Termination after CVS results

[waffydaffy]

Hello
This is my first post, so please bear with me, I have been trying to build up the courage all week.
It has now been a week since we terminated our baby.
We found out a on the Tuesday (after having a CVS the previous week) that our poor baby had Downs. We had talked through what we would do the previous week, but to be honest, I really thought in my heart that it would be ok, so like everyone it was a complete shock.
We have two children already, and said that it wouldn't be fair to them to continue, (they think mummy has had a bad tummy this week) so we went the next day for the so called meeting with the consultant. We were in there all of 5 minutes, the moment we said about our children, and how we would cope, he starting writing out the termination form, said at 14 weeks it was too late for a surgical termination and it would be a medical one (you will miscarry he said, no mention of what this would entail).
We then went to another ward and I was given the first tablet and told to call in 48 hours to see if there was a room. Which we did, and on the Friday, it was the hardest day of both of our lives, my dh couldn't stand to see me in such pain, worse than when we had our girls.
I had to go back last Friday (mum came) for the scan to check all was clear. I thought I would be ok, but got really upset, filling in the form, asking for pregnancy dates etc (the scan was in the early pregnancy unit) and then when I glanced at the screen and saw nothing there, which is stupid as I knew there wouldn't be.
I haven't seen any consultant since the first time, and will not see a counsellor until next Wednesday. My dh is the silent type and it 'just getting on with it' but I keep crying when on my own.
We were asked if we wanted to see the baby but at the time we said no, and now I wish I had. They didn't take any photos (as far as I am aware). I just keep thinking did we do the right thing.
I also feel as though I am expected to go back to work this week, but I really am not ready. My Line Manager knows what has happened and said everyone thinks I have been ill, but if I don't go in this week, I would probably have to get a certificate - what would they put on it!
Worrying about stupid things at the moment - sorry for rambling. Just trying to get some of this out. Also now not sure if we could go through this again with the increased risk

You poor thing.

Very un MN'y hugs {{{}}}

I will be 38 this year, and I know it is too early to start thinking about getting pregnant again. But my age has been mention several times when I was pregnant and I just think time is running out.

Thank you Kerry and PiratePrincess. Its good to get some of this out, my dh is just carrying on, which I know is his way of dealing with it, but it doesn't help really.

Dear Kerrymumbles

I am so sorry to hear this, it is good you having your boys to help you through any dark days.

I had CVS with DD1. She had Turner's Syndrome. I couldn't go through with a termination - she lived for a month and a day.

What you did was right for you, you must be strong, it may have been harder to see any pictures.

And don't worry about work - that doesn't matter at all, it really doesn't.

xx

WaffyDaffy, you and your DH have been through a terrible time together and it must have been very difficult to post.

It's very soon to be thinking about going back to work - please go back to your GP and ask him/her to sign you off for another week or two, until you feel ready to return to work. Don't worry about what will be on your sick cert, if you explain to your GP that you need discretion for your employer, they will give only the most generic detail to maintain confidentiality.

Please think about contacting Antenatal Results and Choices, a wonderful organisation of kind and understanding people to help you get through the dark days.

Thinking of you x

So, so sorry. What a terrible decision to have to take. Make sure you and your DH take time to talk about it together, and don't make assumptions about what the other is thinking or feeling. Secondly, the maternity unit I once worked in long ago always took photos of the babies, even if the parents had declined. This was because it was so common for people to change their minds afterwards. So, ask them, you never know. Big hug to you.

Can you not get miscarriage on the sick note? I would be the same as you, worried about what was on it - though it isn't anyone's business? Ask your GP to write something non-specific, I am sure they can do this.

Hello Waffydaffy

So sorry that you've had to post your very tragic story. I too had a termination for DS in April last year (32 at the time) so although age plays a factor, it can happen to anyone, at any age

As everyone has already said, it's VERY early days, and you'll feel like you'll never get over this, but you will. Please come and join us on:

Thread 5

(I'm not so good at the link thing, apologies if it hasn't worked)

We're a bunch of supportive ladies who have all been through similar experiences, there's always someone around to lend a sympathetic ear, or to give words of advice and support.

Someone said to me, that if I didn't feel like my world was falling apart, I wouldn't be normal. These are all very typical feelings with grief.

The main reason I terminated, was similar to yours, in that we already have a DD who's almost 3, and felt that a DS baby in our family wouldn't be fair on her. When I was spending my days in huge depression, DH said to me (he's into the tough love thing) so please take it with a pinch of sugar:

"If you carry on living in a depression, and are constantly miserable around DD you're making the reason why we did this pointless"

It made complete sense to me, and from then, I tried my best to be happy. For DD's sake.

HOWEVER, it's still VERY early days, and you have every right to feel angry and sad. Please wail and howl. You need to let it all out. Sounds cheesy, but it works.

Hope to see you on the 'other' thread soon.

