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Original poster

To tell parents about pronunciation?

158 replies

HelpaSILout · 15/12/2023 08:31

My SIL shared their favourite name with family for their soon due DS.
It’s a beautiful name, Fionn. We live in England (no strong Irish heritage on our side of the family, not sure about hers) but being an obviously Celtic name I wondered about its meaning and put it into google.
Now the problem arises, they are pronouncing it Fi-on and I’ve found it’s pronounced Finn. Do I say something or just keep my beak out!?

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mathanxiety · 15/12/2023 20:19

It should be Fyun, not Finn, and not Fi-on.

mathanxiety · 15/12/2023 20:23

AgnesX · 15/12/2023 09:07

If there's no cultural link it's hardly surprising there's going to be a lot of mis pronunciation. That said, Finn is the English translation. My Irish manager has called her child Fionn and tells me that it changes depending on where you're from in Ireland.

She's wrong.

It's mispronounced by people who don't understand the difference between a broad and a slender consonant.

mathanxiety · 15/12/2023 20:25

HelpaSILout · 15/12/2023 10:13

Thank you to everyone regarding the proper Irish pronunciations. The google video I listened to sounded like Finn & I’d read an old MN thread before posting which suggested NI prounounce it Finn and SI fy-unn, ‘like the word fun with a yuh sound after the f.’
The only Irish heritage my family have is one great grandparent from NI.
Anyway I will certainly not be saying anything as I’d have been gutted if anyone had passed comment on my baby names. I just needed to feel sure that I wasn’t setting up my DN to find out his name had been mispronounced his whole life.
I feel reassured that a few have said any 3 pronunciations would be acceptable so my nose will stay out!

There is only one correct pronunciation, and that's "Fyun".

LizzieAnt · 15/12/2023 20:28

Fionn in Irish means fair or white, bright, clear.
The pronunciation of some words in the Irish language doesn't vary much between dialects, but Fionn is not one of them. You can hear that in these links.

https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/fionn

www.forvo.com/word/fionn/

That said, I've only ever heard the name pronounced Fyun personally, although I think it may be Finn more usually in the North of Ireland? I'm not certain of that, but Fyun is certainly a very widely used pronunciation further south where I live - I've never met a Fionn who pronounced it otherwise. I would assume that the less well known pronunciations are used mostly by native speakers who speak Irish as their first language.

I think I would tell your SIL what you know. It's better to know these things before they name their baby and then they can make a more informed choice. That's my take on it anyway.
They'll find out that their choice is not the more usual pronunciation (or one of them) at some stage anyway, surely?

As an aside, the spelling Finn is older than Fionn, it's not necessarily an anglicisation. Find is older still I believe.

Foclóir Gaeilge–Béarla (Ó Dónaill): fionn

Everything about 'fionn' in the Ó Dónaill Irish-English Dictionary

https://www.teanglann.ie/en/fgb/fionn

mathanxiety · 15/12/2023 20:28

Goneback2school · 15/12/2023 18:54

As far as I can see it was always Fionn McCumhail is the ancient stories. Finn McCool being the more recent Anglicised version. Though, according to wiki Finn can be pronounced Fin or fyun. I've never heard the latter pronunciation in my corner of Ireland.

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Wiki is wrong there.

Finn is indeed an anglicisation. It ignores the slender F and the Irish pronunciation of the letter O.

Fionn is 'fyun'.

Didley · 15/12/2023 20:33

Oh my goodness in Wales that pronunciation is a girls name 😳 I'd say something 🤣

Puddle13 · 15/12/2023 20:33

I was born and brought up in the ENgland but my Father is from Ireland, my uncle has a son called Fionn and it is pronounced like Fyun not Finn. But I believe it can be Finn too.

KingofCats · 15/12/2023 20:37

DD has a friend called Fionn, his mum is Irish born and bred and it sounds like Fee-on.

Snugglemonkey · 15/12/2023 20:44

saraclara · 15/12/2023 08:38

Just say "I thought the Irish boys name was pronounced Finn, and the Welsh girls name was Fi-on. These Celtic names are very confusing"

This. They do need to know.

