To wonder where responsibility should lie to stop the bullying that seems still rampant in our schools?

[AgentZigzag]

I was posting on this thread yesterday, where the OPs DD had been bullied for two years, and where her parents were at the end of their tether trying to get somebody, anybody, to stop what was happening.

I don't know whether I should be surprised, given my experiences of being bullied myself and listening to stories of bullying on here and in RL, that bullying is still to be found in many schools. Resolution of the situation always seems to be the 'victim' being forced to move out of their own school whilst the bullies remain.

I'm not saying that bullying is in all schools, or that some schools don't deal with it effectively, but it does look to still be in the fabric of quite a majority of childrens lives.

Why is this do you think?

-Should responsibility lie with the government to give schools and LEAs the power to stop some children from bullying others?

-Are the school systems in place for flagging up and dealing with bullying ineffective?

-Should the parents of children who have bullied others be held accountable for their childrens behaviour at school?

-Have the goalposts changed so even natural disagreements between children are now considered bullying, making it difficult to deal with more serious cases?

-Or should it be accepted that bullying is a natural dynamic of childrens behaviour, and some bullying is inevitable at some level or other at some time in a childs life?

I have found my dcs' schools very proactive when it comes to bullying. It has to start with training right from the first term in infants: teaching the children not to put up with bullying, to look out for one another, to always tell a member of staff if you or another child is being hurt or frightened. This message has been constantly reinforced in dcs' schools, together with reminders that the school will and can put a stop to any bullying. I have had to go in on three occasions to discuss problems: each time, the school has reacted immediately and the problem has been resolved. At the same time, the schools have made it clear that I highlight a problem, but it is their job to find the solution: I do not tell them how to discipline somebody else's child. I have been fine with this, because their approach has given me confidence.

I was bullied myself at school, I don't suppose children are any different from what they were in my day, but the adults seem far more knowledgeable and savvy.

It's human nature. Don't think it can ever be 'erased' it will always be there and the only thing that stops adults bullying is maturity and the threat of prison!
But at least these days they are doing something about it. Back in the 1980s and earlier it was just something you had to get over.

I and some of my friends had a letter sent home for bullying at secondary school. Our crime - arranging to sit together in certain lessons which excluded this particular girl. Not even, there's a spare place but you can't sit there, but arranging to sit as a 4 at a table that seated 4.

I've no doubt that this may have made this girl unhappy, it was a consequence but not the aim. I think sending letters home in situations like this is a gross overreaction (to this day my mum still believes we must have done something far more evil or she wouldn't have got a letter). And I think it doesn't help the cause, because bullying is serious, and classing an incident like that as bullying dilutes that seriousness

bullying IS in all schools. any school that tells you there is no bullying is lying and i wouldnt trust them to deal with any problems that would arise.

"-Should the parents of children who have bullied others be held accountable for their childrens behaviour at school?"

they should be hauled in whenever possible, a childs behaviour good or bad is down to the parent and the child to deal with mainly, not the teachers, they are there to communicate problems and TEACH.

"-Have the goalposts changed so even natural disagreements between children are now considered bullying, making it difficult to deal with more serious cases?"

i think the goalposts have definately moved within primary schools, yes. i also think that with the rise of the internet, there is more evidence of bullying, and parents think that more takes place, when its just coming through a different medium.

-Or should it be accepted that bullying is a natural dynamic of childrens behaviour, and some bullying is inevitable at some level or other at some time in a childs life?

i was bullied for 3 years at school, and yes i think bullying is inevitable, but it should never be accepted. it has made me the person i am today, but it was awful. it is a natural dynamic though, and treating the problem as it arises is more helpful than any 'preventative measures'
we need instant action by teachers to make the problem known, and then PARENTAL INVOLVEMENT to control their childs behaviour.

Teachers have a responsibility to stop pupils from beating one another up/ deliberately persecuting others on school premises but they cant force kids to be friends with other kids, so I do have some sympathy for teachers who are faced with parents complaining that their child is being excluded from certain groups, which they interpret as bullying. What is the teacher supposed to do? As adults we want to choose our own friends, so shouldn't we extend that to children?

Also, now that modern technology has facilitated the reach of the bully, where the school's jurisdiction stops is less clear.

On that basis, I think the schools should focus on eliminating "active" bullying- i.e. sustained persecution by an individual or group on school premises.

Like cory I have found both my Ds schools pro-active when it comes to bullying.

Right from reception the children were encouraged to say if anything had made then "unhappy" at break. When I was at school that would have been seen as tale-telling but DD's school encouraged the culture that it is OK to speak up if someone has upset you.

Fortunately DD never seems to have been a victim, or of she has it has never worried her unduly. However, I know of 2 or 3 of her friends parent's who have had to approach school at various times, both primary and secondary, and in each case the matter was swiftly dealt with either by the form teacher or the head of year.

I think the difference from when I was a kid was that then bullying was only recognized as such if it was a physical thing, i.e. someone beating you up. These days the schools seem to be much more aware of the damage that can be done by non-physical bullying. IME

It's really good that there are schools who have found a formula to deal with it quickly and not dragging it out month after month leaving the children terrified of going in every day.

It's a pity they're not all forced to use it.

YANBU-I feel very strongly about this subject. Human nature? My arse. It may be human nature to kill etc but we don't want to encourage it in our children. The whole point of civilisation is to try and curb the dark side of human nature.

I just read the other thread. Tis awful. We need to teach our kids basic values and to respect each other. The school sounds crap.