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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Great Dane now on the attack - please can we do something? *Distressing content warning*

341 replies

Stryke · 27/04/2023 10:17

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/boy-7-suffers-horror-injuries-29801234#amp-readmore-target

Boy, 7, suffers horror injuries after dog bites him in face and head at pet shop
WARNING - DISTRESSING CONTENT: Little Mitchell Neville was allegedly attacked by the shop owner's Great Dane after going to buy dog food in Belfast, Northern Ireland

YANBU - enough is enough, change the law

YABU - but chihuahuas are more aggressive

Boy, 7, suffers horror injuries after dog bites him in face and head at pet shop

WARNING - DISTRESSING CONTENT: Little Mitchell Neville was allegedly attacked by the shop owner's Great Dane after going to buy dog food in Belfast, Northern Ireland

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/boy-7-suffers-horror-injuries-29801234#amp-readmore-target

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
Ichosetheredpill · 27/04/2023 11:02

Clearly something needs to be changed, the number of attacks is genuinely horrifying. We have two dogs, so I am a dog lover. It’s the attitude of owners that’s the problem. I had the owner of a XL Bully tell me the other day “he’s a real softie, I’ve got into trouble because he jumps up at people but he just wants to play, if the police come for him I’ll hide him”. Some people just shouldn’t be allowed dogs but it’s the policing of any form of licence that’s difficult to enforce as the owners who can’t be trusted to comply are generally the ones with problem dogs. I’ve had dogs all my life and my children have been around them since birth (we have Springers) but I’m increasingly cautious with unknown dogs and will unashamedly cross the road or ban visiting play dates with dogs I consider to be a risk.

Cheapcookies · 27/04/2023 11:03

But the general public shouldn't need to be dog experts.

But should owners of dogs be able to read their own dogs, so they know not to put them in certain situations? E.g. recognising that their dog might not be comfortable around strangers, children, so they don't go "that happened out of nowhere!" if a dog snaps? If people are able to recognise when their own dogs are feeling uncomfortable, then they should stop putting them in stupid situations. The general public doesn't need to be able to read dogs, but EVERYONE who owns a dog or cares for them in any way should be able to.

SorePaw · 27/04/2023 11:03

takealettermsjones · 27/04/2023 10:51

Ridiculous for anyone to own a Great Dane imo, even more ridiculous to parade it around in a shop.

It's disheartening reading about these attacks again and again, and then seeing the inevitable comments:

• It's all about the owner/training
• Children should be taught not to approach
• People need to learn to read a dog's body language

While all of those things may be true to some extent, they are not the most important thing here. The glaringly obvious point is that people are clearly NOT reading dogs well, children ARE approaching, and the owners are either crap or not bothering to train at all. So in that context, something else needs to be done!

I have zero interest in learning to read a dog's body language, I just want them kept away from me and my children. I find it crazy that as a society we're constantly putting the "rights" of people to own massive dogs without any regulation or oversight above our children's right to go about their lives without being attacked or killed.

@takealettermsjones what exactly is ridiculous about owning a Great Dane??

Arewehumanorarewecupboards · 27/04/2023 11:04

How scary for him/his parents.

Dog owners should be charged.

My dogs have been attacked by off lead dogs in the park (mine were leashed). The owner couldn’t stop the dogs and couldn’t get near them to get their collars on. I got bitten while pulling them off my dogs.
The man still walks his dogs off lead in that park (near a play area). We no longer walk there.

Cheapcookies · 27/04/2023 11:05

And I'm not saying people shouldn't have their dogs under control, either. I cannot express how much I dislike it when people let their dogs approach DD. I don't give a crap if you say he is friendly, we don't know your dog.

I say that as somebody who works with dogs and is a huge dog lover.

Laiste · 27/04/2023 11:07

Ichosetheredpill - the policing of any form of licence that’s difficult to enforce as the owners who can’t be trusted to comply are generally the ones with problem dogs.

Exactly. Which is why i think compulsory muzzling for dogs when out of their own home (or anywhere they are going to come in contact with the public - like a shop on your own premises) would be a simple easy law. Report a dog without a muzzle. We've all got phones with cameras on now.

Bananarama77 · 27/04/2023 11:09

I don’t agree that dogs should be allowed everywhere, no owner knows if their dog is aggressive if they have never demonstrated that behaviour before. One thing I would say as a dog owner is that nobody should ever pet dogs they don’t know, it infuriates me when random people try & fuss my dog especially as he’s only walked rurally. I tell them not to if they do. Still it’s awful what happened to the child in this case & not sure what a dog is doing in a shop, I think anyone who chooses to own a dog must have insurance by law

VincentVaguer · 27/04/2023 11:09

There's a really easy way to stop the stress caused by these dog attacks. Stop scouring the tabloids for news on dog attacks and be realistic about the actual reality.

