to suspect this guy is a scammer

[liamsdaddy]

I've been struggling to sell my wifes old car recently (anyone want an nice little Auto Corsa?) since we decided we only needed one car (I now work within walking distance of my home).

So we stuck it on Exchange & Mart - only had one response so far, a person who said he would arrange collection. He wanted to pay us via PayPal, which is a service I trust about as much as the average politician.

I stated that if he wanted to use that method, he would have to wait for the funds to clear into our account before I would release the keys (I don't trust that he wouldn't send the money, I release the keys and then put a dispute in with PayPal to hold the money, potentially leading to us loosing both car and money).

So he has now replied that he would do a bank transfer if we give him our Bank Name, Account Number, Bank Code, Iban Number, etc.

AIBU to think that this is looking just a little bit dodgy?

after your later post i'd also now say it sounds dodgy.

Iban number is what you use to transfer money internationally. International Bank Account Number

Can't he just do a cashiers cheque.

I would be worried as to why he

1] seems to want it without viewing it
2] wants to pay you indirectly

Just don't take it any further. Sounds odd and it's best to err on the side of caution with something like this.

My husband sold his Lotus Elise last year through Petrolheads. A guy got in contact almost right away from Jersey & wanted to buy immediantly as he was a collecter. He paid through IBAC & the money was in our account 2 hours later! He then arrived 2 days later to collect!

why would anyone from overseas want to buy a second hand Corsa that they've never seen?!

Trust your instinct.

Sounds like one of those dodgy Nigerian scams to me.

And why would he give you his money and expect to wait for it all to clear and that you will still around with the keys.

Look at it from his point of view.

He is trying to pay you!!! Maybe he doesnt want to carry cash around and risk being mugged. And maybe he cant get that amount of cash out of the bank in one go.

Give the guy a break. Not everybody is a con artist.

Bigbadmummy - would YOU buy a car in, say, Dallas that you'd never seen and just send the owner that you'd never met a couple of grand? Seriously, would you?

OP - just Google 'selling car' and 'scam' and you'll see this is textbook.

the 'buyer' will 'accidentally' wire you too much money, you'll be asked to return the excess...and, in the meantime, the bank transfer will be discovered as fraudulent and your bank will remove the funds.

ie - you'll be about £400 or so out of pocket.

COuld you also say to him that, because you are worried about fraud, you are expecting the right amount to go into the bank account. If he pays any more than that you will take that as an indication that he believes the car to be worth more than the price and that you will not provide any refund, even if he pays double what the car is nominally worth.

Not sure if there is any way that this can be worded into the contract so the price you agree is the minimum amount payable rather than the exact amount so there isn't any comeback.

Sort of like those parking ticket or bus ticket machines that make you pay an exact amount and if you don't have the right amount, then you have to put in more and forfeit the difference... Just on a bigger scale. Then if he is planning on scamming you for this reason he might think twice about it.

And regarding giving out bank details - well if you give a cheque to someone, yes, you are giving them account number and sort code but you are also paying for something and getting something for it. Whereas in this case it is just giving to to somebody who asks for it in a situation that has a lot of scams running in these same scenarios, so it is wise to be hyper cautious.

Flight, I don't know why my post confuses you. criminals needs to launder money, to do this they pass it thru bank accounts of innocent people. They will send you money for the car, they will send you far more than was required, they will then ask you to send some of the money on to a different ac. The money then becomes legitimate. Its called 'layering" the original funds may come from abroad/criminal activity. In certain instances the funds are stolen and can be recalled.
If they need your iban number it indicates the buyer is abroad & will not be legitimate.

He only need's your IBAN for international payments. Otherwise a account number and sort code should suffice.

Thanks for explaining, Uggmum...Iwas thinking of UK bank transfers, which I've always been told by my bank are really safe.

I didn't know about laundered money being recalled.
Thanks.

Also, if he has never seen the car and may not pick it up in person, how on Earth can you update the logbook details with the DVLA?

When I sold my old car, it was cash on collection and I wrote out the new DVLA details in the log book, got them to sign it then posted it myself so I knew the change of ownership had been registered!

If you sell a car and the DVLA details are not changed to the new owner's name and address then you are still legally liable for the vehicle!!!

I would not proceed with this buyer.

Zondra
Selling a specialist car is a different matter. We have sold two classic cars unseen but I am assuming that the Corsa is not a particularly rare example, so it makes little sense to buy unseen.

sounds like a scam to me..... ask him to wire the money via a western union transfer

lol

People have had money put into their accounts for money laundering, and of course, if he has some accomplice in the UK who arrives with a gun, who's not going to give them the cash.

If it was someone in the UK, then sort code and account number should be enough. If the car is nothing special (like a collector would expect to pay significant sum for) then it sounds far from clear cut.

Under some circumstances it would be possible to find the IP (Internet Protocol) address and work backwards to find which country (and even which ISP) the sender was in. Even that might be 'spoofed' if the person uses an open proxy (or a commercial proxy) to give the appearance of being in another country. I had been planning to suggest it may be worth examining the e-mail but if I send e-mail out on GMail, it does not show the IP address (some other mail services do, and within Google, it might be possible for them to have encoded the IP in the message headers, but as an end-user it is definitely not possible to get the IP).

Sorry, I'd consider treating this with suspicion, but without knowing the amount that it is being sold for, it would strike me as awkward to suggest accepting cash (unless the cash was to be handed over in a bank so you could pay it straight into your account and hand over the keys after it was accepted as legitimate currency by the bank).

I put my sort code and account number on invoices for my clients to make direct payments, but I've known all of them for years. If there had not been the IBAN request I think it would be acceptable but with that request I would feel justified in not going ahead, and either giving a 'brush off' response to e-mail or not responding to any further e-mails.

Unfortunately these days even a mobile or landline number can be used by someone from anywhere in the world (with voice over IP phone services), so a UK number does not guarantee it will be a UK resident.

For some time I had a phone number 029 2000 xxxx (Cardiff, in case you wonder) which diverted to the internet and voicemail if I was unavailable.