To think that dh's nights out "marketing" are not work?

[chickenwings]

My DH goes out 2 to 3 nights every week "marketing". This is his word for going out with clients and getting pissed. It drives me mental because he comes home late, totally sozzled and falls into bed half-clothed and snores. He says it is essential to him getting ahead and that he hates it but that it is an essential part of his job. He says he has to drink when he goes out because that is what is required. He does have a high pressure job in the City and says that this is the norm there but I am very doubtful. He spends about £400 a month "marketing" and generally he cannot claim this back on expenses.

Doesn't alcoholics anonymous have a section for the family of alcoholics? Might they be able to give you some support? Hanging on for years being unhappy for the sake of the children doesn't sound like much of a life.

If he ain't claiming it back, it ain't marketing....

Well I think you have to do something unless you want to carry on like this. It sounds dreadful tbh

You need to give him the shock of thinking he's going to lose you and the kids before he'll stop I suspect. Often people won't stop drinking until they have lost everything

"PS For me, divorce would make me feel like a failure and a traitor because I haven't stuck to my vows"

You're not a failure or a traitor, that's him. Do you really want your DCs growing up thinking that it's acceptable to go out half the week and come home drunk?

I'm not going to tell you to leave him or to stay but I do think you need to think seriously about what you want for you and your DCs.

Hmmmmm.

DH has to go out on jollies every so often to make contacts etc. It is an important part of his job, although it's certainly not a 3 line whip.

However:

1. He gets extra expenses paid (eg. if he has to get a travelcard into London as he works on the outskirts)
2. It's often a free bar
3. There is certainly no obligation to get pissed, or indeed to drink at all, and
4. he 'rations' these nights out so we can spend time together and I get a chance to go out. He has cut down a lot since DS was born - he has a LOT of contacts but I can't imagine him needing to go out that often to keep in regular touch with all of them.

I think your DH sounds like he's overegging the 'work' part and using it as an excuse to go out with the lads more often that is necessary. My DH often sees his contacts as things that are unrelated to work (leaving dos, birthdays etc.) and there's a definite distinction.

He is an alcoholic and although I appreciate it is an illness, I think you need to consider the impact on your children.

He is putting alcohol before his family.

Thanks for all your replies.

I really don't think he is sleeping with another woman. This is not because I don't think is not possible, but simply because I think he would rather spend his time drinking.

I have tried to shock him out of it by leaving (as previously mentioned) and more recently by explaining to him how depressed I have been and that he needs to change his ways ie spend less and stop drinking. He agreed to keep accounts but said he wouldn't give up drinking.

Luckily I don't think it impacts the kids lives any more because he now makes it into bed when he comes home. He is also very good with them at the weekends.

He says I need to accept the fact I can't go out just as he has accepted the fact that he is a "wage slave" and marketing is just part of the culture he works in. Even if he did a less high powered job with shorter hours (which I have suggested) he says he will never want to spend time "pottering" at home and would still go out eg to play footie with his mates.

Blah, blah, blah ...sorry, beginning to waffle! Will stop. Thanks again x

So he is telling you: You just need to accept that he's never going to want to spend time at home with you, never going to give you a break from the kids so you can go out, never going to stop drinking (to massive excess. And this is improved?). Even if his job didn't require this level of boozing (which it doesn't but let's say it does) he'd still not want to spend time with his family.

So he's completely selfish, doesn't see you as having any right to free time or independence, hides the finances from you, and it's obviously been bad enough in the past that you have actually left. And you are depressed as a direct result of living with him.

But apart from all of this, he's lovely?

He sounds very like my husband was a couple of years ago.

My DH is an alcoholic - now a year or so sober.

He still goes to many "marketing" things, and drinks sparkling water, it's nonsense to say that drinking is necessary.

However, even when DH did use marketing as his excuse for going out and getting trollied, he still used his work Amex.....

Oh, and now he's sober he actually does still go out quite a bit, but I don't mind in the slightest as firstly he doesn't come back drunk and when he is with me he is wonderful, happy, interested in life and generally a brilliant husband and father to be.

You know, you don't have to accept this as your lot.....

Chickenwings, I think it sounds an incredibly sad existence for you actually. Your husband gets to have his cake and eat it. What do you get out of this relationship.

The failure in your marriage is his, not yours. This is not an equal relationship in a happy marriage - this is a man who gets to live his single life and still come 'home' to his wife and kids when he chooses to.

I guess you need to weigh up what's important to you - a marriage built on meaningless vowes (at least to him), or your own happiness - and that of your children (they will be affected by this without a doubt).

I feel for you

£400 a month? That's a mortgage!!!!!!

He isn't nice to you, saying those things. I know it must be hard, but is it really fair on you and your DCs to be out all the time, spending money that could be going on making your lives a bit easier?

I'd leave him, even if I loved him. He has a drinking problem and maybe losing his family would be the impetus he needs to change- you can always go back once he has accepted that he has a problem and wants to do something about it. And i'd most certainly tell him that spending his own money on entertaining clients is not right- He needs to either stop it, or claim it back.

Sorry to be harsh- am very sad for you.

I've worked with guys where socialising, especially as they start out on their careers, was part of the job. However, every single penny spent was expensed.

Getting that drunk was never expected though - to be honest, if it was a long term situation, I would have thought it would be frowned upon, even among their friends. (Their work contacts often ended up being friends as they spent so much time together and it guaranteed business.) (I worked in Finance - they do NOT pay for it themselves if part of the job.)

I think your husband is a functioning alcoholic (or scarily close), and that deep down he knows this "work" story is nonsense, which is why he is now hiding the receipts.

If I really had to give him the benefit of the doubt re work, he could stop drinking when out for a couple of weeks, saying he is on antibiotics. And then switch to water or coke etc. Or he could just be an adult and say he's cutting down when asked.

I really feel for you, as I think he doesn't want to be helped, and I don't know what way out there is for you if that's the case. But in answer to your OP - he's bullshitting. Sorry.

Chickenwings - please don't think your children won't notice. They will. Especially as they get older.

My fathers death at the age of 41 was directly caused by alcohol abuse. His funeral was one week before my wedding.