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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

If i had done what a horrible mum did to her child, to her, i would be up on an assault charge.

95 replies

LEMneedsaholiday · 16/04/2010 18:11

I was in the sweet shop with DD yesterday, we are after chocolate . Mother was with her child with her dodgy looking geezer hanging around outside the shop. Her DD must have been about 18m, so she was obviously going to head for the sweets - which were at her level - her mother was buying cigarettes - growled "leave it" and when she reached out for the sweets she pushed her backwards by her head, quite hard so she fell back. I really wanted to do it to her - and then ask her how she liked it, but of course if i had, i would probably been arrested.

Why is this OK? Well its obviously NOT ok, but in the eyes of the law?????

OP posts:
Adair · 17/04/2010 09:24

I know. I agree, you were there. Totally agree it sounds horrible. I was smiling sympathetically at a mum with a cheeky toddler (18mths-2?) the other day (while thinking 'just pick her up' though who knows? maybe she couldn't) til she leant down and pinched the tiny toddler behind the knee. Horrible and unexpected. Couldn't hide my distaste -she looked embarrassed. But should I have said something?

Re reins - am not massively anti. Just can't see me using them.

AliGrylls · 17/04/2010 19:46

What I think is wrong is the assumption that any parent that may try to discipline their child by smacking is being abusive to their children - not all parents who smack their children are abusers, although most of you seem to think they are. There is a difference between smacking (which is actually done relatively gently) and beating.

Also, I am sure most parents are at their strictest when they are out as this is where the most dangers are present, ie, wondering off, running into the road, pulling something unsafe on their heads.

If a child is too young to remember what naughty things they did when they were out at the shops it would be mean to then say "you can't have x,y,z because today you did this" at a later stage during the day. They won't remember. They won't have a clue what you are talking about.

The other alternative is that you completely forget about the consequence you threatened and then the child is not getting any consistency or discipline at all.

For a consequence to be effective it should be immediate. For all of you who have never smacked the sequence goes something like this:

First warning - don't do that + explanation.
Second warning - I told you not to do that + explanation and if you do it again you will get a smack (ie, consequence)
Third time - mummy told you not to do that - enforce the consequence, ie, a smack on the back of the legs not too hard but just enough to shock them into behaving.

You will note that a smack is NOT the first option. Also, if I were to implement it, it would not be my first choice of consquence. If you are at home you have more options available.

mybabywakesupsinging · 17/04/2010 20:46

Some children are more resistent to being told "no" and getting a consequence (being put in buggy), then changing their behaviour, than others.
Some children - and parents - use the "naughty" step as a calming down zone (no toys around), not a punishment.
Some children only need to be looked at in the wrong tone of voice and they crumple into tears - my little sister - my Mum had a big change in parenting style to make for her after me and my pesty brother...
I agree with the OP that assuming it was on purpose that was an unacceptable thing to do. But I wouldn't judge a parent who decided that a smack was all they could use in a difficult situation, because I don't know their children.

Ds1 loved reins! we lived amoung very busy roads, so they gave him nearly-freedom to walk everywhere from 18 months, and as he is on the clumsy side, spared him a lot of falls, too. Haven't needed them for ds2 as the traffic is much much lighter where we live now.

CirrhosisByTheSea · 17/04/2010 20:50

the smack is simply not necessary. With young kids the consequence needs to be something logically related - it's easy enough; as in "I told you not to touch that, if you do it again you will have to sit in the buggy"
etc etc etc

I have never yet, ever, seen a justification for a smack that is actually a justification
There is always another way that does not involve the utter illogicality of hitting your child. It just takes a bit more thought. Just a little.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 21:25

My self and a lifelong friend have only ever had cross words over 'parenting'. I suppose that's because everyone likes to think they have it right.

I have smacked both of my children for running into the road and for being disobedient. I don't smack my eldest at all ever now. I don't need to.

I didn't smack because it was about danger ie the whole if they run into the road thing. I did it because what they were doing at that moment was totally unacceptable to me & my ways. I have a very short fuse and we are generally a very loud & loving family.

But I genuinely don't think I am abusing my children. I am teaching them that if you do that there are consequences and rather than ruin my precious time with them sodding about with a norty step I would rather do the shorter punishment and smack or with my DS who is 7, send to his room and mean it or take something away etc. This takes time as well and life is too short.

My parenting is haphazard but again, we are a big loving family and encourage sharing, talking and generally being together and enjoying the company of each other as a family and with tons of friends who share pretty much my views on bring up your children. You do your best.

I think reins are good too, but my DD wasn't having any of it. She got 'plugged in alot' (the buggy)

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 21:28

I meant to say that I agree with AliGrylls

barnsleybelle · 17/04/2010 22:31

Mrs crafty " I did it ( smacked them ) because what they were doing was totally unacceptable to me and my ways "
But your " ways " mean it is acceptable to smack another person ?

If your dp/dh etc decided that your behaviour was unacceptable would you think it reasonable he smacked you to show you the error of your ways?? I doubt it very much.

I have joined many smack or to not smack threads and i have never once heard anything said that is proper justification for smacking.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 22:42

Barnsleybelle, you are probably right.

We are talking about small people here, not adults. A smack from Mummy isn't the same as a quick slap round the face for Mummy from Daddy if the dinner ain't right.

I don't actually believe that talking for many minutes at a time for a preschooler (3) works either. It makes me bored and it really pisses them off as well.

