... to wonder why more people don't buy rear-facing car seats for children over 1 year?

[FrozenNorth]

Sorry if this has been discussed before, but I'm just curious as to why I'm the only one amongst my acquaintances to have bought a rear-facing car seat that should fit my DD up to the age of 4 years?

I realise that the government guidelines / laws don't say much about the fact that it's far safer to stay rear-facing beyond the initial group 0 seat, but a few minutes' internet research and a couple of crash-test videos on YouTube were enough to firmly convince me that it's the way to go. In Sweden it's recommended to rear-face your child to the age of four.

So, if you chose to forward-face your child at an earlier stage, what was your rationale? I know, for instance, that the rear-facing seats may not fit in smaller cars. They tend to cost more and they are harder to get hold of. Not a single large store (e.g. Mothercare, Halfords etc.) in the UK sells them.

In case anyone's interested in the evidence behind rear-facing vs forward facing, here's a few links:

Why consider rear-facing?

Safety benefits

The British Medical Journal recommendations

Buyers' guide and list of UK retailers selling rear-facing seats

YouTube video showing crash test footage

Sorry about all the links. This is something I feel really passionately about and I feel so angry that major UK retailers don't supply the safest possible seats for our children.

Frozen north you have answered the question as to why people dont have them here. Anyway my 3 year old dd is as tall as a 4 year old and would never fit in one, and hates travelling backwards. We were on a bus with a rear facing bus seat and she hated it. Some toddlers are really tall so how on earth would they travel comfortably.

Agree with wb

Frozen north that picture you posted of that 4 year old girl in a rear car seat looks so uncomfortable, he legs are all squashed surely not good for bones etc, surely she should be in a forward facing one my now!

"not good for bones etc, surely she should be in a forward facing one my now!"

pigletmania, I personally feel that paralysis via internal-decapitation is less good for bones than squashed legs. Most of the kids in nordic countries seem to do just fine without sustaining permanent injury from sitting like this

We've got a rear facing seat (from the in car safety centre in Milton Keynes because that was the only place that sells the Britax Two Way Elite that we have). It fits in our cars fine - I believe it's the smallest footprint of any rear facing seats and should go in most cars.

It was £200 - as expensive as 4 tanks of petrol - and it should fit DD until she's 4 rear facing and then up to 6 forward facing (can only rear face until their head reaches the top of the seat). I've seen prams/buggies much more expensive than that and you don't use them for as long.

The one we have has to touch the seat in front - in our car it's behind the driver's seat but could also go at the other side. We did try other types but couldn't fit them in - some are massive and you need to leave a gap between the car seat and the front seat. I think some people put them in the front passenger seat - not practical for most families though.

DD's never been forward facing and we've never had a carsickness issue with her. She's only 19 months so we don't have a problem of her legs being uncomfortable - if she didn't want to cross them she could put them over the sides of the seat I think.

I remember being in the back seat of my parents' cars when I was little (no car seats then!). Couldn't see anything facing forward from behind the front seats either. I think you can see just as much out of the side windows and I've got a mirror in the middle of the back seat to see what she's up to.

DD's quite small so she was in her first car seat until she was about 14 months and at 19 months is still less than the 13kg weight limit for that one. I did the research and decided it was safer for her to rear face.

Frozennorth not for us anyway, dd is as tall as a 4 year old and would not be comfortable I am afraid. What about those toddlers or preschoolers who are on the tall side. My nephew when he was 2 was as tall as a 4/5 year old (not fat as he does not eat much and runs about all the time, just big boned) so would not be suitable for kids like him.

I think it would be the constant vomiting and screaming (which stopped when we moved to forward facing) that would put me off.

Anyway we only do local driving as dh does not like driving much so not really worth it as we dont go in the car much imo, anyway dd is 3 so too late really now we have our car seats, fine for those who are new mums expecting their first children.

I think it is because they are hard to find. My DD (3.8) is in a rear facing car seat. We have a Volvo and it is a Volvo car seat. She is absolutely fine in it. She is much more able to keep stuff on her little lap rear facing and her stuff doesn't fall on to the floor. Plus her and her older sister are facing each other so can chat much easier. And she can still look out of the window, and the back window too so sees stuff that the rest of us don't see.

Bottom line, I read the statistics and saw that Volvo sell one so decided it was the right thing to do (for us). We got it last year so moved her from a front facing seat to this one and she was 2.10. She was fine. And she never feels sick. My older forward facing drama queen daughter always feels sick ... journeys are a joy with her.

The car seat will turn around and become forward facing. Thinking might do that when she becomes 4 ...

sorry or new dads too

Huge difference from a 19 month old baby to a 2.5 year old toddler.

