to be disturbed that my DD was shown this anti-abortion video

[Tanga]

DD (15) came home saying that she'd been shown a video of 'the baby's view of abortion' in her RE class today. She was pretty horrified (both for herself and on behalf of one of her friends who has had an abortion)which I'd guess would be a fairly typical response, but she went on to make some wildly innacurate comments about the proceedure (some very graphic so I'll spare you) so I asked her what it was she'd actually been shown.

It's called 'The Silent Scream' (written in Hammer horror style lettering) and I've googled it and am fairly appalled. It's (IMO) an anti-abortion piece of propaganda made in the '80's and is riddled with innaccuracies.

Is this a normal video to show a class of teenagers? It was presented as fact, BTW, and as 'the most humane method of abortion' by the RE teacher.

Gah - typed a whole update and it disappeared!

So - saw the teacher. Will try to be fair - her position is that the children 'need' to know what abortion is and that this video is a 'scientific' view of abortion. The only 'bias', in her view, is the narration (ie the doctor's words) but that the scan 'film' is accurate.

She is going to show the 'opposing point of view' in a video that shows what happens when women had no access to legal abortion, and that sometimes there are 'good reasons' for abortion, ie if the baby id badly disabled (!) or there is a problem with clotting (!?!)

I feel really upset with myself - she just steamrollered through all my objections. She said the letter had said parents were welcome to ask her about the materials, which it did, but it had no details about what was going to be shown. I dug it out when I got home, it said that the topics covered would be abortion, euthanasia and suicide, and that video of 'sensitive' material would be shown.

Now I'm home I can think of lots of things I should have said - like will she be showing video footage of a 'real' suicide? I feel like I have let DD down by not being able to respond to this person quickly enough and she also told me I am the only person to complain in her whole teaching career. She said it is a widely-used resource.

DD is still upset. She told me that one of the boys (who was crying after this video) has told he that his girlfriend has had an abortion and he now feels 'like a murderer'.

Am sticking to my guns and have made an appointment to see the head tomorrow.

That's awful Tanga, I really hope the head is more sensible.

LEt's just imagine, for a minute, that the subject of the class was not abortion but, say, the ethics of meat-eating, and a film was shown of pigs, cows etc being chased round a field by masked men with machetes - ie something completely factually inaccurate but very emotive. Or even the footage which (allegedly) exists of turkey farmers using live turkeys as footballs - wouldn't stern words be had with a teacher who used blatant propaganda like that?
Much as I'm always happy to administer a good online kicking to antichoice activists, I think the main issue here is an individual teacher's use of outdated, discredited and thoroughly inaccurate propaganda in a lesson.

Tanga, take points from this thread & write them down, so you can refer to them. Hopefully the head will actually listen to what you have to say, rather than justify showing this piece of shit.

I do hope you get more sense out of the Head!

The 'scan' film is accurate? FFS.

& as for you being the only person ever to complain, in her entire teaching career - well, a) I don't believe her - I've never met a teacher who's been teaching for any length of time who has never had a run in with a parent & b) it's irrelevant - obviously about time someone did challenge her.

Don't feel you've let DD down btw - you're doing exactly what needs to be done. Well done you for sticking to your guns.

Tanga, sorry it didn't go well, but I don't think you could expect it to really, with the teacher. As a teacher, I would stand my ground if a parent complained and I met with them, I'd be much more bothered if having to explain myself to the headteacher. I think the very fact of the age of the video should form part of what you say to the head, there's no way something that old is the best "scientific" view of the act of abortion.
Suggest they update their teaching materials.
It's possible the head will stand by the teacher, but it might still lead to the video being dropped, or parents being specifically asked about it next year. It seems odd to have asked parents for permission the way they did; it's as if someone told her that this would be a way round any complaints she might get.

