Does anyone else have a school age child who does not sleep?

[scattyspice]

DD is 5 1/2 and has rarely slept through the night, she will only sleep if I am in her bed and even then wakes me up through the night saying she has had a bad dream/can't get to sleep etc. This is every night. I have tried sleeping on a mattress next to her bed, but she cries/complains continuously until I get in her bed. If I leave the room she howls uncontrollably. This week have we have tried controlled crying (again) but she can go on for several hours and each night we have given up when ds is also wide awake and dh is on the verge of violence.

In the morning she is sorry, promises not to wake me up again etc, but during the night she regresses into a crazy toddler!!

What with DS as well I haven't slept properly for 7 yrs and am starting to fall apart!

Any suggestions very welcome I honestly feel we've tried everything. .

Is it just me?

Has she always been like this? I thought I had this stuff truly sorted but my dd, 5.5, has got A LOT worse in the last year.

Our solution has involved having the light on low (but not very low at all), using audio CDs and tapes, and having certain play things available e.g. blocks or colouring. I now have to lie down with her for a few minutes while the CD starts - soemthing I never had to do before. I feel we have really gone backwards.

I despair of her sleep though and really worry that she just doesn't get enough. I was a terrible sleeper myself, absolutely petrified of the dark (still have a light on when dh is away) with recurrent nightmares - so I am partially resigned .

I love my sleep though - so much sympathy.

my dd2 is 6 and has slept pretty well for the last week.

That's it though - you could have been describing her in your OP.

I have no advice whatsoever I'm afraid, we let her come in our bed whenever she wakes up and she spends the rest of the night there - it means we all get some sleep and she's not disturbing dd1 and ds by crying.

Most mornings she can't remember how she got there or the bad dreams that she had... we know she had some howlers because we were awake through them but she can't remember, although she does know she has bad dreams, just can't remember anything specific.

You have my total sympathy. I am feeling quite good at the mo but am fairly sure it won't last

oh - one piece of advice I can give you is: talk to the school and let them know what she's like.

My dd's school are really understanding and if she's had a really bad night they do tend to make allowances for her if she's not quite herself - don't think they'd go as far as to let her off doing something really naughty, but a bit of answering back or not being as chirpy as usual tends to go unpunished.

And if you've got in there first, at least they won't think that you're letting her stay up till midnight on her playstation or whatever (I presume you're not )

I can't tell you what a relief it is to read a thread like this.

My DS is 5.5 and still wakes up most nights. He's not too bad going to bed initially as long as he knows I am upstairs (still a pain). However he wakes up anywhere between midnight and 3 am and can't self settle.

He got a lot better about 6 months ago and was sleeping through every night but recently something spooked him and we are right back to square one.

The worst thing for us is that our bedroom is downstiars so he has started waking up dd (12) to bring him down and she is now suffering as well.

I am off after tomorrow so we are making a concerted effor to sort it during half term. Not sure quite how yet but I can't let it go on affecting DD.

Will keep watching for tips!

Thank you all.

She has never slept well, she was born with a club foot and had to wear splints at night until she was 2. If she kicked too hard they came off and had to be put back on, so the only solution was for her to sleep on the sofa bed with me (at that stage ds was usually in bed with dh). DS started sleeping by himself at 3.5yrs (spontaneously). We are still waiting for dd to sleep by herself.

I think nightmares and fears (of the dark, spiders etc) are a problem too.

I am considering taking her to the GP (don't really know what they can do though ).

Thanks for the tip about school. Her teacher has already made a comment about her neading to go to bed earlier!

Perhaps you could get a referral to a play therapist - we are waiting for one for dd concerning a different issue.

This will certainly not be relevant to some of you but it might be worth a try for those whose DC has started waking at a similar time each night.

DS2 (age 6, then) went through a stage of waking every night some time between 12 and 1 and then beig unable to get back to sleep, feeling spooked etc. After weeks of him coming into our bed, I discovered by accident (woke him when I went to check on him at our bedtime), that if I go in and roused him to the point of him rolling over in bed or murmuring in his sleep, then he would not wake later in the night. Something to do with altering sleep patterns.

There is something called Waking to Sleep - not sure if this is the same - may be worth a Google

Thanks Acinonyx - what does a play therapist do?

Thanks JLC - I'll give that a try, what time do you do that?

We had a better night last night, I dragged a mattress in and when she came and woke me up (about 2am) i tucked her back into bed and slept on the mattress next to her bed (she agreed to this for once). She didn't wake again and I got more sleep than trying to sleep in her bed. Hopefully she will start to learn to get herself back to sleep.

I feel more hopeful.

