Please throw some light on my 8yr old ds

[citronella]

By nature he is a very kind boy, sensitive, reasonably clever, no trouble at school and has done well so far. He seems popular enough at school and enjoys it.
He has just turned 8 but with that seems to have come more attitude for e.g when I ask him to do things (gently for the 1st 4x) in a slightly raised voice, I get a very exasperated "whaaaat?!" in response. His general behaviour is getting worse not better for eg he eats really messilly, belches at the table and mucks around loads. I have always taught good table manners etc so I'm not sure where this is coming from.
He antagonises his younger brother (but cries and complains when he is antagonised in return).
What is really bothering me though is that his yr 3 homework states that he should read aloud for 20mins every day. He loves reading and reads well. He has read aloud perfectly well before but yesterday after 10mins he was fidgety and whiney and had had enough(the book is one he has chosen himself). I said we'd do some more today, so we get ready and we have had the most almighty drama for almost an hour before he would read properly. He went under the kitchen table to read but then he was crying hysterically, said he couldn't do it, that he didn't know what was stopping him. He threw all the sofa cushions on the floor. He did manage to ask me for a pick and mix sweet in the middle of all this (I refused). It took almost an hour of cajoling, comforting, scolding and explaining that he would have to read everyday if he wanted to earn computer time at the weekends. Eventually, he settled down and read really well for 10mins.
He is outside playing in the garden now but is being a bit of a pain to his brother.
It is exhausting and I'm running out of resources and patience. Please don't say it's just a phase because I don't like this phase and I need to give him some appropriate signals ifyswim.
Anyone had the same or similar.

Advice, comments and experience shared greatly appreciated

No ideas, just much sympathy.

We are tearing our hair out with our nearly 9yr old ds who has turned into a child I often don't recognise. He can be sweet and considerate, funny, caring, calm and then turn into a crying, screaming and sometimes hitting banshee suddenly.

Will watch thread with interest.

DaftApeth thanks.

Doesn't seem like anyone is any the wiser.

Praying he'll still be the lovely ds when he grows up.

I think they get some kind of hormone surge at this age. We went through a dreadful time with Ds1 around the age of 8 (Actually the reason i joined MN!)

We still refer to it as his Jekyll and Hyde time. It took Alot of patience. We had to let him know that the temper tantrums were not acceptable but that getting angry/ upset over things is something that we all eperience- it's how you deal with and show the emotions that's important.

When he went into a temper tantrum instead of trying to talk him out of it we'd give him a physical chore to do and work along side him until he'd calmed down, then we could talk to him about what had happened.

Also when he was calm we'd get him to choose the chore we'd get him to do if this happened again- eventually he started to come to us and say 'I think it's time to do x...'.

I think it really helped to give him the opportunity (once calm) to explain what he was angry/ upset about and then discuss how he could have dealt with these feelings better, rather than tantruming.

Rather than him feeling we were punishing him or pushing him away for getting all these feelings he didn't know how to deal with, doing something with him and then giving him the chance to talk made him feel supported- so he tells us now.

It did take time, and as I said soo much patience, but it worked. He talks to us about what upsets him and annoys him, and can recognise now when he's getting angry and deals with it, rather than letting it control him.

That was about 2 years ago, and he is now back to his lovely, kind self. He'll talk to us quite openly about his feelings and if he's upset he'll let us know why.

Ds can recognise that it is unacceptable and is not so bad at home, where he can disappear to his bedroom and rage in privacy.

It is in public e.g. when playing football, that he has more difficulty dealing with it and that is when he disolves into tears afterwards. He spent most of his footie match in tears the other day

Apparently, at school he is the perfect child. He said today ''but I don't play football at school, mummy'', so he knows what triggers it.

Citronell, will your ds take himself off to calm down at all?

That is really really helpful. It does seem to be a Jekyll and Hyde period. What sort of physical chores did you do? I mean, what would be appropriate at this age?

I think the patience thing is key. Trouble is sometimes I have very very little of it left. Particularly if I've also dealt with a four year old's tantrums in the same day. This is when I wish I had a partner to share the struggle with, or take it in turns to deal with whatever tantrum. As it is, I just escape to the loo for 2 mins or look forward to bedtime. Of course when they are asleep they look so angelic!

He will take himself off but I'm not sure whether it's to calm down or go more into himself if you see what I mean and it's the latter I worry about.

