Working in Australia as doctors

[puzzlingtree]

Duplicating from Living overseas board. I'm not sure where is the best place for this:

I wondered if anyone might be able to advise. We are a medical couple with two children (both senior school age). We are strongly considering moving to Australia or possibly NZ (DH much more keen on Aus.). I have spoken to an agency and they seem very positive about the chance of finding good jobs for both of us.
We haven't gone any fixed ideas about where to live. DH spent a lot of time in the Brisbane area when he was growing up so is fond of this area but is definitely not insistent on settling near there. We like warm, sunny weather (doesn't need to be super hot), sea, a mixture of outdoor and cultural activities. One of the children is very keen on sports, the other one enjoys some sports and the outdoors but is also quite arty. Keen to have access to good schools. Not fussed about living in the middle of a big city but would like access to somewhere of a reasonable size.
I wondered if anyone might be able to advise to help us to direct our search and plan things carefully.
What areas might work for us?
What sort of logistics do we need to consider?
What costs do we need to consider? We should receive some financial assistance but probably have to pay some costs.
What are the schools like and what is the best place to research them? What is the schooling like and the qualifications? How do they compare to the UK?
I know that housing is super expensive in big cities, especially Sydney. Is there somewhere which is cheaper but somewhere we might like to live?
If anyone has any other comments or can point out pros and cons that would be really helpful.

Each of the state capitals has a quite different climate (although Perth and Adelaide are quite similar) so you should look into that. Brisbane and Sydney are very humid, prone to damp and in recent years, pretty serious flooding in some areas, which is something to consider. I think Melbourne is a great city, but the weather is not the best and the beaches aren’t much chop (also the water is cold as it comes straight from the Southern Ocean).

Real estate is pretty mad at the moment, although starting to cool down. Nowhere is particularly cheap, but have a look at city price averages to give you an idea. https://www.corelogic.com.au/news-research/news/2024/growth-cools-in-australian-housing-values-through-winter-as-melbourne-median-slips-below-perth-and-adelaide You could also look at large regional towns, particularly on the east coast (e.g. Newcastle, Wollongong, Sunshine Coast).

Regarding schools, a lot of people in Aus have the idea that you need to go private to get a good education. I don’t agree. There are great state secondary schools in every city, it’s just a matter of finding a house in the catchment area of these schools. When we returned to Australia from overseas, we had two schools in mind and only looked at houses in these catchment areas. DS is at one of our target schools and thriving.

Unlike the UK, there’s no grammar/comprehensive split. Although there are some academically selective schools, they are the exception. Many schools in our state do have selective programs, but that is just one or two class groups out of a whole year level. These include academic programs, music, visual art, performing arts and languages. To apply for and be considered for these programs you need to be here in year 6 for the year 7 intake, so your kids might be past that point already anyway.

I can’t compare the system to the UK, as I don’t have any experience of that. But here each state runs the education system. You can leave after year 10, but most kids stay on to year 12. If you leave early you are supposed to be in education or training (apprenticeship). In years 11& 12 you need to take 6 subjects. You can do academic (ATAR) courses or non-academic. You need at least 4 ATAR courses to get an ATAR score, which is your uni entrance score/rank. For kids who don’t want to go to uni, there is TAFE which I think is equivalent to the UK college system. It focuses on vocational training.

Hope this helps.

Maybe look at smaller cities on the coast like Newcastle, Wollongong or Geelong? Or consider Adelaide if you are ok in a dry heat. These all have a good level of services, access to beaches but less real estate madness than Sydney or Melbourne. You can get into the city for more cultural, arts events. As pp said, each state has its own school system. All involve final assessments and a mark used for university entry. There are good unis in each state. The Group of 8 are the older traditional ones with a high research profile..

I agree about smaller cities. We moved to Newcastle NSW nearly 11 years ago - husband is a consultant. Don't have children so can't comment on schools. When we moved he could only get a job in an 'area of need', essentially areas where they can't employ Australians easily. Be prepared for lots of paperwork! Are you GP's or specialists? He did all the admin before we moved, like AHPRA registration and we came over here a couple of times to conferences to do some groundwork and networking first of all which definitely helped us. Pomsinoz.com is a great resource for the logistical side of moving and will help with information about areas, costs, visas etc.