When you see the head tomorrow please insist that they watch the video themselves, and ask them to email you with their thoughts as to its suitability afterwards. If they don't, pester them until they do.
Make it clear that you are not complaining because you are pro-abortion but because you feel that the video is out-dated, inaccurate and overly sensational. Make the point that this is a sensitive issue that is upsetting to all of the children, but that you are particularly concerned about one or two who have been directly affected by the issue, and that, regardless of the school's need to open up their eyes to both viewpoints, children in particular should not be put in such a position. It is the school's responsibility to keep these children from harm, and the emotional strain that some of those children will be put under, particularly if their peers know they have had an abortion, must be overwhelming.

Tanga - I know how frustrating it is when you feel you've been steamrollered but you've still achieved something by taking it up with the teacher. You've made her realise people have noticed what she's up to. And now you can speak to the head with a clear conscience, having raised it with the teacher.

I like SGB's analogy with meat-eating and sensationalised footage. As a vegetarian, I've never demanded the right to show children video nasties designed to put them off meat!

sgb my sister teaches communication studies at A level and part of her syllabus required her to show some undercover footage of chickens being treated like the turkeys you mentioned. Funnily enough she was traumatised enough to become vegetarian, but none of the kids batted an eyelid!!

I haven't seen the silent scream video, but nor would I ever want to! I'm passionately pro-life but would not be able to sit through watching what I believe to be a murder, let alone want my children to! I cannot believe no one has complained to this teacher before!!

You should speak to the head about it, but not because you oppose the view, just because regardless of your views it is not okay to show what is potentially a baby (argue about the phrasing - I know some don't agree) being killed/terminiated (again, whatever wording you like)

As someone pointed out earlier - I bet they won't be showing someone being euthanised.

That's interesting, Gracie. But the point about this film is that it isn't truthful. Schools shouldn't be presenting lies as fact or reasonable accounts. If they want to show dubious propaganda, it should be as part of a discussion about propaganda.

I bet they won't be showing any other form of surgery, either. All surgery is extremely gruesome - thank God for anaesthesia!

You have not failed your dd - you are following it up with the head. I agree with what everyone says - emphasize that it is not the topic you have problems with it is the inaccuracy of the video that is the issue. Take note of all the 'unscientific' points of the film , explain the effect that it has had on your dd and her friends. I also think that asking the head to watch it is a good idea. Can you find anything in the school policies or prospectus about pupils emotional well being? Think about what you will say if sticks up for the teacher. Are there any other parents you can talk to about this that would back you up?
You will be fine and you are doing the right thing

YABU to be honest- children should be taught morals, especially in a Catholic school, and showing the truth around abortion is not wrong. Especially as they were 15 and many were probably already having sex. Why is it worse than "propaganda" about the effects of drugs and boozing or anti-smoking photos of cancerous lungs or videos against racism and gangs with graphic content?

I'm not so sure about giving out condoms. It may be a "harm reduction" strategy but does nothing for the spiritual or emotional harms of teenage sex. It's better they do it with a condom than without but I'd certainly prefer if they waited.

It's not the truth about abortion - whatever that means - and it's not a Catholic school.

Because this particular film is not true, distraughtmum. SGB's comments about meat eating might help you here.

My point is that I don't care what the narrator says (any topic being debated is going to involve propoganda from both sides to try and 'win' the argument - so yes, I think particularly in RS/communications/PHSE children are shown things which aren't scientifically accurate) but even muted, it's not okay to show a baby/fetus/whatever/ being killed/terminated.

Even people I know who have had abortions did not want to watch the screen as it was happening (I was a post-abortion counsellor so I have met a few)!

I just think it's completely unacceptable for that to be shown in a school and I want to make sure your complaint is really heard and can't be thrown out by the RS teacher under the idea that you are just pro-choice.

TBH I'm pretty furious with whoever made the documentary in the first place. If you believe it's wrong then what were you doing sitting there filming it?