DS1 used to go into awful sulky strops at around 8 yrs. (And indeed 4, 5, 6, and 7 yrs as well.) He is now nearly 11 and they seem to have stopped and he has developed a pleasingly ironic sense of humour about things.

I'm hoping he's got it out of his system and won't turn into Kevin the Teenager.

Washing the insides of the windows was the favourite Citronella (much to the dispair of my mil her first granchild being made to do chores!!)

We scrubbed the kitchen a few times, washed down some walls..really anything that was very physical but meant we were working side by side. Like you I was worried about him withdrawing into himself if he was confused about what was happening- that's why I kept him close.

Really feel for you dealing with it all yourself..2 years between my boys so ds2 was 6 at the time and would play in their room or in the garden while I was dealing with ds1 do I didn't have to watch what he was doing aswell.

Although as a result of all those chores at that age he is very helpful around the house now!

Ds2 is 8 now..am waiting for Hyde to errupt any day now...

DS is just 9, the youngest of all his friends and they have all been hulking out like this over the past year. Rude, cheeky, bold, talking back, much less easy to manage.

I don't think it;s a phase, I think they are growing up. I have responded by giving DS more responsibility and more independence - making him responsible for some jobs, allowing him to go to the park or the corner shop unsupervised with friends, walk to school on his own, buying him things for his birthday that signify 'rights come with responsibility' - like a penknife. The idea is to let him feel enabled and empowered by his growing up, rather than frustrated and kicking against what he sees as 'babyish' parental control. They do seem to be fighting very hard not to be viewed as 'babies'. DS is still sweet, pliable, co-operative and 'good' - but I can see he has a streak that is a kind off 'back off, Mum' new development.

Yes, I think ds needs some responsibility over something too but I'm struggling to think what would work.

I think this is the time to have a pet of some sort but we have so little space and he has allergies, so that is out (I don't think he'd be very inspired by fish!)

Too many very busy roads around here to send him to the shops/park on his own.

His face would be a picture if I asked him to do some chores .

Citronella, I'm not on my own but there have still been times when I have shut myself in the kitchen holding the door closed to get some space. I should get the locks on the bathrooms fixed, shouldn't I?

I have told ds today that we are seriously reducing all screen time and he will now have to earn it. I'm also hoping being back into the school routine will help soon.

Interesting Blu, he said to me yesterday "you still think I'm really really young". Well I was a bit . Yes, I thought, you are 8 not 18. I didn't say anything though.

I think chores to earn computer time might help though ditto with DaftApeth re busy roads.

do you think loading/unloading dishwasher to much (optimistic) for an 8 yr old boy?

oooh I have a stroppy 8yr old
he only turned 8 yesterday but have noticed his attitude changing
he gives sarcastic looks, grunts and generally much more moody/sulky
a few other mums at school have noticed their boys changing as well

It sounds like you're writing about my DS1, also 8! And I really hope it is just a phase, but then kids do seem to lurch from one phase to the next and each equally annoying. I find I just have to have very strict rewards and sanctions and stick to them rigidly because if I give him an inch he takes a mile! But then when he's good he's very very good and I'm very proud that he's my son and I just have to make the most of those times because the next minute he's probably driving me up the wall!
I find it very typical of a boy to be not that interested in reading. If he likes computers perhaps he could look things up on the internet, for example if he's interested in space he could look up some space sites and find out some new facts. Talk to his teacher about it, but if he's doing well in his reading he/she might be happy for him to read things other than what is sent home from school.

Hello,

I was thinking of opening my own topic, but then I saw this one.

I am suddenly having real trouble with DS1, who will turn 8 next week.

The hols were great, but I guess I planned it quite well, with lots of physical outdoors activities for his brother and him.

Now they are back at school, and DS1 refuses to do his reading homework, same as yours, just GETTING him to do it is like getting blood from a stone, he flops, he sighs, he cries, and after maybe half an hour we start...aaaargh! Then, after 10 minutes, he is tired and stops.

He had a terrible temper as a toddler, had yours? My boy also has been through a lot as we have moved house 5 times, two of which were to a different country, so he has had to adjust a lot.

However, we have been in the UK for 2 years now, and he seemed settled and happy.

He has now started to fight with me when he is angry, only twice so far, but it really shocked me. He gets so frustrated he attacks me and hurts me.