Dogs aren't going anywhere so perhaps start being a bit more rational.

misssunshine4040 · 27/04/2023 11:10

fourelementary · 27/04/2023 10:30

Not pleasant but I don’t think a Great Dane attack is anywhere near as savage as the Pitt/mastiff/bull type of attacks that kill…

Those dogs are the ones needing clamped down on. Ownership should be registered and costly, with training classes prior to registration mandatory.

Never going to happen though, socioeconomic issues surround it as these dogs are often seen as a status symbol within certain areas… and the poor kids are just collateral damage. Or indeed, adults. Though if they are friends of the owners or owners themselves I have less sympathy as they make their own decisions. Kids can’t.

A Great Dane is a type on mastiff. They are powerful dogs with a huge bite force and their sheer size.

FixMyEyebrows · 27/04/2023 11:10

Cheapcookies · 27/04/2023 10:28

This line from the article:
"One minute she said he was patting the dog and the dog’s tail was wagging and the next, the dog had Mitchell’s head in its jaws."

She also mentions they looked away from the dog & child to look in a freezer.

I am not making excuses for what happened.

But there are about 14 different tail wags and only 2 of them mean a dog is genuinely happy, assuming the rest of the dog's body language is saying the same time. People need to stop focusing on the tail and look at other body language. Don't let your kid stroke dogs they don't know, or approach dogs they don't know, regardless of what the owner says (because 90% of people can't read their own dog).

I feel really terrible for the child that this happened.

It really shocks me how many dog owners are completely unable to read their own dogs. We were on holiday once and in a pub. The owner (of the pub) was telling everyone about his wonderful serbian rescues that were now pub dogs. Both appeared. The MOMENT they looked at my toddler DD (walking about) I told DH (next to her) to pick her up. Everything about their body language said "not happy" and they went straight in to very hard staring, which is just a few steps away from snapping/potentially biting. The second one did the same thing to my dog once he looked at him.
I told the landlord that his dogs were not suitable to roam free in a pub and we promptly left.

Not enough people have any idea how to read dogs. Equally, there needs to be changes to laws around dog control, and how easy it is to have & own dogs.

100% this. All of my children have been taught about what a dog (or other animal) is saying with their body and 'listen' to that way before they approach a dog. On holiday a few years back a dog owner forcibly held her dog in place so that they could stroke it. Everything in the dogs body language was screaming 'I don't want this' and yet the owner pushed it forwards saying 'you can stroke her, she's friendly'
My eldest was 14 at the time and said 'oh thank you but she doesn't look like she's interested right now' and walked away with her 12 year old sister and 6 year old brother. We talked about it afterwards and went through all the different signs the dog gave us from the minute we were walking past. I think dd2 had said 'oh she's beautiful' which started the conversation. I was just about to intervene when dd1 spoke up.
Now ds is 8 we talk about it if we see a dog in the park. When we had our dog he would look ahead to see what the other dog off lead was doing and if it looked nervous we would put ours back on the lead to give the other dog space (obviously if the other dog was on lead we would put her back on anyway)
When I worked in rescue we had a dog returned to us for three threatened bites. They insisted they came out of nowhere with no warning. When I asked them to go through each instance they were all related to someone trying to take food or high value items from him. They had had him three days and were letting their kids feed him unattended!
After spending some time working with the dog you could see he gave very clear signals when he was unhappy. Very easy to read when you know what you are doing. Someone I know has the dogs trust go into their school and teach children about being safe around dogs.
I'm not saying that this would have solved that issue but so many times I see body language being ignored or just not recognised.

AdamRyan · 27/04/2023 11:11

I didn't vote because your options were ridiculous.
But in this case I think the mum is at fault. It's a pet shop so dogs can reasonable be expected to be in there, she let her young children approach a strange dog completely unsupervised. We have no idea if she asked the owner, if the child did something inappropriate like tried to hug or "ride" the dog (common with big breeds).

Dogs are animals. Parents need to teach their children not to approach dogs they don't know and parents need to supervise their children around dogs they do know.

YouveGotToGrooveIt · 27/04/2023 11:11

There is something about the way the pet shop owner says CCTV will reveal what happened and how he cannot say any more yet, that makes me think there is more here than we're hearing about.

SorePaw · 27/04/2023 11:12

I don't agree with muzzling all dogs when not in your own home.

& in any case, other than maybe this case it wouldn't have stopped any of the other recent cases.

Either the parents or the shop owner should have been supervising this interaction. No one knows what the child might have done (deliberately or accidentally) that may have surprised or hurt the dog because no one was supervising.

takealettermsjones · 27/04/2023 11:12

SorePaw · 27/04/2023 11:03

@takealettermsjones what exactly is ridiculous about owning a Great Dane??

