I can honestly say that our lives changed for the better once we stopped yelling at them. Get their attention, hand on shoulder and tell them "No!" and then explain why. If it happens again, it's time out or another appropriate punishment. All shouting does is eleviate the stress you are experiencing at that precise moment. Good luck

Thank you everyone for your support, I now have plenty of ammunition to defend myself next time I get accused of being too soft (and with a family xmas on the horizon there will be a lot of opportunities!!). Perhaps this thread will bring DH round to my way of thinking as well. I actually find shouting more stressful than the situation itself, just my personality I suppose, so it's difficult having pressure to start doing it.

No.

I still do it, mind you, but it doesn't work. I try to be less shouty and that's definitely more effective when I manage it.

NO IT BLOODY WELL DOESN'T

sorry, couldn't resist.

now going to read thread and most liekly agree with other posters.

Shouting has never worked for me.

There are, however, significant verbal cues that are not about volume. Deeper 'stern' tones can signify seriousness and demand attention, for example (many parents have a 'stern' voice). Asking a child to stand still and look at you can too. As DS1 got older pleading can work ('I know you want to play in the ball pit on this ferry, but I need to lie here and be sick a lot, so can you lie on the opposite bunk pleaaase?). But I think rarity matters-a child constantly being addressed sternly or begged with will tune out, they need a sense of the specialness of the situation, even if they can't grasp the rationale yet.

Shouting to attract attention, or in the heat of the moment when you want to stop something now - ok.

shouting all the time = ineffective

shouting at my toddler can make him throw up, so i prefer ignoring/ exclusion/ simple hysical intervention to stop behaviour instead. DD is older, and explaining things to her works much better. yelling can make her lose the plot and be beyond reason.

Adela has it about right about each occasion being special..

I would also add (having a child that likes the ability to cause removal or exclusion) that demanding response is also helpful (e.g. what did you just do? push, 'what don't we do becasue it hurts?' 'push'). The time out helps, it smoothes things with other parents and eventual patterns seem built up (if anything too far-won't go out without a sun hat on when sunny now, after phase of taking it off). It's also building cognitive skills.

Langauge matters, but DS1 has quite limited language (dyspraxic) and you can phrase the questions appropriately.

Think one of the problems I have with shouting or reasoning is that I can get so wrapped up in what I'm saying I forget to think about whether or how it's being understood.