Much love

BK x

Dear Waffydaffy,
I'm so sorry to hear your news and I do understand exactly how you must be feeling - I was in exactly the same situation last June when we found out our baby had Downs (it was my first pregnancy). After the termination I mostly felt numb or angry and I cried a lot. I actually did go back to work almost straight away because I couldn't bear to be at home on my own. But I basically hid away for the first week or two at work and tried not to speak to anyone. Don't go back if you feel you don't want to - take as much time as you need. My GP wrote 'pregnancy related complications' on my sick note and no-one except my boss really knew. I also did not see the baby and never found out it if it was a boy or a girl. At 13 weeks, I thought it would be an image with potential to haunt me and I didn't want to give myself ammunition to dwell further on 'what might have been'. Others feel completely differently - there's no right or wrong about how to feel afterwards.

I second BezzyK's advice to take a look at the other thread if you haven't done already. I lurked in the background there for the first few months and it helped me so much to read other people saying almost exactly how I was feeling and seeing the advice and support pouring in. It also gave me hope that there is light at the end of the tunnel (which there is!) by seeing people coping and moving forwards. It never leaves you but it will get less raw. Take care and be kind to yourself.

i'm so sorry to read your post, you sound in so much pain.

maybe i shouldn't be commenting, as i have not been through what you have. however, i have had a termination for other reasons, i genuinely felt i had no choice and i have always felt sad about it. but in no way does it compare to how you must feel i know.

i just wanted to say though, when i read your post i was wondering if you felt rushed into your decision. the way you worded it gave me that impression.

because even if you thought you knew what you wanted to do, often if you are not certain deep down having it swiftly made final by a doctor like that can't have helped you.

therfore i wanted to say my sympathies as you are not only dealing with the repercussions of this awful situation you found yourself in, you also need to make sense of how the hospital handled it.

take care xx

Oh Waffydaffy - this situation is so sad and so sudden, it really compounds all the feelings you have. Most people get to 12wks just glad they have a baby, and perhaps if they dare, beginning to imagine their future family... then to find out there is a problem that forces a decision (either to act, or not to act) is a HUGE thing to take on board. And that so often it happens so quickly - so often it's hard to comprehend what is happening before taking action. So no wonder now, a week later, you are whirling and grieving.

I'd echo Bezzy's and LittlePoot's suggestion, go say 'hi' on Thread5 and we'll hold your hand through this time.

I'm sorry the hospital seems to have been a bit quick in terms of spending time with you; I must admit it helped me to feel I had time to think. However - and I don't know about others here - it did suddenly make my baby all the more 'real' to me, which made everything so much harder. But I expect your decision was based on all sorts of factors - your family, yourselves AND your unborn baby. Even if it IS a decision you made, it doesn't mean that you felt nothing for your baby: obviously you did, obviously you wanted things to be OK, and obviously it is worse than horrid not to see them inside you afterwards. It is the hardest possible situation, I think. I still cry when I remember. But I also know I would still make the same decision again, thinking about the same things.

And there is no right or wrong way to feel at this time - some people have found taking time off work helps, others preferred to get busy again. It is a really hard situation in which to grieve as only the people you tell will know about it... and not many people choose to tell for fear of the reaction. I found it REALLY helps to tell someone you trust how you are feeling, whether on here or in RL.

I would say with regard to seeing your baby, they wouldn't have looked like the baby you would have held in your arms if they were born. We saw our little girl (15/16wks), I have slightly mixed feelings about it though. The hospital are VERY respectful whether you choose to see your baby or not, so they would have been looked after in just the same way. Will your hospital arrange a funeral? If they do, that can be helpful in saying goodbye properly (and hospital chaplains are generally very good as well).

Please don't feel you are alone in this, others will know how you feel. xx

On a practical level after I had a mc at 19 weeks I was off of work for 6 weeks. I just couldn't face going out of the house even for the first 4 weeks.

The doc can sign you off with something general like 'late miscarriage'. Do make sure it is soemthing pg related though as this type of sickness doesn't count toards your general sickness record.

The mw may well have taken photos and put them into your notes. It may be worth phoning today to find out. I personally felt a great comfort from seeing and touching my DD. It might also not be too late to see your baby - were they running any tests? Are you having a funeral?

Thank you all for your words, it really does help to be able to talk to others who have been through this.
I am building up the courage to call work now, to see if I can work from home this week, otherwise I will go to the GP for a certificate.
They told us that they would cremate the baby in 4 weeks, so he/she is still at the hospital, we decided against a post morterm at the time, so no test are being carried out.
I just feel numb most of the time, but getting through the days because of the children. But like you have said, it is early days.

Numb is fine sweetie and if just going through the motions of your day to day routine gets you through the day then just concentrate on that for now. I think someone mentioned ARC earlier (Antenatal Results and Choices) and it might be worth you contacting them if you think talking to someone might help before you get the chance to see the counsellor? I didn't speak to them myself but have heard from others that they have very kind, experienced telephone staff who can talk things through with you.

For what its worth, I don't think a post-mortem at 14 weeks can tell you very much more than you already know from the CVS. And I really am pleased I didn't see my 'baby' when I delivered at 13 weeks. There are other ways to cherish the memory so please don't beat yourself up over whether you should have dealt with any of the details differently.