They're fucking massive, that's what.

GoneTillNovember · 27/04/2023 11:14

although it looks bad, I wouldn't describe it as 'horror' injuries

What the FUCKING FUCK. How about you stick your 7 year olds head into a great Dane's mouth and watch it clamp down? Or your own head? See how you'd describe it then?

TheFlis12345 · 27/04/2023 11:14

The majority of dog attacks happen within the home, attacks on strangers are much rarer and get sensationalised by the press (much like human attacks, you’re way more likely to be killed by someone you know than a random stranger, but the stranger attacks are the ones that get more reported on).

Informative article here : https://amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/dec/12/lockdown-bad-breeds-or-just-poor-training-why-are-dog-bites-on-the-rise-in-britain

Lockdown, bad breeds or just poor training? Why are dog bites on the rise in Britain? | Dogs | The Guardian

In a normal year there are around three fatalities from dog attacks; this year there have been nine. What has happened – and can anything be done?

https://amp.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2022/dec/12/lockdown-bad-breeds-or-just-poor-training-why-are-dog-bites-on-the-rise-in-britain

GoneTillNovember · 27/04/2023 11:15

Either the parents or the shop owner should have been supervising this interaction. No one knows what the child might have done (deliberately or accidentally) that may have surprised or hurt the dog because no one was supervising

Ah yes, it was the victim's fault, he was asking for it. 🙄

FixMyEyebrows · 27/04/2023 11:16

orangeflags · 27/04/2023 10:31

Strong agree with @Cheapcookies about people not reading the body language of their own dogs. I cringe when I see photos of babies lying with dogs and can spot the dog is tolerating the baby. Accident waiting to happen

Two here from a quick google showing two dogs who are clearly not happy.

Great Dane now on the attack - please can we do something? *Distressing content warning*
Great Dane now on the attack - please can we do something? *Distressing content warning*
Thelnebriati · 27/04/2023 11:18

I think parents need to stop teaching their children to approach dogs, and teach them to leave dogs alone. Many dogs don't like being touched by strangers. They might tolerate it for a while but you don't know how they will react when they've had enough.
And dog owners need to do more. Step in between kids and your dog. Be proactive. The way things are going there's going to be a call for more legislation and more restrictions, and we've only got ourselves to blame.

VincentVaguer · 27/04/2023 11:18

GoneTillNovember · 27/04/2023 11:15

Either the parents or the shop owner should have been supervising this interaction. No one knows what the child might have done (deliberately or accidentally) that may have surprised or hurt the dog because no one was supervising

Ah yes, it was the victim's fault, he was asking for it. 🙄

Well if he was annoying the dog in some way then yes, he was.

SorePaw · 27/04/2023 11:21

takealettermsjones · 27/04/2023 11:12

They're fucking massive, that's what.

@takealettermsjones

...and?

Cheapcookies · 27/04/2023 11:21

And dog owners need to do more. Step in between kids and your dog. Be proactive. The way things are going there's going to be a call for more legislation and more restrictions, and we've only got ourselves to blame.

I agree with this. Too many people are worried about looking 'rude' to the other people in the situations by saying no. Saying no and preventing the hello between child/dog is an important step to keep everyone safe and happy.

KimberleyClark · 27/04/2023 11:21

When out with DB’s Lab who is extremely sweet natured and loves children, I often get dads coming up asking if their child can stroke him. I always tell the child to stroke his back and not reach out for his face (how would anyone like a stranger reaching for their face). I never approach strange dogs unless I’m absolutely sure they are friendly and even then only hold out my hand for them to sniff.

From what I know of Great Danes they are not generally aggressive but they can be nervous and easily startled despite their size. Owner should have been watching like a hawk.

VickyEadieofThigh · 27/04/2023 11:22

I'm a dog lover and currently have my 4th rescue dog. We take dogs who have had a shit time previously- this one was used for breeding, kept in awful conditions (so bad she was near death when the dog warden reacted to a tip-off and removed her) and was in rescue for 9 months until we took her. She is fearful of strangers and takes a lot of getting to know them.

She us ALWAYS leashed out of the house, muzzled if we think necessary and we do not allow strangers to approach her. She wears a "nervous" yellow collar.

I hope that pet shop owner is well insured because I'd be suing his arse off if I were thst parent. Doesn't matter WHAT the child did or didn't do - the dog was too dangerous to be allowed access to customers.

takealettermsjones · 27/04/2023 11:22

SorePaw · 27/04/2023 11:21

@takealettermsjones

...and?

...and any dog can turn, but if a massive one turns, you're more likely to be dead.

It's not hard.

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