to feel really sad when murder victims are described as "Prostitutes"

[Ladyanonymous]

• Sadly yet another spate of street workers being murdered, this time in Bradford.

Why, when the press report this do they desribe these woman as "prostitutes" and not just "woman"?

AIBU to feel really sad to hear women described like this in 2010, have we not moved on from defining people by the fact they were in a position that they needed to sell sex to survive. That is just one dimension of their lives - but makes people "downgrade" their death somehow or dismiss it.

Its like they are a third species, if the woman was a waitress she would still be described as a woman for example Claudia Lawrence is described as "the chef Claudia Lawrence".

I just wonder how it feels for the friends and families of the victims to hear that every time its mentioned in the press, it must double the pain.

They may have taken a turn in life most would not understand, but they were still people, with personalities, with lives and were loved and cared for by their parents and friends and children.

They are not just "prostitutes"

I really hate the way the press do this- imho the minute that a lot of people read the description of prostitue (which is often followed by drug addict) they switch off/ stop seeing the woman as human.

I also think regarding the debate of selling sex to survive that for some who are drug addicts they feel that they need the next fix to survive. It is so sad, these women often have no support network and are often surrounded by people who want to keep them working and addicts.

I agree it makes the general public feel safer, the Police are not put under so much pressure to catch the killers.
There was a drama made about the serial killer in Ipswich targetting prostitutes. It is called "five Daughters" and adresses the issues raised by Ladyanonymous. It tells the story of the five victims as Daughters and loved ones with lives, dreams and hopes. It was made as a reaction to the reporting during the investigation. I think it is still on iplayer.

but do the families not also bear some responsibility here?

People talk about a prostitute still being a loved daughter, sibling, family member - really? Someone with a supportive family doesn't generally end up selling their body on the street for drugs.

If they are referring to her as just 'a prostitute' in the very early stages, rather than saying Joanne Bloggs, who worked as a prostitute, it may be because she hasn't been formally identified and her next of kin may not have been informed. In much the same way that a 'soldier' will be killed in Afghanistan, rather than Joe Bloggs, a random British man, no occupation mentioned, was killed in Afghanistan. Once you know he's a soldier it gives context to the story. Sadly it's the same with prostitutes. I'm fairly confident that once the police and the media know of a victim's name, age, and family circumstances, and are able to release the info, she will be a person first, and a prostitute second.

A few years ago there were two girls murdered in my town within several weeks of each other, one was a nursery nurse and the other was a prostitute, the murders were not related and the man who murdered the nursery nurse has been caught and jailed, they are still looking for the murderer of the second girl. In a local park there is now a playgroung for young children dedicated to the memory of the first girl that was murdered, which is a beautiful thing to do and all the children love it, and I have no problems with that whatsoever. But it saddens me that the only memory that lasts of the second girl when people talk about the murders is when they say "oh the prostitute" That poor girl was someones daughter, sister, girlfriend, no-one knows what happened in her life for her to do what she did, but I think she should be remembered in the same way as any other girl who has lost her life at the hands of a murderer, not just as "the prostitute!" So sad

I seem to remember when the Ipswich murders were happening that some of the headlines were pretty

The word "prostitute" seemed to replace the usual information that is given.

and what miggsie said.

The portrayal of the Ipswich murder victims did show there was more to them than a woman who sold her body. Many of the families did not know they had drug problems or were prostitutes. Learning that on top of hearing they were murdered must have been devastating. I know they are 'prostitutes' but to report them as such seems to imply they are less important and that 'normal' woman are therefore safe.

I agree with the OP. If a woman is murdered particularly if there is a sexual element to the attack, the papers will focus on her weight, whether or not she is pretty, her hair colour and whether or not she is a model or prostitute....

e.g. "young attractive model raped and murdered after night out with friends". The article will be accompanied by a photo of the victim either posing suggestively or in a bikini. In other words of course, the bitch asked for it.

Equally if a woman commits a crime then her appearance will also be mentioned; heaven help her if she happens to be ugly or obese!

FranSanDisco - it does not imply that they are less important, but it does imply - quite rightly - that, in this instance, 'normal' women are therefore (in all probability) safe from the same fate. It is an unpleasant fact of life that prostitutes place themselves in positions of vulnerability when they go to work. Like many other 'jobs' they attract nutters and criminals, or are just inherently dangerous. Soldiers, emergency service personnel,drug dealers, organised crime gang members, bank robbers, people who work closely with seriously disturbed mentally ill, etc etc. It doesn't mean we think they 'were asking for it' or 'deserved it'. It just surprises us less, that's all.

