to be narked that a teacher......

[BeFlexible]

asked DD2's class "Who is being tutored?"

A few put their hands up.

She then proceeded to lecture them that the only way to do maths is her way and they should forget about any other methods as they as not as good.

What?

how old is she?

can she relay this back to you properly?

i imagine if they are being tutored to do the math another way it would get very confusing for her and the children when she is trying to teach it the way the school wants it teaching...

That is very strange, but maybe something odd is going on with tutors locally to you.

DD does Carol Vorderman's online course, and DD's teacher gets DD to stand up in Maths lessons and tell the rest of the class the Carol Vorderman tips.

I was under the impression that in maths there was only one way of doing each thing, and that was the point, each one has their own formula of working out so you could apply it to different problems.

That was until DD1 came home from school adding up two three figure numbers in a way I'd never heard of!

I can see why the teacher would want them all to fit in with the way she has to teach them though.

Same here AgentZigzag, DS has been taught maths in a different way to how I was, works though we got to the same answer, which was lucky because his teacher is a God to him and I think he was thinking I was a bit dim, doing it wrong.

I presume she is a yr 5 teacher?
Perhaps she is seeing loads of children getting muddled and confused with a variety of ways of approaching maths...
Sounds odd thing to say though.
My ds is being tutored now as we're in a grammar school area, but schools and tutors communicate here so they are teaching the same method.

I'm not the sharpest tool in the draw when it comes to maths, I just can't be arsed TBH

But I can add up numbers FFS, and how are you supposed to help with homework when they've changed it all? I thought the laws of maths were universal.

I think I'm getting old and the world has moved on without me

Nothing wrong with asking the DCs to use the methods she's teaching them, particularly if there's some weirdness going on with tutors locally. It would be interesting though to know what she actually said (DCs have a tendency to relate stories with an odd slant, ime).

I think it's a bit odd to ask all the DCs in front of each other if they have tutors, though.

Morloth and ZigZag I lvoe the way DS (Y4) is being taught maths. I think I'd have done so much better had we had these fancy methods in my day. Although it did take ds an entire A4 side to do one sum, and the workings out look like some kind of complex flow diagram...

Sorry - was on school run.

I really don't mind that she wants the class to use the same method - it's the inflexibility of her words to the children (had them corroborated by friend's DS).

Surely knowing 2 methods of approach gives the children more opportunity to arrive at the correct answer and confirm the correct answer?

My advice to DD was to use the school's method at school, the tutor's method when working for him, and her favourite method elsewhere. Which I feel the teacher should be echoing rather than slating other methods.

She has just taken on Y4 after a change in staffing. The previous teacher said she preferred the tutor's method but was prevented from using it by the school.

Thank you TheBoy - it was my main concern about the inappropriate questioning.

That makes me a bit sad. I was terrible at math.. Really couldn't do it.. I feel now that if other methods had been tried I wouldn't still struggle as an adult. We all learn in our own way and it shouldn't be discouraged.

I was surprised when DD was at primary that they were taught several different approaches to performing calculations before being taught a more formal method that I recognised. However, I concluded this was a good thing because it helped them to understand what they were doing and why rather than just being told this is how you do it and get on with it.

As regards the tutors - I may be naive about this as we never used one, but surely a decent tutor would know what methods were currently expected by the National Curriculum and SAT and would stick to those anyway?

As a secondary maths teacher, I tell the pupils that I don't mind which method they use for arithmetic (I give a recap of each on the board). However, I do find that pupils often make mistakes because they can't remember how to use their particular method properly. I understand the benefits of showing them a few methods and letting them pick the one that clicks with them, but this waters down the amount of time they spend practising each method. Without the constant practice of one particular way of doing things, by the time it comes to secondary school they can't remember any of them very well.

I know and frequently several ways of calculating answers to arithmetic questions -- which I think is fantastic because I have quick ways to double check my initial calculation. Some of them are methods that DC have actively been taught (I was never taught, I just figured out things like chunking for myself), which I think is great.

I am very surprised that teacher in OP is so set against learning different methods.

It's probably related to the rather odd way they are expected to do things according to the numeracy strategy. If the tutors teach them the "old" way it will be confusing for the children and for the teacher as I would imagine there will be some children who try to combine the two methods and end up confused.

