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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think kids' school is a bit shit

35 replies

KickButtowski · 14/05/2010 21:31

It's a small school, 4 mixed age classes, so 4 form teachers, 1 head teacher and a handful of pt TAs who float around. 81 kids in the whole school.

So for the past 2 weeks dd ( in Y1 and has SN ) has been cared for by these TAs on a rota because her regular support worker is off sick (lazy cow taking the piss, but that's another story). This has been discussed and I am reassured that she is being taken care of properly.

However, then the class teacher pointed out that while I don't need to worry about dd it has left the rest of the class and the whole school in fact in a bot of bother because there are no TAs to help anywhere so it has been very hard to organise classes and lessons. She sort of said this in passing and I don't know what she expected me to say, but I thought it was pretty crap.

DDs support worker is also responsible for changing their reading books 3 times a week and setting homeowrk on a friday. Last week the books weren't changed at all but they did get their homework. This week books were changed but today we had a note saying there was no homework because form teacher was also off scik so there was nobody able to do it.

I appreciate they are a small school on a tight budget etc and sicknesses are hard to accommodate - but I think this is shit. They should be getting a supply teacher in to act as TA if necessary, and someone in the school should be able to find the time to sort out books and homework.

Or am i over-reacting.

OP posts:
janeite · 14/05/2010 21:35

yes they should have a supply teacher but you are being totally unreasonable re: your lazy cow comments.

Original poster
KickButtowski · 14/05/2010 21:38

Thanks Janeite, but regarding the 1-2-1 I am def NBU - there is a lot of history with this person, constant problems since she took on the role and now we and the school are trying to have her removed because she is a very lazy cow, but it takes time, and in the meantime everyone is suffering as a result.

OP posts:
pearlym · 14/05/2010 21:39

Need to get in supply, YANBU- every day is vital, too important to jsut let drift

Original poster
KickButtowski · 14/05/2010 21:40

I just can't understand why they haven't got in a supply teacher - form teacher said they didn't want a supply person working with dd, and I agreed, but isn't the obvious thing to get a supply person in to work as a TA. Presumably they are just trying to save money?

OP posts:
larks35 · 14/05/2010 22:04

I think (I could so easily be wrong here) that schools are insured against teachers being absent for longer than 3 days (then they don't pay for supply) but I'm not sure if the same rules apply to LSAs or TAs.

Supply teachers cost approx £175 per day if through an agency, that is a lot out of your budget especially if used to cover a TA's absence. I don't think that supply TAs exist.

If there are 4 form teachers to 81 kids that is a far better ratio than most primary schools, I imagine the teacher was just off-loading a bit when she was saying it's caused bother.

With only 81 pupils your DD's school is small and struggling I should imagine. Are you in a position to be able to volunteer some of your time to sort out book bags/reading lists. If not, can you set up or add support to a Parent group and enlist the help of other parents. I do think that schools of this size must really struggle (funding is per pupil) but are often important in rural areas and need the support of the community they are in.

runnybottom · 14/05/2010 22:18

Y1 is how old? Sounds quite young....hardly every day vital.

hocuspontas · 14/05/2010 22:25

Sorry - your dd's needs (quite rightly) have first priority while her 1-to-1 is off and you're upset because no one's available to set homework? YABU

PurpleHeffalump · 15/05/2010 13:35

You expect a school with 81 children to pay a supply teacher to act as a TA
You do know that the money a school gets is based on number of children and the school already has 1 teacher to 20 children, where most schools have 1:30 or more?

One week without homework and one week without changing books is not going to have any impact on a child's education.

Plus the school are putting your dd's needs first and ensuring that she is supported...

... and you're still moaning!

PurpleHeffalump · 15/05/2010 13:37

Just thought about your expectation that they'd pay £180(ish) per day for a teacher to support your dd. So you expect the school to pay to have two qualified teachers in a class of 20? YABVU!

shockers · 15/05/2010 13:47

Is your child's SSA centrally funded? If the education authority haven't sent a replacement then it will leave the school short staffed and it's not their fault. Also, it's harder to 'get rid' of centrally funded SSAs as the school are not employing them directly.

piscesmoon · 15/05/2010 14:00

You wouldn't get a supply teacher coming in at a TA rate of pay and the school couldn't afford to pay the supply teacher rate for a TA. The school budget will already be over stretched. I don't think that there is a bank of supply TAs.If a TA is away they either have to do without or take time from another class.

MrsC2010 · 15/05/2010 17:17

YABVU

Galena · 15/05/2010 19:58

Supply TAs do exist... We had some at our school.