We haven't had any regrets and his work life balance is much better here.

Western Australian resident here - not a doctor but have worked a lot in health. Better work/life balance in WA and the weather will be what you like, Its also full of good school options - whether public or private - and much easier to get around than Melbourne or Sydney. Lots of UK expats here! PM me if you have more questions

@TerrorAustralis Thanks for your post.
Can I just check, is Year 12 for 17-18 year olds, like the last year of school in the UK?
Is there somewhere you can recommend that we can look to figure out what are the best schools in an area? Are the selective schools necessarily the best schools or are the good state schools likely to be as good?
Does the quality of Units vary much and is there a strong hierarchy system like in the UK?

@StartupRepair Thank you. I was wondering if those sort of smaller cities might be a good option as housing likely to be less expensive, facilities still good and fair access into big cities too.
Presumably the qualifications across states are transferrable if you do want to go to a Uni in a different state, for example?

@SCC701 Many thanks for your comment. How do you find Newcastle as a place to live? We are one hospital specialist and one GP.

@fairenough24 Thanks a lot. Are you recommending Perth or somewhere else in WA? I can PM you later if that's okay. Thank you for the offer.

Yes, Year 12 is the last year of school, it’s for 17–18 year olds. The best schools are somewhat subjective, but if you’re looking at Perth, I can share my (subjective) opinions by PM.

Selective schools are not necessarily the best, but they filter students via testing pre-admission. So you won’t get the same level of behavioural problems as a mainstream school. You can only get in at Year 7, so if your kids are already in secondary, they won’t be an option. If your kids have IQs off the charts maybe you could get special consideration for entry, but not sure if that would even be an option if you’re not citizens or PR yet.

Not sure what you’re asking about units and hierarchy system. Happy to try to answer if you can clarify.

Join the On call room on fb, the doctors group. Lots of good advice there about this sort of thing :)

Newcastle is a really nice place to live, big enough to have everything you need but houses still just about affordable and a good mix of schools according to friends with children. The John Hunter hospital is the main one here. Also very happy for you to PM me.

Sorry @TerrorAustralis 'Does the quality of Units vary much and is there a strong hierarchy system like in the UK?'

I meant does the quality of Unis (Universities) vary much! Does it matter too much in terms of future employability?

Perhaps the best thing to do re schools is to research the areas further, see where the jobs are and then look in detail at local schools. Do you recommend Perth as a place to live for a family? I would love to PM if we are looking seriously at the Perth area. Thank you for the offer.

@aveenobambino thanks for the suggestion, I'll look at that group.

@SCC701 that's good to know. Has it been easy to settle in and make new friends? Can I ask if you are medical too? Thanks a lot for the offer to PM you. I will do some more research into areas and have just started contact with a couple of agencies re potential jobs. Could I maybe PM you in a few weeks if we have a bit more idea what we are doing then?

Feel free to PM anytime, we helped another medical/non medical UK couple we know move here recently (helped with advice, what you need to do about jobs etc) so we are very happy to share any info we can. It took longer for me to feel settled than my husband did but he went straight into a job with colleagues already there and I set up a business working for myself and it is a big adjustment but we found people welcoming, particularly those who have made a big move. I think having children will make it easier to meet people and your jobs will too. Now I feel like I have some of the closest friends I've ever had over here, but it does take a bit of effort at the beginning. Realestate.com.au is the Aussie version of rightmove and will give you an idea about houses as well.

I would recommend Perth yes. Also happy to share school thoughts - mine are in the latter stages of secondary school

Happy for PM from you,

Yes final school results are transferable to unis in different states. Typically people tend to study in the state they did their schooling in but some move away and have a college experience. My DS went from Melbourne to the Australian National University in Canberra for his degree and lived and studied with people from all over Australia and the world. DD on the other hand has stayed in Melbourne and attended uni here.

Regarding unis there is the Group of 8, mentioned earlier, which are the oldest and most prestigious. I guess the Australian equivalent of the Russell Group. That said, I don’t think there’s the same hierarchy and your choice of uni shouldn’t affect employability much.