It sounds as though the teacher didn't approach this in the right way, but as a primary teacher herself I can see her point. I have seen a lot of children who have been taught other methods by parents/tutors etc. With the brightest children, they can usually switch between methods quite easily and use their chosen method independently. But when a child struggles with maths, if they try to use a different method to the teacher I do think it is a disadvantage for them. I think children generally have to be really confident with one method before they can choose which suits them best.

I tutor, and I teach. There are a number of slightly different ways teachers teach kids to lay out things like grid multiplication, work on number lines etc.

So I'm consistent - I'll work through something WITH a kid asking them how their class teacher's told them to do each next step so I get the idea of the particular way that they've been taught to do it and I can work the same way. If they've got some completely wrong end of the stick issue going on then obviously I'll jump in and correct that - but if they've got half the idea from their classwork and just need a little prodding along to get the full idea consolidated (the main reason I get brought in to tutor to be honest) then I can work through it the same way their class teacher's taught them to do it.

It's generally just silly minor things like where they've been taught to record the totals for grid multiplication, or steps that they've taken along a number line - just little quirks of the intermediate methods before we get to the "normal" columns way of doing things. You get the same issue going in on supply - I always get a class to talk me through the first example I do in a direct teaching input to make sure I'm doing it the same way their class teacher does.

Very easy to be consisten with it if you're a tutor AND a practicing teacher - might be coming from retired teachers who aren't as up to date who are JUST going in with the formal methods that come in right towards the end of KS2. I know around here the other tutors I'm in competition with (although I don't actively compete - I'm generally turning away work and booked up to the eyeballs) tend to be retired teachers - and a lot of the enquiries I get are specifically because I AM up-to-date on how things are being taught these days.

It does seem like a bit of an odd way to address the situation. I teach KS2 and there are always some children receiving some sort of tutoring. I explain to the whole class that if I specifically ask them to use 'my' method it is for a reason so need them to do so but, so long as their alternative methods are efficient and accurate I am happy for them to use whatever makes most sense for them.

The only time I have directed a child not to use their own method was because it took forever and never produced the right answer!

My DD's teacher told us that they teach the children lots of different methods, to help them find the one that works for them.

As long as the children can learn the teacher's way as well, what's the problem? Learning more than one way of doing something is a good thing. It develops flexibility and lateral thinking.

lidofabiro That's exactly what my point is - What's the problem with the problem with the children knowing more than one method? Ask the children pleasantly to keep the other methods out of the classroom, and perhaps explain why - but there's no need for such dogmatism.

I've been doing a TA course (I want to go into working with children with SEN), and we've just been covering numeracy methods. Apparently, the latest technique (as of September last year) is to give them a variety of methods so that they find the one that works for them, in KS1 at least. Seems odd and pretty unreasonable to allow them to use a method which works for them when they start out, then take away that advantage later on.

The whole point is that every child learns differently, and that some methods work for one child but not another. I can understand the teacher wanting things to be consistent, but it doesn't really sound like she's considering the needs of her pupils.

Is she a newly qualified teacher, or has she been stuck in her ways teaching a long time? My sister struggled with maths as a child, and had a tutor who used different techniques to those taught in her school. That made the difference between her succeeding and failing. YANBU to think the teacher could have thought about that a bit more.

I was traumatised by a primary teacher when I was 11 as she made a big deal about the fact that I used the old and therefore "wrong" method for long division. I had recently transferred from a very old fashioned school where they feared change. She bullied me constantly in class about it as I couldn't get my head round the "new" way. I was in a class of complete numpties so anything else to make me stand out as different was not to be welcomed. I persisited in my method, which took about three lines on my exercise book whereas the "new" way (which still baffles me) seemed to take one whole page per sum. This all culminated in her drawing a line down the blackboard, writing the same sum on each side of the board and challenging me to a race. It remains one of my proudest moments, 20 years on that not only did I beat her but she got the answer wrong too

No idea what my point is other than if it works for a child then it seems odd for a teacher to demand another method be used especially when the alternative method confuses them. So I'd say (and my triumphant 11 year old self would certainly say) that YANBU.