I wish there was a guide on boys this age, I wonder, is there a testosteron surge at this age? Is it to do with having to sit still at school all day? Is Garteh Mallone from that BBC programme right and do boys this age need a differnt approach?

Seeing how active he has been over the holidays, and how much he has to sit still now makes me wonder...

Sorry, no help here as I feel completely lost myself.

DS unloads the dishwasher.
I have also taught him to do things that were previously considered too dangerous - like making scrambled egg (I supervise from a short distance) - he enjoys it because he recognises it as a growing up step.

WRT busy roads: when you are out with him, let HI choose when he thinks is a good time to cross and pnly veto if it isn't. I used to say 'right, you decide when we cross'. If there is a zebra or pedestrian lights, I would make sure he knows how to use them and let him go anyway - if he is sensible.

Personally I would break the pattern of punishing them for their age and making them win rights back. But I do insist on good manners etc.

They have all contracted worms, HTH

Only (half) joking, I agree with Chandon's theory's and have noticed my 2 are bad tempered now they are back at school.

Shame about the busy roads. It was about that age ds1 started being allowed down the local shop himself (1 road with pedestrian crossing, and I can see the shop from the upstairs window) Could you maybe do something like go to the shop with him, but wait outside while he goes in himself?

Loading/ unloading dishwasher is fine at 8! I got both mine to help out with quite alot of chores now. They empty the bins, do dusting, tidy the kitchen,strip the beds, get the washing down. Ds1 knows how to put the washing machine on. I don't touch their room, other than to hoover it- if it's not tidy no friends are allowed in. I had started getting them to 'make' dinner (with alot of supervision and help) once a week, but that stopped because of the shifts I'm on. They're 8 and 10.

The point about giving them more responsibilty at this age may be spot on actually- ds2 has been doing some things for almost a year that I wouldn't let ds1 do until he was the age ds2 is now. Ds2 (so far- I may regret saying this!!) hasn't had any of the mood swings and tantrums ds1 had.

Hi everyone, thanks so much for your comments and suggestions. Sounds like 8 year old boys are in a bit of a category.
He does like reading and is interested in books it just seems to be the reading out loud that's got to him.

Anyway, on a more positive note, this morning he laid the breakfast table all by himself and that pleased him.
Took an age and a day though to get dressed for school(aargh)

I had a chat with his teacher from last year this morning and explained and she said the thing with ds1 is he is extremely capable but seemingly big tasks daunt him and he gets frustrated. She found the best approach with him was to break things up in to small steps and bitesize chunks. Also that he liked clear reward/tick charts of each tasks.
So that's what I am going to try and will let you know how we get on.

Do keep posting how you are getting on with your boys.

It's yr 3. It's a real change from Yr2 and stresses most children out, hence behaviour.

Citronella, really glad that you have a plan.

Ds has been lovely at home for the last few days! Even last night when I told him he could not play on wii/ipod, he accepted it without too much complaint.

I did try to get him to help with the cooking last night but appatently he was too busy 'playing american' whatever that is

So, dd ended up helping me and chopped up mushrooms, which wasn't quite the plan but at least she enjoyed it so much that she forgot to complain about the mushrooms when it came to eating them

He has sport today, so it will be interesting to see how he copes as it seems to be a trigger for him.

If he can read fine, then I'd drop all this reading out loud malarky. Not everyone enjoys it, and I am very wary of doing anything that puts children (esp boys) off reading in any way. He clearly hates it, so I'd say, OK, read to yourself then. Pick your battles etc.

Its so nice to hear that other mums of 8 yr old boys are going through the same. My DS is lovely sensitive, caring boy but has a real temper on him and fly off at the slightest thing.

As i say very reassuring to know I'm not the only one!

Just thought I'd update:

This week has been a whole lot better. I have seen more of the calmer side and he has just been energetic rather than difficult if that makes any sense.

Homework was also done enthusiastically

Hope you've all had better weeks too!

mine was so-so, but glad it`s better for you

Great news that things have improved Citronella

We've had a much better week too. I think ds has settled back into school now and is getting used to his stricter teacher and that more is expected of him this term. He forgot to bring his homework home twice in a row but dealt with it fairly maturely and has, hopefully, learnt his lesson [fingers crossed emoticon].

He managed his whole footie match without one melt-down last week (after spending most of the previous weeks match either in tears, yelling at someone else or pushing) which I was so relieved about.

So, feeling a bit more positive about things at the moment.