To not get right wing thinking?

[poshsinglemum]

Cutting inheritance tax and help for the poor. The notion that how hard you work is an indication of how much you earn. An isolationalist approach to international relations. Xenophobia disguised as a concern for ''British people.''
Bringing back fox hunting and a devotion to the aristocracy.

It's not very progressive is it?

Its to keep the rich, rich, and the poor, poor. innit

I just don't even understand how the rich would want to make the poor poorer. Mabe keep the rich and make the poor rich too would work better so we can have an equal AND prosperous society.

I really despair of the selfish greed of humanity.

It's partly a justification that they deserve their good fortune.

I am a teacher and I work bloody hard but I don't get paid as much as a footballer for example.

Even trust fund recipitents wukter?

Very simplistic. And wrong. Dh and I work our arses off to buy our house, pay the mortgage - we want to be able to give what is ours (and what we have already paid intrest on!) to our children. People who are in genuine need have nothing to fear - conservatives have talked about huge crackdowns on parents who do not support their children. We cannot live in a society where the harder you work, the more you get screwed over. It will create a society where epople think "why should I bother?". My mum (63) is still working full time days and 2 nights a week to pay off her mortgage (had to buy my father out after divorce), and she need not bother. She will have to sell it to pay if she needs help when she is older (beyond what I can do). Someone who has not thought about their future will get it all free. That says she may as well pissed her money up the wall all her life - she would be better off!

I'm not right wing myself but as ever I despair of the endless talk on here of 'rich' and 'poor'.

The vast majority of people in the UK are neither of these, they are just normal people getting by.

Many people do think they deserve their salaries, as would 'poor' people no doubt if they too had a break and managed to get a decent paying job which they worked hard at.

If a poor person we kniew of on here studied hard, made sacrifices, went through shite in the jobs market and eventually secured a great job that utilised their hard-won skills and qualifications then we'd say absolutely brilliant, your success is well deserved.

But for some reason we think that all the other people on a decent wage are lucky, parasites, blinkered, priviliged etc.

It doesn't add up for me.

i think that those who have worked hard of course deserve to get their fair share and i wouln't want to take it away from them.
i love my work but there isn't equal access to opportunituy to get such rewards for those who are in the working class.

i work hard atm on a minimum wage as have applied for lots of teaching jobs but they are scarce..

Why is nobody mentioning that this election campaign is a complete failure for the Tories who still can?t manage to get a majority after 4 years of rebranding and new leadership (more than once) - despite having a 3rd term unpopular government, with an unelected PM, after an unpopular war and a global recession?maybe Charlie Brooker is :-)"

We don't have an endless pot and it's just naive to think that if you work hard blah blah blah...that you keep all of your money and the country pay for you in a nursing home. Noone's going to live in your house, you may as well have £200k in the bank. Same as people in enormous houses that think they should have handouts to avoid selling their house, if we had to we would so why not just because we're old??

i am not a teacher atm i should add but am trained and want to return soon.

YABU and sadly ill-informed.

I don't get people who are happy to brand themselves as exclusively either. I'm quite right wing in terms of things like inheritance tax and quite left about things like immigration.
On the other hand you will have people who brand themselves as left thinking liberals who appear almost facist in their desire to silence those that don't agree with them on certain issues (such as immigration)

I'm not sure on the house selling issue tbh. There was a lady on TV last night getting very tearful when discussing having to pack up all the memories in her parent's house and sell it when they went into a care home.

Obviously it must be very tough for adult children to do that, but presumably they didn't think their parents would live forever or that their parent's home would remain as it is for all time.

If the parents had died and the house was going on the market, I can't see many adult children blaming anybody else for the inevitable sadness of packing up a deceased home.

Our parents will die, we will have to go through their belongings and it will be very sad, whether it happens when they get too old to live independently, or when they die.

Even trust fund recipients. It fits nicely with the notion that it's a parents duty to provide for their children (not saying many people disagree with that - it's pretty basic). But there's no contradiction in Conservative thinking that you personally deserve the benefits of your parent's work.

It is more complex than rich or poor Morriss Zapp but (IMO) there is definitely a psychological justification of an individual's good fortune. I think it comes down to perceptions of good fortune. There are those who don't believe in it, and think they worked hard for all they have. I don't know how a person can overlook the fact of being born white & Well-off in a rich country is not a matter of luck.
Then there are those who say "There but for the grace of God go I".

garbled... Being born white and well off in a rich country is a matter of luck.

Obviouslythings have to change because we have fuck all money left.
But to call care forthe elderly a hand out is a bit crass.
Many of the people complaining have paid NI all their lives expecting to get any carethey need at the end oftheir lives. Older generations often feel it is an act of duty to leave something to your children.

Many invested in their homes hoping that that would be a small legacy of sorts. Of course they were lucky to earn enough - of course.Butthey are not landed gentry. Just people like my mum who had thoughtthat in payingtheir taxes and paying their mortgage they were building something to help their children and be a good parent

But to suggest it is rich selfish bastard greed to want the home you have worked for to remain while the NI you piad all your life helps your last years, is hardly fair.
Of course it probably has to change and people will need to sell up. I justthink callingthem names in the process is pretty shitty.

There are lots of people on here who are born white and in a rich country, yet who call themselves poor and get a lot of sympathy.

On a world wide scale, we're all incredibly rich and lucky, including those of us struggling on benefits as single parents etc with many kids to feed and clothe.

So should nobody in this country complain of inequality as they're so lucky to have free clean water, free healthcare and free education for their kids?

There should be a cut off though Pag, what if the elderly person wants to leave their £1mil home to their only son who also lives in a £1mil home, should they get free care?

Cuts have to be made, houses are only investments once people have moved into care....the children will only sell it, or should we just take money made from home after death?

I totally agree with that Posie. It shouldn't be about maintaining waelthy estates. There should be limits and caveats

I am just trying to say that they way that this is talked about - grasping selfish bastards trying to screw everyone else- is not really the case.

The issues is complicated. I think the situation of carers is especially difficult.
But it keeps being wrapped as rich types being selfish which doesn't help the discussion

Agree pag. These issues don't just affect 'the rich' so it is far too easy to blame selfish rich gits etc.

The rich could easily be excused by a handy cut off....that way we would all know the Tory idea of £8k wasn't to benefit the rich.

Let me get this right.
If you have saved £8k you can pay toward care and nothing happens to your house, if not your house isn't safe? If so that can only help the rich because who can save £8k on a state pension?

yanbu.

I have been mulling it over quite a lot since I read the JK Rowling single mum manifesto last month. What if I was rich, how would I vote? I couldn't vote in a party just to pay less tax and leave the most vulnerable people in the shit.

how can people not be able to save £8k between now and pension age?

lets assume an average age of 35 on MN, and you retire at 65
Thats £22 a month, and thats assuming you make no interest

Hardly for "rich people"

And I am no Tory, but I AGREE that certain people dont "need" handouts

I dont need my tax credit
I dont need child benefit
I dont need health in maternity
I dont need child trust fund

I like it! But I dont need it. If we are that bloody skint, stop giving handouts!