LizzieAnt · 15/12/2023 20:46

Fionn mac Cumhaill (/ˈfɪn məˈkuːl/ FIN mə-KOOL; Ulster Irish: [ˈfʲɪn̪ˠ mˠək ˈkuːl̠ʲ] Connacht Irish: [ˈfʲʊn̪ˠ-] Munster Irish: [ˈfʲuːn̪ˠ-]; Scottish Gaelic: [ˈfjũːn̪ˠ maxk ˈkʰũ.əʎ]; Old and Middle Irish: Find or Finn[1][2] mac Cumail or mac Umaill), often anglicized Finn McCool or MacCool...

The above is from the Wikipedia page on Fionn Mac Cumhaill. Even if you don't know IPA (the International Phonetic Alphabet) you can see the vowel sound in Fionn is represented by different symbols in the different Irish dialects - showing that there isn’t just one correct pronunciation.

Help:Pronunciation respelling key - Wikipedia

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Pronunciation_respelling_key

Snugglemonkey · 15/12/2023 20:47

Whataretheodds · 15/12/2023 08:39

How would they know it's pronounced Finn? If they are English speaking with no Irish heritage?

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Why would you not use Google to check the pronunciation of a name from another language that you were going to name your child? Absolute madness not to! Plus, it is really disrespectful to use banes from another culture without a cursory Google.

ParentsTrapped · 15/12/2023 20:49

From NI here and not an Irish speaker, but have heard the Finn/Fionn MacCumhail stories in numerous ways through my life (tv adaptations, cassette tapes,
family members reading the stories to me as a kid etc etc) and he’s always been “Fin MacCool”. So I would have assumed Fionn was Finn, not ever having met one IRL.

Snugglemonkey · 15/12/2023 20:51

Daisies12 · 15/12/2023 09:49

And this is why it is mad to share your name before baby is here safe and well. Honestly blows my mind.

I think this is an example of why sharing is a good idea!

pancakestastelikecrepe · 15/12/2023 20:53

@penjil my name is Corinne - I get C'reen, C'rin, Coh-reen within the family - other variations (which I answer to, outside 🙄

Justfinking · 15/12/2023 20:56

mathanxiety · 15/12/2023 20:19

It should be Fyun, not Finn, and not Fi-on.

Well there you go! Most people on this thread correcting are wrong

OchonAgusOchonOh · 15/12/2023 21:05

penjil · 15/12/2023 20:07

In England, if you wanted it pronounced finn, you should have spelt it Finn.

Obviously if it's a common name in Ireland, then they'll know Fion in pronounced finn.

But to be honest, I would've pronounced it finn myself. I've got no idea with Irish names. Well, apart from Siobhan.

Yes, it's a common name on Ireland and we know it's most definitely not pronounced Finn.

AllAroundMyCat · 15/12/2023 21:06

I'd tell her.

Whataretheodds · 15/12/2023 21:36

Snugglemonkey · 15/12/2023 20:47

Why would you not use Google to check the pronunciation of a name from another language that you were going to name your child? Absolute madness not to! Plus, it is really disrespectful to use banes from another culture without a cursory Google.

Show quote history

I later quoted to say I thought I'd misunderstood @YourNameGoesHere thinking she was talking about other people not the parents of the child.

Eiris · 15/12/2023 22:54

If you say Fyon for Fionn how do you say "beag" and "ceann"?

theduchessofspork · 15/12/2023 23:05

Anoisagusaris · 15/12/2023 08:44

It’s never pronounced as Finn in Irish. It’s more like F-yun.

Yeah this - it’s one and half syllables - about half way btwn Finn and Ffion I guess

Ichangedmynameonce · 15/12/2023 23:10

Its not pronounced finn.

OchonAgusOchonOh · 15/12/2023 23:32

Eiris · 15/12/2023 22:54

If you say Fyon for Fionn how do you say "beag" and "ceann"?

Ceann is cy-ahn, beag is b-yh-ug but all short syllables. Sort of.

Goneback2school · 15/12/2023 23:38

Eiris · 15/12/2023 22:54

If you say Fyon for Fionn how do you say "beag" and "ceann"?

Be-yug and key- ow (to rhyme with now)- n

WordOfTheDay · 15/12/2023 23:58

Fionn is an Irish name. It is an Irish-language word. It is pronounced Fyun.

Finn is an Anglicised version of the Irish name Fionn. It is an English word. It is pronounced Fin.

KnickerlessParsons · 16/12/2023 00:06

Are you or they confusing it with the Welsh name Ffion, which is pronounced Fee-on?