I think it’s more a case of finding the uni that offers the best course for what you’re interested in. Some of the Group of 8 courses aren’t necessarily the most practical. For example, I studied at a G8 uni and when I graduated I wasn’t really job-ready, because my course was really focussed on preparing you for post-grad study and research, not work. I actually would have been better going to a different (less prestigious) uni. That was decades ago though, so not sure what it’s like now.

Also happy to share recommendations for school zones in Perth if you’re interested.

@SCC701 that's really kind of you both to help others trying to move. Fantastic that you've made such good friends over there.

@fairenough24 thank you so much for the offer to PM you too. I'm speaking to a second agency tomorrow so will see what they say. I may well PM you once we know a bit more.

@StartupRepair good to know that all qualifications are transferrable.

@TerrorAustralis that's really useful to know re the Unis. I am definitely interested in school recommendations.

I've become obsessed with emigrating since having my honeymoon in Aus last year. While I'm not brave enough to do it and so can't really advise, Poms Wanting Oz and Ping Pong Poms are useful (the latter is for people who have moved and want to move back, one way or the other). Good luck - sounds like a fab opportunity

Hi, just thought I would chime in and give you a run down on WA so you at least have one state covered…

I dont know what your specialty is but there is a major GP shortage here, most doctors now rarely bulk bill but still long wait times. Specialists have long wait lists.

The Perth heat is a killer in December, Jan, Feb and March with temperatures up to 40’s on some days. The sun is an issue for fair skin. In saying that the weather the rest of the year is amazing. The beaches are pristine.

Around 3 - 4 hours South of Perth you have Albany the second largest WA city and in the SW the Margaret River region which is a mini Byron Bay. Both have amazing surf, Margaret more so and cooler temperatures in Summer.
I would choose Dunsborough in your shoes - it’s stunning with wineries, exquisite beaches, affluent homes and nature whilst still being less than 3 hours from Perth, 1 hour from Bunbury a smaller city than Perth and twenty minutes from Busselton.

In terms of schooling Albany and Busselton have good catholic high schools and Anglican schools but they’re not going to be as top tier as Perth’s best schools.

We don’t have very good websites that I know of for ranking schools, nothing like Tatler. However the atar ranking of schools serves as a guide. Generally the high schools go by socio economic area - same as primary schools - the more affluent the area, the better the public school.

A brief run down of the best private schools in Perth. Christchurch Grammar for boys is the most expensive and consistently good for academics. Scotch runs on the IB so this might be helpful for you - also a boys school and also in Claremont, an affluent suburb in the centre of the western suburbs. Hale further to the north is also a good boys school. The best girls schools would be MLC, PLC, St Hilda’s. The schools I’ve mentioned so far are considered to be the most prestigious and old guard in my view mainly because of the location in the middle of established and elite areas.

There are lovely suburbs and options SOR too.

There aren’t many good private coned schools - John xxiii which is catholic is very good and All Saints SOR,

The best public schools would be Shenton college, Perth mod (for academically gifted), Rossmoyne, Churchlands, Bob Hawke maybe.

The school fees for most Anglican private schools are 20-33,000 a year. The better catholic schools are $15,000 a year and the less expensive Catholic schools around $10,000 a year. Public is obviously free.

The difference in private vs public is mainly the extra curricular activities and largely facilities such as rowing, camp facilities, tutoring, orchestras and so forth. The public schools will offer some things but they just won’t have rhe same level of facilities. Many of the good private schools will have playing and hockey fields in amazing condition (Hale), large swimming pools, indoor basketball courts and so forth. Children that are sporty will be catered to at any of the private schools.

If yoy have a good joint income your lifestyle here will be nice but you will be isolated. You can do winter in Exmouth, trips to Bali, trips to Rottnest island for snorkelling and amazing beaches and down south is amazing. However you’d have to be a fairly bike ride, surfing, water sports family to get the most of it. Perth is getting better but there’s not a whole load of culture.

In terms of housing, 2-3 million aud would get you a nice home with a pool in most affluent suburbs, 1.5 million aud would get you a a modest home in a few affluent areas and 1 million gets you a fairly average home in a slightly above average area.

Melbourne