20mo refuses to be disciplined!

[drivingmisscrazy]

just simple things - she's basically pretty well behaved, but consistently chucks her bowl or plate on the floor at mealtimes. A sharp 'no' or a cross voice (with accompanying scowl), or withdrawing our attention has absolutely no effect at all. This is true more generally - she just grins, or ignores us and carries on, takes no notice of 'stop' or 'no' or 'don't', although she understands them perfectly well. The food thing is really driving me nuts at this point - and it's not as if we can distract or remove her, as she's in her high chair.

She will say 'naughty' when we tell her off, but smiles as she does it and never seems to learn not to do the things that are naughty. Are my expectations too high for a child of her age? I am starting to feel as if she is getting the upper hand a bit, and I know that's not good for her. How can I get her to stop doing things that I don't want her to do? She's too young for time out and has a very limited understanding of cause and effect.

Any advice welcome!

Well she is very young and the dropping her food is her way of learning to understand cause and effect.
I'd put down a mat and buy one of those dishes that have a sucker on the bottom tbh and try not to get into battles.

Yes, your expectations are too high. she is still a baby.

if you don't want her to throw the plate on the floor don't gie her a plate. just give her a small amount of food on the tray. keep replenishing as necessary

hate to say it but in our house this went on for some weeks and one day they just stopped. pour yourself a glass of wine, know she's going to do it and it will pass

As you said 'limited understanding of cause and effect'), she is too young for 'discipine' and is simply exploring: throwing a bowl does give a very satisfying noise and reaction from mummy .

What you are describing is pretty normal toddler behaviour. FWIW, my DS4 is now 30 months and yesterday threw a whole cucumber (don't ask!) against his beaker of milk which went FLYING all over the kitchen . I screamed, first with fright, then at him, he giggled.

It is very very hard to remain calm, I know. IME distraction or removal works, sometimes both. 'Look at the giant squirrel in the garden - oh, now it's gone. Nevermind, let's see if we can find it in the living room'. It does not have to make sense, just catch their attention. I've been known to say 'Look at the dead seagull' pointing at the sky - they always look and I get a giggle out of it .

Look, I am saying all this and I know that I have been reduced to frustrated tears dealing with psychopathic toddlers in the past and no doubt will be again.
Chant after me 'This too shall pass...'

Also 'Toddler Taming' is a good book with explanations as to why they behave as they do and some good tricks how to manage toddlers whilst waiting for them to grow up.

I think she is too young for any real discipline. I agree the bowls with a sucker on the bottom can help. She will be able to pull the bowl off the table and throw it, but it takes a little more effort so you will get a warning when it is going to happen and then have a chance of catching the bowl!

My DD did not often throw her food, but whenever she did I would simply say "OK you have finished now" and remove all food.

At your DD's age any attention is good attention in her mind. So withdrawing attention / removing whatever she was using to be naughty with is the only way to go.

this is all very sound (especially the wine advice) :) :o I should be clear, I don't want to 'discipline' her - I think she is charming...but I also don't want her to grow up into a badly behaved adult (we have managed to get her to say please, thank you and sorry - well sometimes...)

thanks - I think she is totally normal!

Two choices:

1. Just don't react at all, don't even look in the direction of the dropped/thrown stuff. Put her food directly on her highchair tray and when she is finished take her out of her chair without commenting on the dropped stuff and clean up likewise. Interact as normal otherwise. She'll soon get bored of trying to get a reaction.

2. Grin and bear it for a month or two.

I did the first - it worked within a couple of days. DD soon realised that if she threw it on the floor then she had less to eat.

I over came the plate dropping (with dd2) by making sure I asked her for her plate before she got an opportunity to drop it. It took a week or so, but she soon got the idea to pass it to us, rather than drop it.

Either that, or she pushes it away, but she is at the table, so easier for her to do that!

Otherwise, she is too young for too much discipline, choose your battles.

I feel your pain!

My 24 month old does this too. In fact, she's graduated to throwing everything and anything and giggling when she gets told off (also says "naughty" when she does it) so she knows she shouldn't be doing it.

A couple that really annoy me are throwing things off shelves in supermarkets (so now she has to be strapped into the buggy or trolley, which she hates) and throwing stones from the path to the grass in our garden (got put back inside for a minute). She's also started throwing toys out of the bath (DH does bath time so it doesn't bother me too much ) which has resulted in no bath toys. The only thing she does seem to have learned not to throw is her toy cars (at me) because it means I won't push them for her until she hands them to me properly.

It seems like it's the only really deliberately naughty thing she does but she gets to apply it in so many situations that it gets really frustrating.

Don't worry about her growing up, driving, you will be changing your way of dealing with her so many times because of the way she grows up and needs a different approach After all, you are not treating as a teen now and expecting her to do chores and bring you cups of tea- but one day you will. She will not grow up into a juvenile delinquent because she makes a mess of kitchen floor now. Chances are, she will even have developed table manners in 10 years or so.

DS didn't stop throwing food until we started feeding him on the low chair and table rather than the high chair. Turned out he hated being high up to eat. I'm not sure that disciplining really works at that age, DS is 24 mo and telling off/ignoring is only recently starting to have an effect and he will now come up for a cuddle and 'sorry' after being told off, we have been doing it for ages but trying not to get frustrated that it hasn't had an effect. I think it's just a developmental thing. Keep doing it and one day she will twig!