Would the risk of DVT be more of an issue worry on a medium to long journey?

How old is you child at present?

PS: the Nordic countires thing is nonesense, have friend in Sweeden, not many have theses seats!

I think it needs a massive culture change, and there is not that much information out there about them. A lot of people dismiss the idea without really considering it, and taking into account that what is comfortable for a child is not the same as what is comfortable for an adult.

• Discomfort - scrunched up legs for anything other than a short journey would lead to whinging

• Boredom via not being able to see what's going on very well - again, the whinging.

• DVT risk on anything like a long journey?

• Sleeping on longer journeys? Again, discomfort would prevent this

I know none of these stand up, compared with the worse risks. But - why is it OK for a 5 year old and adults to be forward-facing, but not a 4 year old? Genuine question.

However I think that there should be far more options in the mainstream shops for those parents who do want rear facing car seats. We would probably buy one if we were first time parents, but forking out £150 for our current car seat no we just cannot afford one and dd is 3.2 anyway.

1. Travel sickness is worse when facing away from direction of travel.

1. Making my 2 YO, who is the same height as a 3.5 year old, sit with his legs crossed like that for more than about 15 minutes is not something I want to do to him. You can yabber all you want about it being comfortable for children but I can tell you it's not bloody good for them, anatomically. AAnd I do happen to know what I'm talking about in that regard.

1. Ditto to making him stare at a seat back for more than 5 minutes - how boring for him, and how annoying for me when he whinges.

1. I like being able to see his face. I hated the baby seat when I couldn't see him.

Is that enough reasons or shall I think about it for another 60 seconds?

i'm with with dinky and hazeyjane re vomit / scream experience.

where i live it is common to see children bouncing around unrestrained.

Here is the Volvo car seat... miles more room than the one the OP linked to.

Lots of room for feet and legs and no risk of DVT!!

I also have Swedish friends and they say they are much more hte norm there ... so guess it is like most things carocaro, very hard to generalise!

"pigletmania, I personally feel that paralysis via internal-decapitation is less good for bones than squashed legs"

What alarmist bullshit. You should feel ashamed of that sentence.

5DollarShake - because little ones' necks aren't as strong to withstand a crash. Forward facing the neck takes the brunt of the impact. Rear facing the impact is absorbed by whole body. It is actually safer for all of us to travel backwards but not practical, so they say up to 4 years old the neck is at its flimsiest (my words, not theirs!) and after that age it is a bit stronger.

The statistics Volvo give are that in the event of a crash, a small child is 5 times more likely to either suffer serious injury or death if it is forward facing. Having read that, and we could afford it at that time, and we have a Volvo it would fit in, and were about to go on a mammoth journey, I couldn't go "ah well, probably won't happen". Would never ever have forgiven myself if we had been in a crash and something terrible had happened. Would always have been thinking "what if we'd bought that car seat".

Again, in DD's car seat (average height 3 year old), there is plenty of room and she can chat to her sister, look at books, do colouring, and she doesn't whine or feel sick.

I think that the Volvo rearfacing carseats look much better designed, the child looks more comfortable, not sure about the other designs where the legs are all crossed, ok for short journes, but for long no no. Is there any research into the health affects of sitting in such a position for a sustained amount of time.

Yes I would rather my DD survived a car crash than feel sick in the car. However the fact that she vomited in her rear facing seat on long and short journeys (which she has yet to do in her front facing seat) would mean that we would avoid going in the car anywhere if we still used one. No trips to grandparents, friends or family. So for us it wouldn't work.

I agree with you Bramshott - it tends to get people pretty defensive because everyone wants to feel they are doing / have done the best for their kids with the available information and having made the right choice for their family circumstances. However, without a culture change, I'm always going to be seen as a bit odd for chosing one of these seats even though it was the right choice for us.

I don't think the seats are 'right' for everyone because, as evidenced above, there are other considerations beyond safety when chosing a seat. But it would at least be nice for people to have the choice of forward / rearward facing up to an older age when they walk into a high street shop selling car seats.

Re: the DVT risk, I don't know about that - I'd imagine it's a small risk because the average toddler isn't usually in a high risk category to start with. What I do know it that motor vehicle crashes are the the top cause of death for children between the ages of one and 14 in the UK - it was this that prompted me to spend the extra money on a car seat.

pigletmania I agree I don't like the scrunched up crossed legged one. I think it maybe comes down to the kind of driving you do. We do very little short journey driving (live in a town with everything accessible by foot) so most of it is long and I wouldn't want her scrunched up like that for 5+ hours say.