If my DH who works in a bank, fell off a roof and died I'd be both sad, and very surprised. If my DH was a roofer or a scaffolder working on high-rise projects, and he fell off a roof and died, I'd be very sad, but not very surprised.

The word is mentioned because they are not the same as other people. The police will list any risk factors in order to warn others in the same high risk categories, then this gets reported in the press.

IIRC this lady fell into three high risk categories, prostitute, drug addict and epilepsy (sans medication)

Also not true to say these women don't have the necessary support. Very many prostitutes (or any addicts) have shunned the help and support of their families because their addiction is their biggest love, and their first priority. Anyone can walk into their GP and get instant help and support. They just have to want it, and commit to it. Anyone who has had a loved one involved in drugs/booze will know they they will go to enormous lengths to lie and cheat, and be manipulative when you offer help. All counselling agencies and support groups will tell you that you cannot help that person until they stop being in denial and offer themselves up for help. They will often tell you that the only way is to stop enabling them, throw them out and force them to hit rock bottom before they can climb up again. It is not fair to assume that people who have addictions and chaotic lifestyles do not have loving supportive parents. (though many don't - I know.)

I had this arguement with the radio this morning. Disgraceful.

If a killer is targetting a particular demographic, or if some sort of pattern is emerging, then it would be totally disingenuous for journalists not to report on it, for fear of offending delicate sensibilities.

If a group of, say, bird-watchers or trainspotters were being killed in the same area, or by the same suspected person, then we'd hardly expect the press to refrain from commenting on their commonality and instead just refer to them as 'people', would we?

but trainspotters deserve it
they're asking for it

bird-watchers too

Well I'd appreciate your not sharing my opinions a great deal more if you could at least go some way to debating some of the points I've raised, (and indeed explaining/justifying your own points) instead of just ignoring them.

Do you think that the press should omit their occupation from the story, and on what grounds?

You said 'it's a bloody tragedy in this day and age that women are forced to do that.'

Forced by who, and why? And if they are drug addicts or alcoholics what do you suggest we do for them, in order to fund their habits?

YABU, all crime victims and perpretrators are described by what they do for a living.

It is their job and possibly relevant to why they were murdered. YABU.

'YABU, all crime victims and perpretrators are described by what they do for a living.'

and in the Daily Mail, the house price usually gets a mention as well

thesecondcoming - I think you might be reading a little TOO much into tiggy's post.

Tiggy - I have argued with myself whether to divulge this on a public forum, but your comments have insensed me.

I am a drugs counsellor, I work with young people who have addiction issues, I also work with young people who have parents who have addiction issues.

I was also once addicted to Heroin. I have been clean for 15 years this year.

I have done a lot of things with my life and with my body I am not proud of but I have accepted, and I have moved on from.

I feel I have made my peace with society.

My family adore me, they did when I was homeless, they did when I was at the depths of my depraved need to get completely off my face and crush up anything I could get my hands on to put in a syringe and into my blood stream. They still adore me now.

Their love for me could not save me from becoming an addict in the first place and nor could it get me from the clutches of it once I was there. I myself did both those things, by firstly not using the correct coping skills to deal with a set of horrific circumstances, and secondly by realising life had more to offer me than Heroin, and the chaos and monitiny addiction offered.

When I volunteered and I worked with parents of drug and alcohol misusers many many times I came face to face with what I had put my lovely mum through, the mights she must've lost sleep when the phone rang, wondering if it was me as she hadn' heard from me for days, wondering if it was the hospital, and I, her beloved daughter, was dead.

Many many kids I work with have no parents, or have parents who couldn't give a shit, and therefore how can anyone expect those kids to give a shit about themselves when their own parents don't.

Your view of addiction is very very simplified, don't ever be so complacent as to think its just other people who will be affected by it, one day your life might be as the biggest addiction around is alcohol, but that is much much easier to pass off as "acceptable" than a dirty little Heroin or Crack habit. I hope if it does ever affect you or anyone you love you are met with the care, love and concern hat I was and you do not have to deal with peoples judgements on top of everything else.

Addiction is indescriminent and I know had I been murdered when working the streets and been described as such, it would've killed my mum, because I was her little girl who just happened for a while to lose her way.

Bimey great post ladyA

You have brought a tear to my eye.

Well done on turning your life around like that, your family must be very proud