Dear Littlepoot
We thought that about the post-mortem and didn't want (in our eyes) the baby to suffer any more, I will have a look at the ARC website thank you.

Hi Waffy

sending you lots of thoughts, and echoing Bezzyk - do come onto the support for women after termination thread, it honestly helps.

I have had 2 terminations, the first for fatal chromosomal abnormalities at 13 weeks and the second for fatal developmental abnormalities, at 20 weeks. Both were medical terminations and I saw both babies. The second baby was much bigger and more developed and I have photos. I remain haunted by both babies but particularly the second. I am pregnant again and scan images remind me strongly of my lost babies. But it does get easier. The loss becomes part of your life, part of who you are.

38 isnt too old. Chromosomal abnormalities can happen at any age (I was 32 and 33 with mine). You don't need to jump into anything yet though - just do what it takes to get through.

And good luck. I remember the dazed, tired heaviness of that time after the termination. It will pass, and become less intense.

Hi Cantdo
You have been through a much worse time, I am so sorry to hear what pain you have suffered. I do hope everything is going along uneventful in this pregnancy.
We won't do anything too soon, we are seeing a counsellor tomorrow, which I think will help, as my dh hasn't really said anything since the termination.
Thank you all again for taking the time and effort to write.

Hi Waffydaffy - hope you are OK today. I found that having DS around (2yo) helped me keep on with daily life, getting food, cooking, getting out the house etc. It can also sometimes be awkward having younger children, going to playgroups and places where you are more likely to bump into other pregnant mums; I hope you feel able to continue getting out and doing things despite this as it does help to distract and get you through the day.

Did you manage to work from home, or take time off work in the end? I doubt anyone would ask why you are off - or you could ask your line manager to let people know you lost a baby. People won't ask for details as they don't want to intrude on your grief; or sometimes sadly they just have no idea what this means to you emotionally and won't ask for that reason either. People at my work knew I'd lost my baby because I'd stupidly got to 12wks and thought 'that's OK then' and told everyone I was expecting again before having my disastrous scan at 13wks. It did feel a bit odd going back to work after that, but it was OK - people were sympathetic but quickly realised I didn't want sympathy as it made me cry, so they let me concentrate on my work. Later on it helped that they knew as I'm now pregnant again and have been very anxious about scans up until now. It probably depends a lot on the people you work with though... (I'm in touchy-feely charity sector).

I think it's good that you are going to see a counsellor with your DH. I didn't, but did spend time with a very lovely lady from my church; and in some of the conversations we had DH broke down and cried, which I don't think he dared to do if it was me alone - perhaps he felt he had to be strong for my sake. I hope it is a useful meeting and that the counsellor is suitably sensitive and knowledgeable about how someone feels having been through this...

Anyway, hope you are OK. It's another day.

Dear Numpty
Thank you for your kind message, today wasn't too bad, I will be working from home this week, which makes things easier.
I haven't really been out except for taking the children to school this week, and a trip to the supermarket at the week, I seem to be avoiding places where I will have to acutually interact with people other than my immediate family.

Had a little cry by myself reading an email from one on the line managers who knows, and is exactly 10 weeks ahead of where I should be in my pregnancy, the next hurdle will be holding it together when my sister in law gives birth anyday, but we all have to just get on with it don't we.
I hope all is well with your pregnancy and you can try and enjoy it as much as possible.
I can't believe how niave I was with my prevous pregnancies, I know that I will never have that again - if we do decide to try again, I will be on complete tender hooks all the way through to say the least.
I hope the counsellor will be able to answer some of my questions, but not sure whether my dh will open up to her, we will have to wait and see.

Waffydaffy - glad you could sort out working from home; I wanted to get back to work, back to occupying my time with something else, but it can be awkward. As can doing anything where you come into contact with people who don't know. That's normal, I think, to want to avoid the hurly burly of 'normal life' when for you life is still anything but normal. I think it was like living in a bubble for a while for me; a little bubble of safety with me, DS and DH tucked inside.

And how difficult that others around you are pregnant. I think I found pregnancy more difficult to be around than newborns, for a while. I'm glad that at least the colleague who is pregnant knows about your sad situation so hopefully she can be sensitive about how you might feel. I found in the end I was OK, nothing was going to replace my lost baby but then these were OTHER babies. Still got bump envy though!

As for being pregnant again, it's not been an easy journey for various reasons (bleeding early on) so I've been living in a state of suspended belief until around 15wks, which was when I lost Iola. Our fetal medicine unit have been really supportive, lots of scans - I must send a card to say thanks. I think now I'm beyond my own particular hurdle I am starting to believe that things will be OK, but I'm still not telling people because so many people knew about last time - I think I will leave it until it's bloody obvious and they can just work it out for themselves.

It's a fine balance; you do have to get on with life, it's another way of coping, doing the daily chores and looking after your family. But you also have every right to grieve, be angry, frustrated and sad and to find a way of letting these emotions out and letting them go when the time is right. So I hope that the counselling session was OK; and do remember you can come on here and vent too, others will know where you're coming from. xx