Can you use / have you used reward stickers or treats eg "DD, if you go to sleep and stay asleep / in your bed until morning then you will get [treat or sticker]"?

Apparently, the play therapist can try to work on the underlying behavioural issues, e.g. in this case, they might work on the fears she has at night. They do this all through play. It's not that easy to get the referral () as there are not enough NHS therapists for the demand. If you think it might help and you could afford it, there are private child therapists too (obviously make sure they are highly reputable).

I can't say how effective it is as we are STILL waiting......

ds is nearly 6 and has always needed us there to get to sleep,until about a month ago. He suddenly got an independent streak so we capitalised on it.
First I moved to the chair and just held his hand while he went to sleep. Gradually took hand away gently just before he dropped off. Then went to sitting at opposite end of chair.

Then we moved the chair to the door, and at the same time he had a story with me/Daddy then read his own story while one of us sat with him, then turned his own light off and lay down. No talking from Mummy or Daddy.

Then we sat outside his door while he read, and when he put the light off quick check, kiss and cuddle, and back to outside. I'd usually read, shuffle about a bit and cough so he could hear me there.

Finally it was lights off and Mummy or Daddy downstairs, with checking every few mins.

We did this with star charts, 1 star for going to sleep without holding hands, another for turning own light off and closing eyes till asleep, and another for going to sleep without us in the room. We made a HUGE chart with lots of little tiny prizes along the way and finally we've formed a habit and he loves feeling grown up by being allowed to read and choose when the light goes off.

I'm really rambling...does that help? Little by little is the key. Read Elizabeth Pantley, she has a baby book and a toddler book, the toddler book has "no cry sleep solutions" in it and the principles are similar to what we did.

It does get better....

Just to say you're not alone. Our 5 year old needs one of us with her until she goes to sleep. Then gets up a few times in the night looking for us. She usually ends up crawling into our bed at some point. Well i say usually, I mean every night. She's too big to lock in with stair gates and tbh I don't really want to go down this kind of route when she's frightened. Finally reward charts seem to be working for other things so I'm thinking of introducing it for sleeping in her own bed, settling herself. Also hoping she might just grow out of it. We have a rule of reading one story then lights out. We pretend to go to sleep on the floor next to her and usually she's asleep in 10 minutes this way.

Our 6 year old daughter has not slept properly since birth. We have literally tried everything and engaged all manner of professionals to assist us. Sometimes things will work for a short time and we think 'success'! As soon as we relax she starts getting up in the night saying she's not tired, screaming in the night (to get in our bed), refusing to go to bed in the first place (we often have to fireman's lift her up the stairs!). .. the list goes on, I'm sure you get the picture. Frankly we've had only a handful of weeks of solid uninterrupted sleep in the past 6 years.

We are currently using a star chart and she is working toward a Big Reward (a DS - not my choice but it seems to be motivating her). If she wakes us up in the night she doesn't get a star. If she causes lots of fuss in the night she loses two stars. So far this has resulted in four nights out of seven where she will sleep. But I know that very soon she will lose interest in this and we'll be back to square one.

I do have the utmost sympathy for any parents still dealing with this..I will certainly look at the Waking to Sleep info out there, not heard of that before. Sorry to ramble!

My four year old is a terrible sleeper. It was getting better over the summer, but since starting school in September his sleeping has become horrible again. He goes to sleep ok but typically wakes around 1am screaming, with dreadful nightmares, and comes into bed with me, but then can be awake for 2-3 hours. Then up between 5-5.30. He's exhausted, and the more tired he gets the worse his sleeping gets. During half-term I'm going to try and get him to nap during the day as I've found in the past that that can break the pattern of over-tiredness. I've also bought today a CD of relaxation and meditation techniques for him to listen to as he goes to sleep and in the hope that he might put it on when he wakes at night. I don't know whether it'll work, but anything's worth a try!

scattyspice - It's between 10 and 11pm, when we go to bed. Stopped him waking in the night any time between 12 and 2am

Lots of great advice. Star charts have not helped so far, as she did well last night I gave her a star today (and my friend who is a diner lady gave her a house point . Hopefully if she can get enough stars to actually recieve a reward she may get the point.

Play therapy sounds interesting, she does have alot of fears (won't even go to the cinema with the family etc). I might see whether there is something I can do with her myself to tackle this.

Calm bedtimes have always been rare as she shares a room with her brother (who is 7) so they tend to talk etc after lights out, consequently she falls asleep with DS chattering away to her. They are both adamant that they want to continue sharing a room.

I am working on gradual withdrawal. No more getting in her bed, I'll stick with sleeping on a mattress by her bed for now, then work on getting rid of the mattress. Oh to sleep in my own bed again...