to think Cristina Odone needs a dose of reality

[hairytriangle]

apparently, we encouarge people to take more responsibility for their health by refusing to treat them if they turn up with sclerosis due to self-inflicted drinking.

And GP's role is not to deal with 'psychological problems'.

And we encourage people to take more responsibility to for their own health by 'telling them to'.

FFS what a silly, silly, middle-upper class twonk, she needs to take a long hard look at the real world that a lot of people live in.

We need to stop people accessing alcohol so cheaply and easily. We need to go back to off licences and strict hours for the sale of alcohol. This million bottles of beer for a £10 stuff has got to end.

Drinking IS out of control in this society, it IS doing real harm, and it IS costing the NHS and this country needlessly. The rest of us can't access decent emergency healthcare provision of a friday/saturday night because of all those that are off their heads. Something has to give.

I don't think refusing treatment is particularly the way to go though.

We do however need to take more responsibility for our own health and well-being, and not looking at others to pick up the blame, pay compensation, bail us out all the time.

We definately do need to stop people accessing alcohol. But I think Cristina's attitude is not well thought out, extremely judgemental, and actually does nothing to solve the problem.

We do need to take more responsibility for our own health - however, I strongly suspect the we that this relates to is the poorer section of socity, rather than us middle classes, and there is much, much, much work to be done to facilitate that - simply 'telling people' will not work!

Link?

Well, people do need to start taking personal responsibility. Part of the problem today is nothing is ever your fault. someone else is always to blame, someone else should stop it / do it / sort it out. If you cock up it is because someone else did or did not do x,y,z.

Haven't read the article, so it depends how she said it and the examples she gave, but yes, there is a case for making people responsible for their own lives and their own decisions, good or bad.

Sometimes you have nobody to blame but yourself.

...how bout we try to find out why so many people want to drink themselves into oblivion every weekend?...

You mean the people out on a saturday night who drink themselves stupid, get into a fight, throw up and go home with a stranger? And then go laughing about it the next day? Oh I was so drunk, I threw up everywhere.

Yes. Very amusing.

People who have an alcohol problem need help of course. When something has gone wrong in your life and you turn to alcohol you need every help and support to get your life back together.

But most people who go out to get drunk every weekend and then laugh and brag about how drunk they were, how little they remember and how they ended up shagging a stranger in the alley at the back of the club do it because they need to grow the fuck up.

It was on the Big Questions this morning. so sorry, no link.

Hecate I didn't say it was amusing, or tolerable, or a good thing to do. I am saying that simply 'refusing to treat' or 'telling people' is a ridiculous and inaffective way of dealing with this issue.

Do you have any source or stats to show on the assertion in your last paragraph??

How are you expecting Hecate to get stats to back up her opinion?

hahahahaha. Sorry that's really funny. Stats, source, my assertion.

no, no professor, professional or scientific study to ensure that my opinion is valid. just the evidence of my own eyes and ears on countless occasions. And my work pre marriage with teens. And the overhearing of many conversations. And the remembering of my own mis-spent youth. So I am the source of my personal opinion.

Far more reliable than any statistics. Statistics have proven that people with green eyes bake the best bread, and people with net curtains like strawberries.

• ok, maybe not those specific examples before you ask me for a link but I did read something years ago about stupid things that statistically were 'true'.

Proving that statistics are meaningless.

who is she? i was watching that programme in bed this morning and wanted her to stfu

My biological father is in the process of drinking himself into an early grave. He's an alcoholic, I have no contact with him, and haven't had since my mum left him when I was small - HE's the one who made the choice to do this, HE's the one who's ended up fat, almost blind, with a completely shot to hell liver. I don't expect society to hammer the decent people who drink in moderation because of his bad choices - I'm not yelling and screaming for more restrictions on alcohol and someone to blame - he's done this to himself, he has to face the consequences of what he's done, and the buck for what he's done stops at him and him alone.

I can't bear Odone but she is right here.
We have created a societyo f moaners and whingers and scroungers who refuse to take responsibility for anything.
It's alarming.

I sort of agree as I am big on personal responsibility, but it's the start of a slippery slope IMO.

Any government that legislates on health treatment will begin by restricting/charging for/refusing treatment for alcohol and smoking-related illnesses, as these are easy to demonise, but I guarantee that it will then move on to food and lifestyle (weight and diet-related problems being one of the most expensive drains on the NHS). How many of us can truly claim that we eat the perfect diet and lead the perfect lifestyle for optimum health?

Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but IMO in a fair society all you can do is educated people and encourage them to do the right thing while knowing that there will always be some who exploit the system and take it for granted. Anything else can lead to moral judgements about health and whether treatment is 'deserved'. It also paving the way to privatising the health system (self-inflicted illnesses have to be paid for privately), which will always disproportionately affect the poorest in society, deserving or not.

As if to prove my point - just googled 'Cristina Odone health'