Erin Patterson - We the members of the MN jury find the defendant Guilty or Not Guilty?

[Dustyblue]

Well here we are, after 2 years of head-scratching speculation and many weeks of trial detail-thrashing. It looks like the Judge will give his directions to the jury on Tuesday, after which they'll be sequestered in a local motel (I do not envy them this) to reach a verdict.

Clearly we're not privy to every last piece of evidence shown at the trial, but those of us who've been following closely will surely have formed an opinion one war or the other.

So, I ask you- if you were on the jury- what would your verdict be?

I'm not sure how true this could possibly be..... what could she have used as a poison?

You'd imagine prisoners love trying to get each other in trouble, especially if she's not well liked.

Not poison, per se - but cleaning fluids, bodily waste, etc, addded to food could make someone ill. I read somewhere she was doing something to the eggs! Maybe it is just fear of her, given what she was then alleged to have done to her relatives. Just bizarre to have her in the kitchen in any capacity in jail.

God if it's true she is out of control!

Yep, she's going to have to work in the laundry or something FAR away from the kitchen.

Absolutely this.
Plus the random invitation. It was very planned.
Also, my mushrooms aren’t often part of a beef wellington recipe. She hid them in the pastry in the meal

mushrooms certainly are an ingredient in beef Wellington .

I 100% agree it was planned - but the mushroom duxelle is an essential part of a beef wellington . I think that's why she chose it.

Surely life is mandatory for murder as it is in the UK? Do they have whole life tariffs? Killing 3 people and almost killing a fourth might justify a whole life term. Whether or not whole life is or could be available, I cant see how she would be getting anything other than life with a hefty minimum recommendation of time served. The nature of her crimes mean that she will remain a danger for a very significant period.

Interesting that one of the odd things described about her behaviour when she was an air traffic controller, was wearing the same clothes all the time. So many of the clips and CCTV footage show her doing the same - a red fleece and off white trousers. Such a bizarre thing not to change clothing for long periods.

It was premeditated. Not sure if she intended to murder them or just make them very sick though (I’m thinking it was the former)

It’s interesting seeing information coming out that wasn’t presented in court. Those 2 tip runs were idiotic on her part. She should have dumped these items in the bush and left her cellphone at home. It was very damming her scuttling out of the hospital asap when she realised the hospital already suspected it was deathcap poisoning. I bet she expected that they wouldn’t work it out until many days or weeks later.

I’m also a bit repulsed by the way Dr Chris Webster is behaving post-verdict. He certainly is enjoying his 15 mins of fame. I hope this doesn’t derail anything later on when Erin appeals.

From the reporting it sounds like she’s being held in the special protection unit (i.e. segregated from the mainstream prison population) in which case she won’t have a ‘job’ in any of the normal places like the laundry or the workshops (and certainly not the kitchen given her crimes!).

Victorian law has the possibility of a sentence of life without parole. In practice, most ‘life’ sentences do have a non-parole period set, after which the offender can apply for (but is not guaranteed) parole. Life without parole is rare, but certainly justifiable for a triple-murderer.

I often wondered if anyone involved in the trial sought a psychiatric assessment for her, and if not why not. She doesn't seem to be right in the head at all - to me anyway, a bit "spaced out" or something.

But then again maybe she is just bad, not mad. Who knows?

The sentence will be interesting hey? Yes life without parole is rare, but then again she is effectively a 'mass murderer'. I'm struggling to think of a similar case in Victoria.

They might get one for the sentencing.

id give good money to read it!

V similar to UK then except we have “whole life” sentences which we would be a version of life without parole.

I’m with you on the Dr thing. He clearly loves the attention and is hoping to leverage his involvement into something else.

She’s been convicted. No good can come of sharing every dramatised detail with the media. What’s his aim here?

meanwhile the families are maintaining a dignified silence.

I hope it doesn't result in a reduced sentence or incarceration in a psych hospital. I don't think she's "mad" just totally bad.

I suppose if the mental health card was going to be introduced it would have been by the defence at her trial. But in other jurisdictions that means pleading guilty due to insanity, which didn't happen here.

I'm not in Oz, but I saw that doctor on Facebook videos last night and honestly he's playing to the gallery. In one clip he was crying FGS! Something's up with him, but as others said, maybe he's cashing in on his involvement, because this awful and tragic saga has a movie, a series, some books, media interviews, and Netflix vibes.

In one clip he was crying FGS!

A patient who he had tried to help was going off in an ambulance to what he knew was her prolonged and horrific death, but she managed to make the effort to thank him for the care she'd received. I'd cry too.

I agree . He felt deflated. He knew she was going to die . Surely it’s human to cry.

OK OK, I may have misjudged his crying. Maybe it was the way the clip was edited.

There was no psychological or psychiatric assessment submitted during the trial because she was pleading innocent.

The defence may submit an assessment for sentencing IF they think it will help reduce her sentence. However, if she is likely to be assessed as a psychopath, sociopath or other type of ‘not mad, but bad’ profile, then her legal team would probably recommend against it. And if she is maintaining her innocence, they definitely won’t get one.

However, the judge can order an assessment be carried out to help him decide on sentencing.

The chances of her carrying out her sentence in a secure psychiatric facility are vanishingly small. The kinds of people sent there are usually psychotic without a grip on reality and/or with very disordered thinking, e.g. treatment resistant schizophrenia, multiple personality disorder etc. Even then, some will be sent back to a regular prison once they have been stabilised with medication.

Yes, she was a long standing patient of his as well, with whom he seemed to have a good relationship - he certainly speaks highly of her as a person. I’m a health care professional
and and quite often reduced to tears by cases much less involved than this.
edit - obviously not in front of patients…!

I also think that he (dr Webster) wasn’t allowed to say certain things in court because they were his interpretation of events. On the trial podcast he talks about how she didn’t show any concern for heather or Ian, despite being metres away from them. In his experience, he has never witnessed this. But he wasn’t allowed to share these observations in court. He also felt emotional about the incident and about Heather, who was a long standing patient.

can anyone tell me why they didn’t share her visit to the tip after the lunch, it is because there was no proof of what was thrown away?

The first tip visit wasn’t included as they couldn’t find the items. They assumed the dehydrator packaging was with the cardboard and the items that were in the box might have been either the missing plates and leftover food. Police never found what it was she dumped,

I would too! However, it seems that sociopaths/psychopaths are apparently such good manipulators, that even the best forensic psychiatrists can't understand them.

There was a lot of discussion in court without the jury present about inadmissible evidence. I do wonder if the prosecution tried to get the afternoon tip visit included after the cake vomit lies were introduced. They probably weren't overly fussed before that- no evidence that the plates were in the box and she had other opportunities to hide them and dispose of them.