Original poster
KickButtowski · 15/05/2010 21:18

I think the staff child ratio is irrelevent here because of the mixed age groups. 1 to 20 sounds fantastic, except that within those 20 you are dealing with two yeargroups so obviously different lessons etc to be delivered by the same person which is why the TA is relied on to supervise one age-group whilst the teacher teaches the thers.

I don't give the school any extra thanks or credit for ensuring that my dd is cared for - we spent 2 years fighting for that support and I expect it to be there one way or another.

I am sure they are small and struggling, and I had no idea that a supply teacher was so expensive so thanks for making that clearer. I can see now why that is not really an option.

Do schools have specific rules for dealing with sickess pay do you know? I have only ever worked in the private sector and generally companies I have been involved with let you have a set number of paid days off sick and then you are on SSP - clearly this is not the case with dd's 121 and she is still on full pay. So no wonder the school can't afford to pay for someone else, but it seems ridiculous. She is not centrally funded by the way, she is employed and paid for by the school, so they are the ones who have apparently given her a very generous contract.

OP posts:
Galena · 16/05/2010 08:31

I think you stay on full pay, but most schools have insurance in place which kicks in after a week, so once the individual has been off for a week the school gets insurance money to cover the pay. Obviously, being such a small school they may not have this insurance, and it also may not cover TAs.

TotalChaos · 16/05/2010 08:36

yanbu - because class teacher shouldn't have moaned to you about problems caused by 1-1 being off sick.

gingernutlover · 16/05/2010 08:39

but yabu to be moaning about homework and reading books.

Feenie · 16/05/2010 08:39

Yes - God forbid she has a conversation with you that in any way goes beyond your own child.

gingernutlover · 16/05/2010 08:41

could you/have you offered to go in and photocopy homework and change books?

the problem with them hiring a supply to do this (apart from the cost) is that every school has a different system of changing books and to expect someone new to do it, would take time to show them how to - time they obviously dont have, or they would just do it themselves.

Chill out and recognise the fact that they are putting your child first.

cazzybabs · 16/05/2010 09:45

the school may have employed her but her contract is still with the local authority.

FranSanDisco · 16/05/2010 09:54

Spend a week in some inner London schools and then complain about books being changed and homework being set and actually marked. YABU and rude.

SE13Mummy · 16/05/2010 13:00

I teach in an inner London school, have never had the luxury of having 20ish children in my class and rarely have I been lucky enough to have full-time 1:1 support for the children who need it. Being used to teaching 30 children (who in a Y5/6 class often need work to be differentiated from Y1 level upto Y7), setting/preparing/marking my own homework and changing reading books myself I would find it hard to understand why another teacher couldn't manage this.

However, it sounds as though your DD's teacher and the wider school simply isn't used to doing all these things and had yet to get her head around how to do them within the course of her week. Hopefully the teacher will have spent a bit of time re-jigging her week now that she has a clearer idea of the impact of the absence of your DD's TA.

Original poster
KickButtowski · 16/05/2010 13:34

FranSanDisco what is your point? - because there are other schools struggling even more then I should accept that this isn't so bad? WTF? I will never take that attitude about anything in my life. I expect the best that is possible, always, about everything, and if my child attended one of those inner-city schools I would be on here asking for advice about how to sort it out.

We should be dragging up the standards of poorer schools, not letting the better ones slip down.

And where was I rude?

OP posts:
Zondra · 16/05/2010 13:48

KickButtowski, I agree with your last post, in your refusal to accept an unreasonable situation in your child's education.
Just because other schools are underfunded,have crap teachers, large class sizes,etc. it doesn't mean you should put up & shut up.
My child also has SN & if his assistance & learning was compromised in any way I would be creating a stink. If I don't stand up to the school/ local authorities for him to ensure his needs are met,who will?
Yanbu.
Oh,& the teacher wasn't very tactful moaning to you!

Also, why the hell can the teacher not be in charge of homework or reading books?
When I was young there were no TAs to help out & it seemed to me that the school ran smoothly.

Original poster
KickButtowski · 16/05/2010 14:11

I am actually even crosser now thinking about it, as many posters on here have of course pointed out that having a TA is a luxury in many schools, so why is ours supposedly finding it so hard to cope without one?

I was initially moaning that there wasn't a TA because the school seem to need one - fair enough, I should have been moaning about why they can't manage without one.

I thought it was completely unprofessional of the teacher to be moaning to me like that. Also made me wonder how other parents would feel if she moaned to them that she was struggling in class because her TAs were all helping my dd.

OP posts: