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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

caffcass recomends contact with abusive dad

58 replies

kittycat68 · 13/05/2010 00:10

cafacass have recomended contact for my children with their dad whom we left due to abuse. they have refused to see him for the last 18months, ex went to court as self litigant for enforcment order, kids 10 and 15 and are petrified of him they have told cafcass of the abuse but the report says he how works in a SEN school and as there is no recenet abuse he should be now having over night contact. what do i do they dont want anything to do with him cafcass seem more inclined to belive he has changed than to listening to the children , 20 years of abuse now he has changed i dont think so! help.

OP posts:

FlightyButPolite · 13/05/2010 00:22

KittyCat, I have no advice, but didn't want to leave you with no replies.

It seems bloody unreasonable for Caffcass to expect your children to have contact when they don't want to.

Did you tell anyone about the abuse when you left, because I don't understand how he is working with children. It seems completely out of order to me.

Original poster

kittycat68 · 13/05/2010 00:26

yelp even had a non molestation order from the court! he claims now though its all parent alienation syndrome! he was even reported to socail services by cambhs for abuse to the children but he said the child gets confused and that was it!

OP posts:

mummytotwins · 13/05/2010 00:45

I have no advice but I just wantedto say I am so sorry that CAFCASS have ignored your childrens feeling. I hope in someway you can fight it.

CAFCASS also did the opposite of what a young member of my family wanted and he was forced to see a parent he had had no contact with for 10 years, in the end it took him turning around to his parent and telling them he didnt want to see them anymore for contact to end. I dont trust CAFCASS officers for this reason.

Your situatiois a whole different ball game, I just hope that there is someway in which you can get this decision reversed good luck to you x

Original poster

kittycat68 · 13/05/2010 00:50

thanks, most people think courts will find the truth and do whats in the best interest of the children but sadley this is not the case fathers seem to ahve more rights and power. the children have told thier father tha tthey dont want to have anything to do with him at all, but he takes no notice.

OP posts:

Unsearchable · 13/05/2010 00:54

Send them for the contact but for EVERY SINGLE EPISODE of verbal, psychological, emotional or physical abuse your children report, call the police and the social services, explaining that cafcas have supported an enforcement order and you don't know what to do.

Original poster

kittycat68 · 13/05/2010 01:03

have been told by my solicitor that verbal and emotional abuse can rarely be proved. how can i send them knowing what he can do they have told before when 15yr old was thrown against wall and bruised all his ribs nothing was done by police or socail services they said it was a family matter to be dealt with at family court and i had to pay to take him back to court. i did this and the current court order states contact wwith the children only if they wish it. how can anyone send thier child for contact when they know what is likely to happen i just can t do it!

OP posts:

SolidGoldBrass · 13/05/2010 01:08

Contact WOmen's Aid, they may well be able to help. Your DC are old enough to have their wishes taken into account, I would have thought. Basically, refuse the contact on their behalf and amass as much evidence as you can of past abuse, including their statements that they want no contact.

Original poster

kittycat68 · 13/05/2010 01:12

thanks have been in contact with womens aid for last 18months when he attacked me with a knife, they visit reguarly as i get alot of harrasment from him and they come to court with me, they have been great as inially i wouldnt go out the house after the attack, still scared of ex though!

OP posts:

Unsearchable · 13/05/2010 01:12

yes, womans aid is good idea

women's aid

SolidGoldBrass · 13/05/2010 01:51

Refuse the contact and get your solicitor to say you are appealing against the order. If there is documented evidence of this man's violence, you must be able to appeal and get the contact order overturned or at the very least made supervised contact only.

SolidGoldBrass · 13/05/2010 01:54

I'm sorry, I've just reread the thread - I know this must be really horrible and frightening for you BUT!! is it the case that the current order says you do NOT have to make your DC spend time with this man? If so, tell him (via whatever medium necessary) to go fuck himself. Cafcass have made a recommendation which may well be ignored by the court, particularly as the DC do not want to see him - he sounds like the classic abusive litigant, claiming that he will get his own way when in fact he won't.

GardenPath · 13/05/2010 02:15

Who the fuck are these cafcass wankers??? What a terrible situation, kittycat. Who's your MP?

Devendra · 13/05/2010 07:33

Move to next town and change your surname.. seriously just fight it all the way!

LowLevelWhinging · 13/05/2010 07:49

It just doesn't seem to make any sense does it?

I was on some training at work last week about this. The trainer said that once the children are old enough to vote with their feet, there'e not much anyone can do to enforce orders.

As well as Women's Aid, there is Rights of Women who give free legal advice on this sort of thing:

020 7251 6577

Good luck and I hope your family never have to have any contact with this vile man.

justaboutagovernment · 13/05/2010 07:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

bumpsoon · 13/05/2010 08:10

I would find out the name of the cafcass officer or officers and write them a letter staing that your children are frightened of their father and wish to have no contact at present . State that if the contact is enforced they must guarentee that no harm will come to your children be it physical or mental and if any did occur ,your children will take them to court in a civil action against them personally . Get them to write a letter saying they can catergorically guarentee no harm will come to your children . Then sit back and watch them watch their backs and not enforce it .

Fluffyone · 13/05/2010 08:15

How about contacting your new and eager to please MP? What about child protection charities? Childline?
What does your solicitor say about the fact that this is a recommendation? Surely if that is the case your children can stil choose not to go? A recommendation isn't the same as an order.

EcoMouse · 13/05/2010 08:15

CAFCASS are an absolute joke. I've known them leave children of several families open to abuse and for abuse to subsequently occur.

If the order states the children only have to go if they wish and if they don't wish to go then do not make them available but ring social services (I did so via nspcc, who will refer on) prior to the next contact date, stating your childrens stance.

Once this has been done, notify your local police station of the fact your DC are refusing contact, as is their right according to the c/o and that they have the support of SS. Make them aware that this man has in the past been volatile so that if they receive a call from either of you on the date of due contact, they are aware of the situation.

It is important to involve nspcc/ss and preferable that your DC speak to them directly so that there is a record of your childrens wishes, to help diffuse your ex's parental alienation claim.

All of this is of course if the next contact date is close. Otherwise and also, go back to your solicitor, appeal and do so with a barrister in court.

LoveBeingAHungParliament · 13/05/2010 08:18

here's where to make a complaint about them from what you've said it goes against their own remit. Is it possible the children have said something different to themthan what they are saying to you cause they don't want to upset you?

biddysmama · 13/05/2010 08:25

i dont trust any of them.... i was interviewed about who i wanted to live with when i was 10 and my parents divorced... with my abusive mother sat in the same room! i said exactly what she told me to say before we got there, dad hurts us, doesnt feed us etc...

i'd do a flit!

Dollytwat · 13/05/2010 18:34

I've been ordered to go on a 'parenting apart' course by the courts, and went for the first part last night. It takes place at the contact centre where my DCs see their dad.

Interesting stuff. When I asked the trainer what to do in the situation that my children would not go, and refused, she said 'well you can't force them' and that they would eventually 'vote with their feet'. To which I pointed out that if the court enforce a contact order that states my exh is to have them, if they are not there I end up back in court, possibly fined, possibly in prison. I also couldn't quite equate the parenting apart course with her attitude that as long as I'd done my bit in not slagging their dad off, that was all that was required.

There was another lady there who had been physically abused by her exh and he had been violent towards the DS as well, and she had proof. Cafcass have made a report saying they thought he was OK now and contact should move away from the contact centre.

The chap who runs the contact centre was quite accepting of this too, that contact must move away from the centre, that it can't continue there forever. There does seem to be a view from these professionals that you would choose this type of contact, and that you are somehow blocking contact.

I feel for you I really do, the system seems to be stacked up against parents who are trying to protect their children.

If the courts and Cafcass decide at my next court date that my DCs should resume their overnight contact, I can't afford to take it to a final hearing. I just can't afford it. Whilst my exh is on legal aid and can take it as far as he likes.

Fair? Not as far as I can see.

In the childrens interest? Nope.

bumpsoon · 13/05/2010 21:46

contact your exdh solicitor cia letter too and ask him/her to catergorically state via a letter that no harm will come to your children via contact with their father ,im fairly sure they wont and that is more ammo for you .

bumpsoon · 13/05/2010 21:49

people are happy to make reccomendations that have no possible comeback ,by getting them to commit to a letter backing their reccomendation ,they are putting their own careers /livelihoods on the line and therefore gives them more food for thought .

GypsyMoth · 13/05/2010 22:03

look,you have to fight....i did and got a no order and a section 91 (14) ton prevent repeat applications without leave of court.

my ex was (still is) abusive,my older dc wanted no contact at age 10 and 12...younger ones did,but only supervised.

cafcass fought for a psychological assesment of the ex...it revealed alot.....he got zero.

i fought for 2 years,but you have to keep calm,and keep repeating yourself

GardenPath · 13/05/2010 23:04

Can't we cause a Mumsnet stink about this? It seems these Cafcass idiots are protecting the 'rights' of the abusive parent at the expense of the rest of the family. Quelle surprise.
We have a brand new shiny government - lets make 'em work for their expenses claims.

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