Lolapoppins - were you given the tiny gold feet pins? We were given those in secondary school. I also went to a catholic convent school... Any discussion that was ever had about abortion was very 'anti' and biased. In fact, it was never a discussion. Just a one-sided lecture - no other opinions were entertained. I found it to be very over the top and forceful, when I was 15, and I find the idea of 15 year olds being shown this type of film now to be utterly reprehensible.

This kind of thing is very much on a par with the 'Youth Defence' tactics (at least where I live) of blocking up main streets with their placards showing aborted foetuses, forcing flyers into the hands of passers-by... It is the kind of behavour I have a serious problem with, being very pro-choice - and having been verbally abused by both an RE teacher in school, and more recently an anti-abortion campaigner on the street , for daring to disagree with their views.

Sorry for the rant OP - I feel very strongly about this and would certainly be making a serious complaint to the school.

I;d have major problems with her telling the class that "sometimes there are 'good reasons' for abortion, ie if the baby is badly disabled". Especially if she said it to ds2 or ds3 who do have a severely disabled brother. The last thing either would need is a 'better off dead' discussion in the company of their classmates (who know ds1). It would be very confusing for 2 children who love their brother & if that's something they need to work through in the future- so be it - their choice- but they don't need to start that process in a room full of classmates.

FFS- she should be presenting termination of pregnancy as a choice. That's essentially what it is. I think it's fair enough to discuss what happens when there is no access to legal and safe termination. That's factual. But she should be presenting propaganda for either side. It's a personal choice which will be affected by many factors and be an individual decision. Presenting extreme anti and pro arguments to teenagers is not remotely appropriate.

should NOT be presenting propaganda

Obviously

Tanga,

I totally agree that you have to get the Head to watch the video, surely he will be horrified. I would also write to the governers and OFSTED, with the link to the video on youtube so they can watch it themselves.

Have you spoken to any other parents about this? As a parent, I'd really want to know if my child was watching this sort of stuff at school - and I'm sure oher parents will complain too.

If you are worried about the meeting, or not getting your point accross, try writing down what you want to say and taking it with you in the meeting.

Good luck with your meeting.

"Snobear4000 the OP's dd goes to a non-faith school."

Oh My god! That's really next-level disturbing. So sorry I missed that. Someone should have preformed an abortion on that teacher's mum, back in the day.

NiandraLeDes - yes, we were given the feet shaped badges. I refused one though. By 15, my views on religon were well shaped by going to a convent school - and not in the way my mother had hoped it would be!

Like I said, one of the girls in my class had already had an abortion. She was only allowed to stay at school after as she became pregnant through rape. I felt so bad for her being made to watch that film, and those horrible little badges being given out at the end made me so angry.

So my question is this: having been shown this film, what if (and it's not unlikely) another girl in the class gets pregnant. She is 14/15 years old, and completely unequipped to bring up a baby (and this is NOT an attack on teenage mothers by the way - I know that many are extremely good parents). She knows that the best decision for her is to abort, and as she's only 6 weeks pregnant it would be a straightforward process. But instead of making this decision rationally and calmly, a decision that is right for her, her decision is based on the fear, horror and guilt created by this film. In other words, she may have the baby because of the guilt instilled by the film. Is that a sound basis on which to bring a child into the world at the age of 15?

Tanga, I suggest you ask the headteacher if s/he was shown the film and gave permission for it to be used. That would be the case if it was a sex education film.

MissM I think that scenario is exactly why pro-life campaigner want the video to be seen. They hope it will scare her out of getting PG in the first place and hopefully she will never have to make that decision!

"people I know who have had abortions did not want to watch the screen"

I don't think it's standard to let people watch the monitor when their having a termination, Gracie. I'm not even sure if abortions are actually "filmed" in the first place, particularly not routine vacuum aspirations early on (and obv. not medical abortions).

Tanga as this teacher appears so convinced that this film is scientifically accurate would it be an idea to get some kind of expert on side? Perhaps your GP?