What I am saying is that it's not in my nature to do that whole boring lets try this or that when I was bought up by perfectly decent by my parents who smacked as well. To really get on this subject. I had to ask my parents if they smacked me. They did. I couldn't remember any of it. It wasn't a beating, it was a short sharp shock.

I know you don't agree but as I said at the beginning of my first post on this. Me & a lifelong friend disagreed on this for the very first time. I thought she was smacking too hard............

CirrhosisByTheSea · 17/04/2010 22:45

You don't have to talk for many minutes at a pre schooler to be giving them consequences or 'discipline'. It's not either smack, or talk for many minutes/not have any control/not give boundaries

I agree with you barnsley - there IS no justification for hitting someone

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 22:47

I should have said decently. There is no edit on here.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 22:50

Well I have to disagree. I really appreciate my time with my children and don't want to take up too much time with this.

I have tried it, I didn't like it and I like my way of doing things.

But I will agree that it's not for everyone. That is fine too

barnsleybelle · 17/04/2010 22:51

MrsCrafty " we are talking about small people here, not adults " exactly, children need to be guided in the right direction without a short sharp shock. I have an 8 year old and a 2.5 year old and we have got along perfectly using other methods. When my 8 year old first saw a little boy having his leg smacked he was horrified.

It's strange how many mums who smack use the adage that they were smacked too and couldn't remember it, so it's ok for me to do it.

Oh and for what it's worth i don't consider smacking abuse. I've seen enough child abuse through my job to know the difference.

GlastonburyGoddess · 17/04/2010 22:54

since when did sending a child to their room for an "extended" period of time become child abuse??

yanbu about your post, Prob would have said something myself that would of shamed/embarrassed the mother eg ohhh are you ok little one?? to the child on the floor.

barnsleybelle · 17/04/2010 22:58

glastonbury..... you are confused.
Mrs Crafty made a comment that she didn't think she was abusing her children by smacking them.
Although i abhor smacking i was agreeing with her entirely. It had nothing to do with sending a child to their room.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 22:58

Do you ever take into consideration that I am not as patient & understanding as you are?

I am to an extent, but I, me don't want to be sodding around with norty steps/pillowcases. I just don't.

What suits you, doesn't suit everyone. I was really concerned about this in the early days of my first child, but I have learned about me too. This is how I parent my lovely children.

Are you saying I am wrong? I am not saying you are. You might just have a bit more time or patience than me and goodness knows, fair play to you on this.

We all parent our children differently and if you say I am a crap parent for the way I am doing it, then because it's written down, you must be right.......Gosh, but that is really flipping judgemental.

barnsleybelle · 17/04/2010 23:03

MrsCrafty... so by admitting you are not as patient as a non smacker you are confirming that the smack is about your own self control rather than the childrens actual behaviour.

So if you lost your patience with a neighbour or work colleague would you smack them or would you be able to control yourself ??

Im sorry to disagree but i just don't understand how a mother can ever justify smacking her child, i want to understand but so far and lots of threads over the years noone ever has convinced me.

GlastonburyGoddess · 17/04/2010 23:07

Im not confused, that comment was aimed at AliGrylls who said- Why do you assume that smacking a child is more abusive than sending a child to their bedroom / sitting on the naughty step for an extended period. All punishments have the potential to be abusive.

How is that abusive and how could that be considered more abusive than smacking

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 23:16

Not at all, by 'admitting', errrr what am I admitting to.......

I am just suggesting that not everyone wants to carry out the things that you do.

I have friends whose children have to sit on the norty step for every minute of their lives and they then end up back on it.

I don't particularly care either, I am just expressing my right to bring up my children as I see fit, as I expect you are.

I bet both sets of children will be equally lovely and well mannered at school. It will not be because I smacked or you didn't. It will because we both care.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 23:20

Yes, actually you have it there. I am saying that I am not the perfect parent.

I have no trouble saying that. I am not. I try but I expect that I fall very much below your views on this.

However, I don't particularly think I am abusing my children.

barnsleybelle · 17/04/2010 23:22

I am not suggesting you don't love or care for your children by any means. Neither am i implying that i love/care for mine more. I also firmly beieve you have the right to bring up your children your own way. I too am not suggesting your children will be anything other than well mannered well adjusted children.

I am only saying that i don't agree with you that the smacking of children is an ok thing to do.

MrsCrafty · 17/04/2010 23:25

OK. Thank you.

GOODASGOLD · 17/04/2010 23:56

I think that whichever way you do it your children will mirror you. I like to think of myself as setting an example to them rather than disciplinning them. It's only common sense. I never hurt my children or use naughty steps or time outs or banishments. I treat them with respect and they treat me with respect accordingly. If anybody is not doing this they should try, because it is easy and more fun, and works. REALLY CHILDREN COPY THEIR PARENTS. As for the mum pushing her dds head...

MrsCrafty · 18/04/2010 00:00

Goodasgold.

I like your style.

Sadly, I am not there for alot of the time so I have had to agree my parenting with OH, CM and myself.

Having said that. I would be just like you if I were there all of the time.

marytontie · 18/04/2010 00:20

Ali I agree.
I gave my 3 and a half year old "time out" closed in another room . 2 minutes. He was hysterical, terrified and wet himself.
I will never do time out again. Very cruel

GOODASGOLD · 18/04/2010 00:41

I work full time in the city. If your dh or cm do not agree with you find another cm and talk to your dh. Do not allow your children to be bullied by adults, this is teaching them to become bullies.

I say this as somebody who has always been respectful of her own children, who finds that they respect me back. So easy, so FUN.