To want to speak up about my niece...

[deliakate]

my brother and sil have just had a baby, she is two months younger than my DS. And I just know this baby has been hungry since birth.

She was born quite big, lost a lot to begin with, and now at 4 months she has only put on around 3lb in weight in her life. SIL has been insisting on exclusively breastfeeding her. She was feeding her just one breast in the morning and expressing off a load of milk to use later for the evening feed (presumably, because she didn't have enough milk at that time, I don't know). So the baby was crying ALL day long, and I mean all day.

Its so obvious its hunger. I spoke to my brother at xmas and mentioned that the expressing thing seems to be taking milk away from baby at the time when its being produced (ie when she needs it, as with demand feeding), and perhaps they should stop. I think they have now stopped it, and are doing the evening feed with formula.

Its very awkward, as sil is very sensitive. And she has made comments to me before about not wanting to overfeed the baby - eg when I babysat for her, I gave her two pots of expressed milk. The baby stopped crying and went to SLEEP. And she went mad, saying I'd doped her up on milk, and she was too young to have that much etc etc. My thoughts are that you cannot over feed a breastfed baby, and certainly for a newborn, the whole idea is to feed them up until they sleep. They should feed or sleep for much of the time until 3 months or so, not CRY all day!

I think they are sorting it now - but what would you do? Would you have said more before now? Would you approach sil directly??

My ds was born on the 96th centile. He steadily dropped to the 50th by the time he was 6 months - it raised no alarm for my HV at all.

I don't think it's 'obvious' that it's hunger at all. It could be reflux causing the crying, or some sort of food intolerances from mum. If you genuinely want to help you need to put aside the notion that exclusively BF babies are obviously hungry if they cry. I wouldn't 'do' anything tbh but listen and support.

Well, it is a very very strong feeling I have, then.
Sil objects to a very young baby being 'drunk' on milk. My ds was doped up all the time by her definition, and the midwives etc used to laugh at him lolling about falling asleep. I thought that was what you did with little tiny ones, that is kind of their life at first. And pooing, obv.

Not quite sure why people are being so hard on Kate here. She hasn't said anything to SIL but the one time she looked after the baby and fed it til it was full and sleeping SIL was angry that she had over fed.

That does seem strange behaviour on the part of SIL to me.

Mine was born on the 50th and then steadily dropped to the 2nd which she has followed ever since. Most HV's were fine, they knew her and knew there were no other issues. One new HV paniced and refered us to the hospital. The consultant took one look at the little monkey trying to eat his thermometer and said that he had no idea why we'd been sent. As long as there wasn't a drop in weight and there were plenty of wet nappies he had no concerns at all.

The crying all the time could possibly be a concern, and if they aren't already seeing a HV/GP then I think it probably would be an idea to check there are no underlying problems, but hunger wouldn't be my automatic assumption.

If you say that the baby is fed frequently throughout the day then I am not sure why it's 'obvious' she is hungry?

Agree however that the comments about doping baby on milk are strange.

Also I don't think it's 'normal' for babies to cry all the time. There must be something wrong??

My son was born on the 9th centile and dropped to below the 0.4th centile so literally off the chart he was readmitted to hospital and tests done to make sure all was ok which it was just me not latching him on properly.He put on weight very slowly and stayed below the chart until he was about 9 months old where he varied between the 2nd and 9th centile.
He was always a happy content baby didn't cry much. incidently now at 5 he is again below the 0.4th centile! but not concerned at all.
Is she of the thinking that a baby should be put down to sleep awake? or risk sleep problems later on maybe.
Do you tend to use words like 'drunk on milk' and she is reacting to your language perhaps.
Sorry just me thinking out loud.

Does the baby actively look underweight? Do you not see or hear him swallowing? Could it be as simple as him not latching on properly? This happened to a friend and luckily was eventually picked up by HV and friend managed to sort it out and carry on bf and it all came good. I had had worries and said nothing and felt awful later that I had said nothing, despite the fact it did turn out well, it might not have done. In that case incidently child was very quiet and not crying all the time at all. Bf and weight is so emotive it is easy to see why OP is dithering.

Maybe talk gently to your brother again? see what his feelings are, he will have a better idea of what is happening and presumably is less likely to take offense as he will know you are asking because you care about him and his family.

I think it sounds odd from what you say tbh. Her reaction to you feeding and the baby asleep contented and comments about the milk overfeeding.

YOU are there and in the situation. You obviously have an instinct. Can you have a chat with your brother at all?

YANBU
Have I read this right - this baby has gained 3lb in four months since birth, the mother 'restricts' feeding by only offering one breast (albeit expressing from the other) and was upset when the OP gave her 2 bottles and she was asleep, and uses comments like 'doped up on milk'?

There is a problem. BF and weight is such an emotive thing but my DS was starved for the first two months (unwittingly - I did everything right to increase supply but found out later I have malfunctioning boobs) he cried a lot and I would have eaten the head of anyone who suggested I wasn't doing the right thing for him. I know how hard it will be to broach this but I agree the DB is the one to start with. What the OP is describing isn't right.

I have also seen a good friend's DD stop thriving from 3-4mo while she was exbfing - no idea why the first 2 months were ok but my goodness it was hard to watch. Ended up encouraging her to wean at 4mo () as she wouldn't give FM and the mite was starving. I know how hard it is to watch but you can't stand by and watch babies fail to thrive can you?

It may be as simple as she has had bad advice re restricting breasts and/or the baby has a poor latch meaning she's not getting much milk which are correctable, but if the SIL is actively restricting milk intake then something needs to be done - somehow.

The bit about feeding from one breast in the morning and expressing off from the other breast for the night feed sounds very like Gina Ford. I wonder if she is trying to follow GF and got stressed when you babysat because the baby was sleeping at the "wrong" time and had drunk the milk at the wrong time?
If so she'd be better off ditching the GF and just going with the flow. I doubt she'd appreciate being told that though!

She is feeding on demand for most of the day and has stopped the expressing business.She is presumably seeing the HV (as she knows her DDS weight gain) and she is gaining albeit slowly.
I would feel very irritated if a know-it-all mother of ONE started pontificating at me !
The not wanting her doped up on milk sounds like she is trying to get her to sleep a bit more at night and a bit less in the daytime.

It does sound Gina Ford - I have read the CLB - but I know they are not following that. I think the idea was to have more milk to be able to give baby in the evening than she was getting naturally.

Princess, what a ridiculous comment. I haven't pontificated 'at' her, in fact I've never even spoken 'to' her of my concerns.

On that subject though, I do think swapping advice is kind of what mums are meant do. No man is an island and all that. Its human nature.

Sil gives me advice regularly, and I listen politely with gratitude for the spirit in which it was intended.